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Pathfinder:Kingmaker Minimal and No Reload Thread (spoilers, obviously)

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  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    @EnialusMeliamne , : "My thanks to you as well, my trusted advisor and friend." <offers you gold in outstretched palm> "Would you consider becoming one of my most trusted advisors in my fledgling barony, alongside Ronaldo? I will reward you well, to the best of my ability. Only tell me what you need, and I will do my best to provide it, here in our humble outpost." <smiles and looks at you quizzically with raised eyebrows>:

    EnialusMeliamneronaldoDrHappyAngry
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    @DrHappyAngry , : "I would also welcome you as a most trusted advisor as well. <bows and offers you ten gold in outstretched palm> "I am embarrassed that my lack of wealth presently precludes me from offering to the three of you what you are truly worth. I give you my oath as Baron of Harmondale that I shall pay and reward you as you deserve, if the four of us together can lead this barony, and my friends to success. I humbly welcome and consider the advice of my new advisors.":

    ronaldoDrHappyAngry
  • EnialusMeliamneEnialusMeliamne Member Posts: 399
    edited April 2019
    *the heavily armored warrior bearing the holy symbol of Iomedae bows his head in grace. An attuned and learned listener would hear one of the tenets of Iomedae’s faith in response*. “I am the first into battle, and the last to leave it. Baron, you have my sword”

    OOC (oy vey, the edit): And...I guess it’s time to re-download the game. What’s another 400+ hours of gaming?!

    BelgarathMTH
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    @EnialusMeliamne , LOL, you just made my Saturday night. If my enjoyment of this game can inspire someone who's played it more to revisit and find renewed enjoyment in it, then I think that's just totally awesome, man! :)

    EnialusMeliamne
  • EnialusMeliamneEnialusMeliamne Member Posts: 399
    In retrospect, maybe I should have left the IC reference (an error since corrected), since i am typing under an avatar and username! Alas...

    Anywho, enough time has passed that I can probably overlook the things that really annoyed me about the game. Reading this thread definitely planted a seed which is now germinating into a very long download session. 😳 Later tonight, it’ll be time to create another Paladin. Cheers!

    BelgarathMTH
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    ronaldo wrote: »
    "I live to serve" :) I am on my second playthrough now. My first was with a Paladin as I always do with my first playthroughs. This time is with a sorcerer. I also bought the dlcs recently and just finished the Varnold one and imported the ending into the main game. I am excited to see how it effects the main game.

    @ronaldo , Would you care to post some run reports here? Or do you prefer to reload with impunity without sharing it? Asking for a friend. ;)

  • DrHappyAngryDrHappyAngry Member Posts: 1,424
    This thread made me fire up a save of mine I had going before I took a break from the game. I'm not going no/minimal reload, since I'm playing on challenging, and there's a lot of fights that can easily result in perma-death with one bad roll. The character I'm playing probably wouldn't be a bad choice for a no reload game with it's crazy high saves. I'm doing an Aasimar Paladin 2 -> Inquisitor with Shelyn for my deity. I'm eventually intending to abuse Cornugon smash with that big bonus inquisitors get to intimidate.

    EnialusMeliamneBelgarathMTH
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    edited April 2019
    I think the hunting DC varies depending on what map you are on, but is lower on the world map. If I had to guess I would say it's about 15 on the world map and about 20 on the sycamore map, but you only get attacked if you fail by 5 or more, otherwise the hunter tries again. You can assign a second character to help the hunter for +2. Note that you don't need to fill every slot - you can do without a cook for example. Linzi has a rest skill that boosts the skill roll for everyone, but she aint in your party.

    If you are in territory you control you can assign the baron to look for food using the "special ability" slot, in which case you don't need a hunter.

    This is the sort of game where it makes sense to adjust your party depending on your objective. If you are hunting trolls then take someone skilled in hunting trolls. If you want to deal with barbarians, it helps to have one on your side. If you discover your enemy is only vulnerable to a certain type of damage then take someone who is good at dealing that type of damage. If you are up against the undead take extra clerics.

    Animal companions make great tanks (better than Brienne - sorry, Valarie in any case). Buff up their AC with Barkskin and/or Mage Armour. They also help you lug around more loot.

