Mods certainly extend the life of a game but if the base game is trash nobody will bother to mod it.
i would not really call shadowrun dragonfall or hongkong trash. it's just for some reason no one wanted to make modules for it. there is only like 1 series made for those and compared to say nwn it has nothing really in comparison.
it seems unless your a Bethesda game or the game already had an active modding community no one wants to mod it at all.
Just kidding, but if for then missing doesn't work, leveling is too slow, and spell slots is not intuitive, will the game change more the rules than SCL? Because SCL at least maintained the "leveling" aspect... You don't see lv 120 chars everywere.
@megamike15 While the Shadowrun level editors indeed didn't have the same impact as Bioware's or Bethesda's toolsets, there still are more fan created modules out there than for example Arcanum or Temple of Elemental Evil. Especially if you are counting those of Shadowrun Returns to the mix.
But, yeah.... I really do wish to see more custom content related to the lesser modded games out there. Drakensang being a prime example.
I think the biggest detractor is the graphics. I think better graphics make the game less immersive regardless of the actual complexity of the choices and the word.
That may sound counter-intuitive, but I truely believe it. The reason is it does not do as good as your imagination. D&D is an imaginative game, whether you play it with just dice and pencils, with miniatures or on the computer. I don't think 3D graphics add to that, they detract from it, replacing your imagination with the a graphics rendering.
When Minsc yells "Full Plate and Packing Steel" I can imagine what his face looks like while he runs into battle .... but I can't actually see it. In NWN or NWN2 for example I can actually see the character's faces and it is pretty bland.
Same with the scenery, NWN2 has for its day really good graphics, but it can't compare with the detail my imagination can build from the 2-D canvas used in BG.
So, my worst fear that the existence of this game is actually blocking further development of the EEs is confirmed. Why has Beamdog not made the Soultaker expansion for BG2 that they had planned? Why have they not added an npc pack for SoD npcs in BG2? WotC has blocked it because they want "Baldur's Gate" to mean the new game. NDAs may be involved, so no names.
Thanks WotC and Larian, you are actively killing Baldur's Gate. The REAL Baldur's Gate.
So, my worst fear that the existence of this game is actually blocking further development of the EEs is confirmed. Why has Beamdog not made the Soultaker expansion for BG2 that they had planned? Why have they not added an npc pack for SoD npcs in BG2? WotC has blocked it because they want "Baldur's Gate" to mean the new game. NDAs may be involved, so no names.
Thanks WotC and Larian, you are actively killing Baldur's Gate. The REAL Baldur's Gate.
the fact beamdog has not done anything bg related since sod came out 3 years ago. and they have been very hush hush about nwn ee development to as well.
the fact beamdog has not done anything bg related since sod came out 3 years ago. and they have been very hush hush about nwn ee development to as well.
In fairness - that isn't evidence. It's speculation.
So speculating then @ThacoBell I am sorry but until you can provide better proof than ‘because they haven’t done it in 3 years’ to back up those claims it’s no more than speculation.
@DinoDin@BallpointMan@byrne20 Its not speculation, its been disclosed in other channels. But I don't know if this person broke NDA or not, so I have not named them.
So, my worst fear that the existence of this game is actually blocking further development of the EEs is confirmed. Why has Beamdog not made the Soultaker expansion for BG2 that they had planned? Why have they not added an npc pack for SoD npcs in BG2? WotC has blocked it because they want "Baldur's Gate" to mean the new game. NDAs may be involved, so no names.
Thanks WotC and Larian, you are actively killing Baldur's Gate. The REAL Baldur's Gate.
Do you think that BG3 can block the development of NWN2 EE or something similar? But considering that beamdog is porting the games to console, i don't know if WotC is blocking the development of older games that hard.
from what little i skim of the interview that had the info. the controversy with sod had a very big impact on it. it caused a bg 2 ee expansion that would have wrapped up plot points from sod from being made and more then likely made wotc uneasy with having beamdog make anything original again.
I'd like to see a link to this interview so I can assess and judge it for myself too. But going purely off what you said there, megamike15, I suppose that it IS plausible, given that 4E drove off a lot of old D&D fans, and WotC is only just starting to win them back with 5E. While I personally did not see or experience anything I would find objectionable in SoD, anything that further displeases or fractures the fanbase is perhaps something that WotC is understandably eager to avoid at this point.
I'd like to see a link to this interview so I can assess and judge it for myself too. But going purely off what you said there, megamike15, I suppose that it IS plausible, given that 4E drove off a lot of old D&D fans, and WotC is only just starting to win them back with 5E. While I personally did not see or experience anything I would find objectionable in SoD, anything that further displeases or fractures the fanbase is perhaps something that WotC is understandably eager to avoid at this point.
Yes, even without hard evidence it is extremely plausible in terms of previous WotC decisions about dropping old editions in favor of pushing the new ones in the spotlight. I was surprised that they allowed SoD, even if it was just an expansion.
@ThacoBell fair enough. Until I see the proof I won’t believe it.
You can join the Wild Surge Discord and read it for yourself.
So your best evidence is someone you can't name posted something on social media?
I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think WotC can greenlight a project to a video game company, ostensibly sign a contract and then just renege.
It was more like an informal interview. But WotC probably retain the right to approve or disapprove any creative liscenes in their contracts. Heaven knows hundreds of tv shows have had contracts for more seasons than they got because some executive changed their minds.
@Zaxares@byrne20 Have you tried looking in the Wild Surge thread? I suppose could also link you.
Yeah, just goes to show that the opinions of hate groups and literal hate speech are more important and worth catering to than any other group in WotC's eyes.
and even 3 years later no one can talk about sod with out bringing up the drama. i brought that up in a youtube comment and they just refered to here as an echo chamber because we don't hate sod as much.
Yeah, just goes to show that the opinions of hate groups and literal hate speech are more important and worth catering to than any other group in WotC's eyes.
So I read the interview, and my takeaway is still that the dropped BGEE content has nothing to do with Larian or even WotC. Seems it was a decision that rests with Beamdog and not really anybody else. In fact this matches up with the timeline of their releases since post SoD, they did Planescape EE, NWN EE and now Axis and Allies.
I can't even blame them, from a bottom line perspective here. Those seems like the smarter things to work on if your goal is to make money.
"BG2 expansion that was planned while SoD was being made was cancelled by