    NB there is another potential treasurer you can get in chapter 2, this one isn't a party member and is a bit tricky to recruit (he is more for evil barons). Plus one in "Wildcards". And there is another one you can get much later in the game.

    ronaldoEnialusMeliamneBelgarathMTH
  • ronaldoronaldo Member Posts: 263
    @BelgarathMTH I appreciate the offer but I am a major reloader... The random number generator for this game hates me. :(
    I'll continue to help you as I can. I had a thought about the perception skill. Some of the DC's for perception late in the game are very high. It would be smart to have one of the companions you are going to have in your party most of the time to be very skilled in it. Probably Tristian or Ekundayo. I would even go as far as to take the skill fous feats for that one companion to further boost that skill.

    EnialusMeliamneBelgarathMTH
  • bleusteelbleusteel Member Posts: 507
    edited April 2019
    Maegar Varn can also be treasurer.

    There’s another thing about this game that really divides the community. You said you didn’t mind spoilers but I’ll tag it just in case. Don’t read unless you want huuuge plot spoilers. I’ll nest one level so you can get the gist without the gory details unless you really want them.
    There are a few points where the game appears to make you choose between two mutually exclusive goals that have big consequences. I say “appears” because some can be worked around if you are quick enough. You can potentially lose party members or advisors permanently. Proceed at your own risk :-)
    First, Season of the Bloom wants you to choose between saving your capital and Jhod or hitting the source of the monsters and save Keston. If you are lawful (which you are, luckily), you can do both by making the lawful choice when Keston wants to run off by himself. If you aren’t lawful, you can save both by rescuing Keston first. Just keep him from being killed and then immediately hightail it to the capital.

    Second, Twice Born King wants you to choose between Amiri and Tristian. There is no dialog choice that allows you to keep both in the endgame (more on that later). To keep both, you need to chase Tristian and then immediately head to Amiri. Don’t rest - use spells to clear fatigue and exhaustion. When Amiri is sneaking into the barbarian camp, you can avoid confrontation and sisters by doing athletics checks to clear equipment racks out of your way. If you get to them fast enough you can save Nilak. This allows you to finish both Amiri’s and Tristian’s quests.

    Which leads to the Finale. When you enter the portal at the Castle of Knives, all of your companions get removed from the party. You can only get back the ones which have completed their personal quests. If you haven’t successfully completed their quest lines, they are gone forever.

    ronaldo
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    @bleusteel, Thanks for the courteous spoiler tag, there. When I said I didn't mind spoilers, I meant more advice about fights and party members and stuff like that. I don't think I want to know the ending of the story yet, so I chose not to click the spoiler for now.

    bleusteel
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    edited April 2019
    Aww, sadly, I just had to take a second reload. I was working on a ruined tower map, and almost finished when we ran into some super worgs with really high DR - We won, but it depleted all our spells, and Octavia and Tristian were fatigued. Our bags were also loaded. I decided we would have to trek back to the capital and come back.

    While I was trying to leave the map, I didn't go into stealth like I usually do because I thought I was leaving through cleared territory. I was wrong. I got too close to an unrevealed part of the map, and got ambushed by three trolls. There was no way for us to do this fight in our weakened condition, with no buffs or spells. I should have stood and fought anyway. We might have pulled out a win. But I decided to run. Big mistake. We can't outrun trolls, as it turns out. They got Octavia from behind. I was feeling really disheartened, and my morale broke. (Not in the game, I mean my morale broke as the player.) I took a reload.

    I was wrong before about trolls not needing to be finished with fire or acid. I must have had somebody doing fire or acid damage before without realizing it when I killed my first one. Most of these particular trolls have fire immunity though, so we're going to need to stock up on acid potions. I'm not sure there are any left in the capital. Octavia can use Acid Splash unlimited times as a finishing spell, though.

    It's really hard to travel overland. The game interrupted me with encounters including storybook adventures two times while I was trying to get back. The camping worked out well, though. Thanks for the tip about putting two people on hunting. I had not noticed that the different camp functions have two slots for people.

    Here's a classic Web-Fireball combo, just like in Baldur's Gate:
    t183ummjccuz.jpg

    My first encounter with fire-immune trolls. I was really afraid we couldn't handle these, but it turns out we can, with good, careful positioning and tactics:
    dsw8gqkx9171.jpg
    fprphimv3iag.jpg
    xd9cs1xvcgnf.jpg

    Party Level: 6
    Reloads: 2 (Wererat Cave, Troll Ambush)

    DrHappyAngryJuliusBorisov
  • DrHappyAngryDrHappyAngry Member Posts: 1,424
    Octavia's acid splash cantrip is a great finisher for the trolls, and you can sneak attack with it. She probably finished the troll before. There's a few weapons that deal acid damage that you can stumble across in this chapter, too.

    BelgarathMTH
  • ronaldoronaldo Member Posts: 263
    @BelgarathMTH I see you haven't heeded your advisors advice about adding Ekundayo to your team.... It is of course your decision though. :-)

  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    @ronaldo, I had to make it back to the capital before I could add him.

    So, I did start using Ekun and Dog, and I have a question. I can't find any way to see how Dog is doing with his health during combat, other than to go to Ekun's character screen, which gives me a portrait of Dog where I can read his hit points. I also have to go to Ekun's character screen to monitor Dog's buffs, debuffs, etc.

    That's horribly inconvenient during combat. Is there any easier way to do it? I think it might be a minor design flaw if it's really true that the only way to keep an eye on Dog is to go through Ekun's character screen.

  • ronaldoronaldo Member Posts: 263
    @BelgarathMTH That is an unfortunate thing about using dog. Just keep him buffed like any other character. Magic fang lasts a long time. If he goes down in battle he will always get back up and you can heal him then. I'm not sure if animal companions can actually die. It might depend on the difficulty though.

    BelgarathMTH
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    ronaldo wrote: »
    @BelgarathMTH That is an unfortunate thing about using dog. Just keep him buffed like any other character. Magic fang lasts a long time. If he goes down in battle he will always get back up and you can heal him then. I'm not sure if animal companions can actually die. It might depend on the difficulty though.

    Dog gets back up like any party member. I haven't seen what happens if he gets to negative numbers high enough to exceed his constitution.

    I don't let party members, including Dog, go down when I have so much access to healing. I need an on-screen way to see his health, but apparently there isn't one. He likes to run ahead and take aggro, and I don't seem to have control over what he does. (Or can I take control of him by clicking on him? I didn't see that I could.) That may be a deal-breaker for me. I am a very, very cautious and conservative party leader. I don't need Dog deciding for me when to start combat. That'll get people and dogs killed. We'll see.

  • ronaldoronaldo Member Posts: 263
    You should be able to direct where he goes by clicking on him. I always have pause on combat start on so I can direct all my characters on what to do. He is great against enemy squishies because he moves fast.

    EnialusMeliamneBelgarathMTH
  • DrHappyAngryDrHappyAngry Member Posts: 1,424
    When paused you can see hitpoint bars over heads. There's some options with showing hit point bars you can tweak with. Ya, it does suck the dog doesn't get a portrait at the bottom. If you go to the character screen (press C) you scroll over and see Dog at the bottom or click on him to see his sheet.

    Don't sweat it if Dog bites it. When pets get killed, they'll come back after a rest.

    In my current run, I've dumped 1 level into rogue with Ekun and grabbed the accomplished sneak attacker for an extra 2d6 sneak attack damage total.

  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    There is a wizard who can sell you lots of useful stuff for dealing with the trolls, such as wands of Acid Arrow.

    Acid splash is a great cantrip, and evil undead elves also get it.

    There is a spell for making animal companion's attacks acid.

    There is an acid greataxe you might find lying around.


    Technically, there are a couple of ways for dealing with trolls that don't require acid or fire, but spells like Disintegrate are a long way off for you yet.

    BelgarathMTH
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    When paused you can see hitpoint bars over heads. There's some options with showing hit point bars you can tweak with. Ya, it does suck the dog doesn't get a portrait at the bottom. If you go to the character screen (press C) you scroll over and see Dog at the bottom or click on him to see his sheet.

    Don't sweat it if Dog bites it. When pets get killed, they'll come back after a rest.

    In my current run, I've dumped 1 level into rogue with Ekun and grabbed the accomplished sneak attacker for an extra 2d6 sneak attack damage total.

    Dog doesn't get the hit point bar over his head on pause like my party does with my current settings. Maybe I can try tweaking my settings.

    As far as control, I probably just need more practice.

    I really want to use Ekun and Dog, because I like them, Ekun matches my alignment exactly, and Dog has AC 30 and is a beast in combat. Literally.

    Since I role play my character, I can't just let Dog keep going down every combat. I have to try to protect and heal him like any other party member. So I'd like to figure out a way to keep an eye on how hurt he is more conveniently than bringing up his portrait.

    I have some trouble in role play with druids and rangers sending their animal companions into combat and not caring if they get hurt. That just seems like a really anti-druid, anti-ranger thing to do.

    JuliusBorisovEnialusMeliamne
  • DrHappyAngryDrHappyAngry Member Posts: 1,424
    When paused you can see hitpoint bars over heads. There's some options with showing hit point bars you can tweak with. Ya, it does suck the dog doesn't get a portrait at the bottom. If you go to the character screen (press C) you scroll over and see Dog at the bottom or click on him to see his sheet.

    Don't sweat it if Dog bites it. When pets get killed, they'll come back after a rest.

    In my current run, I've dumped 1 level into rogue with Ekun and grabbed the accomplished sneak attacker for an extra 2d6 sneak attack damage total.

    Dog doesn't get the hit point bar over his head on pause like my party does with my current settings. Maybe I can try tweaking my settings.

    As far as control, I probably just need more practice.

    I really want to use Ekun and Dog, because I like them, Ekun matches my alignment exactly, and Dog has AC 30 and is a beast in combat. Literally.

    Since I role play my character, I can't just let Dog keep going down every combat. I have to try to protect and heal him like any other party member. So I'd like to figure out a way to keep an eye on how hurt he is more conveniently than bringing up his portrait.

    I have some trouble in role play with druids and rangers sending their animal companions into combat and not caring if they get hurt. That just seems like a really anti-druid, anti-ranger thing to do.

    Sorry, I have to hit tab while paused to get the health bar to show over him, although I've messed with some of the options to show those, so you might have to tweak with them.

    Although the dog can't equip any items to boost his AC, you can cast divine shield and bark skin on him. With Jubilost you can cast shield on him, too. If you buff him up, he can potentially have crazy AC. You might also try not having him charge into combat and let Val lead the charge.

    BelgarathMTHEnialusMeliamne
  • DrHappyAngryDrHappyAngry Member Posts: 1,424
    Ya, you can save the mage. If you let him keep the troll for experimentation, you can hire him as an advisor later on.

    bleusteel
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    Dog is almost as good a tank as my actual tanks.

    Almost? I've had animal companion AC up to 50! There is a setting to display animal companion health bars on pause. There are lots of useful tools in the options to get just the level of feedback you like.
    I think that an evil player might have been able to recruit these bandits as mercenaries for the barony. I like that this game appears to offer very meaningful differences in outcomes between good choices and evil choices.

    You would be correct. If you want to be really evil there is an option (if this is the group I am thinking of) to persuade them to murder one of their number then join you!
    Tonight's boss fight was against a troll who had been tortured by the mage we were looking for. Once I found the evidence for the torture, it didn't bother me as much that we had failed to save the now obviously evil mage, who wanted us to avenge him from his death at his victims' hands by attacking the troll base. He revealed its location to us with his last breath. I wonder if there was any other possible outcome where he could have been saved and invited into an evil barony?

    Yes, he can become treasurer, I think you need to be evil. He can also be saved if you tell him to stop torturing poor trolls and give up his wicked ways. In which case he is a useful merchant.

    bleusteelBelgarathMTH
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,133
    so apparently my file got corrupted ( from playing it on my friend's laptop ) and i had to start a whole new game today oi

    at least i was able to make some better decisions this time like NOT taking diehard ( the feat is god awful in this game ) and instead of wasting tons of time upgrading kingdom stuff, i just do the absolute bare minimum to get by without losing stats, so i suppose this play through is going by a lot better, started at level 1 today, and just finished growing to level 8 the time i quit ( gotta love playing games till 3:30 in the morning )

    bleusteelBelgarathMTHEnialusMeliamneronaldo
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    edited April 2019
    @sarevok57 , You went from levels 1-8 in a single play session? Wow. You must be a really focused player. I'm a slow, meandering, spend a lot of time studying stat screens and inventory,"smell all the roses" kind of player. I've got 52 hours in this first run, and I'm only level 6.

    @DrHappyAngry and @Fardragon . Well, I guess it sucks for me that I missed a chance to recruit yet *another* treasurer. Good thing I set the kingdom management on "invincible" and "effortless". I'm hoping I can still somehow get Jubilo or whatever that gnome's name is, after I discover the troll base. The mage that just got killed by trolls marked it on our map. Is that the time to report back to the gnome that we know where it is, or do I need to actually go there and complete the map first?

    I didn't get any of the dialogue options you mention. When I got to the evil mage, he was just lying on the ground dying, and he said nothing could save him now, please avenge him, and gave us the map location, then croaked. I wonder if it's a timed thing where we needed to somehow find him and kill those trolls faster or sooner, or if it's an alignment thing. Or maybe I just missed a dialogue option somehow, or gave a "wrong answer" to something.

    EDIT: I found this answer about Jubilost:

    "Jubilost won't immediately join your party. You will need to defeat the troll king and then inform Jubilost of the development and take him to the Dwarven Ruins.After inspecting the area, he will offer to join the party. After recruiting him, head back to the kingdom management screen and assign him to the role of treasurer. Besides helping your kingdom's economy, be on the lookout for occasional events to trigger as well while Jubilost is in the role of treasurer."

    At this link:
    https://software.intel.com/en-us/forums/2017-intel-level-up-game-developer-challenge/topic/797758

    Post edited by BelgarathMTH on
    EnialusMeliamneJuliusBorisovsarevok57
  • DrHappyAngryDrHappyAngry Member Posts: 1,424
    Ya, if that mage goes down during that fight, that's it, he dies. On challenging I've had him go down so fast I can't even get a single attack off. You can heal him during the fight, and as long as he doesn't drop, he'll survive.

    Since I'm a habitual reloader, I've never had Jubilost's wagon go down, so I'm not sure if you can recruit him yet. Since that ford's pretty close, I guess it couldn't hurt to check in and see if he'll come along.

    The mage can also work as a diplomat. There's also the Tiefling from the wildcards DLC that can be a treasurer. It's a bit tricky since you're supposed to go out to a dangerous area all by yourself. In a minimal reload run, it might make sense to waste the time going out there with your party, change out your party, do the area with her, and then swap your party back on the road, since it's super risky on those roads by yourself.

    BelgarathMTH
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,133
    @BelgarathMTH
    well, this is kind of a "3rd" play through for me

    the first play through i hit about level 9, then i was getting a bit bored and frustrated ( since i started on challenging and even upped a couple of things ) plus i had my kingdom set to auto, so i restarted my file

    for the 2nd play through ( the one that got corrupted from my friends laptop ) i put it on normal difficulty and even made a couple of things easier, and it was a much smoother go, and i didnt put the kingdom on auto this time, and i learned a lot from that, and that team was just about to hit level 11

    now on THIS play through, i set the difficulty stuff kind of in between normal and challenging which has been good so far and i've been able to fix a lot of devastating mistakes i made in my 2nd play through

    and i would say, the first 8 or 9 levels are relatively quick, but once you hit level 10 ( as far as im aware ) level advancement slooooooooooooooows down as the experience needed for level ups jumps monumentally

    plus when i play games, im the sort of player who "has people to see, things to do, places to get to" sort of thing, plus im very stingy on time management since there always seems to be a timer that you have to watch out for, even though it may seem you have ample time to do things, i make sure to squeeze as much as i can in what time i have, and right now, i think my play time is at 90 hours, first play through to level 9 was probably about 30, 2nd play through to almost level 11 was probably 50, and this one i think i probably only have around 10 or so hours on roughly

    BelgarathMTHEnialusMeliamneJuliusBorisov
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,538
    Postcards from Golarion:

    On the way back to the capital to sell loot, we visited Jubilost at the Ford. He's apparently camping out there with his trade consortium members trying to decide what to do while we look for his dwarven ruins. I think we know where the ruins are located, if that dying evil mage can be trusted. The ruins have been taken over by trolls. Jubilost still wants nothing to do with us, after we failed to save his goods from the river, until we can take him to the ruins to see it with his own eyes. Since I'm pretty sure the place is overrun with trolls, I asked him to please camp out there and give us some time to make the ruins safe again.

    The main reason I took this screen shot, really, was so you can see how beautiful running water looks in this game. You probably can't see it in the screen shot, but it shimmers and flows just like real water. It's almost like really being in the world of Golarion.
    92zs8ss78w5p.jpg

    I decided to explore and stake out territory for my barony on the way to the dwarven ruins, which are quite distant from my capital city, Tuskdale, in my fledgling barony of Harmondale.

    We encountered some lumberjacks having a dispute with some dryads. This was a hostage situation. The dryads had used their magic to hold two lumberjacks under water, and were threatening to drown them if their demands weren't met. There were two Diplomacy checks, and a Knowledge: World check here. I am building my character with maxed out Persuasion and Knowledge: World. I passed one of the two Diplomacy checks, and the K:W check. I was able to get the peaceful resolution, and I didn't even need to look for their MacGuffins myself. It was a very satisfying non-violent resolution for a role player.
    ombemglmajxb.jpgw3bconttr5lr.jpgjbrmtjye68tf.jpg

    @Arvia, I really think you'd like this game. The roleplaying opportunities for us lawful good types are better and deeper than I've seen in a game in a long time.

    Party Level: 6
    Reloads: 2 (wererat cave, troll ambush)

    EnialusMeliamneArviaJuliusBorisovsarevok57
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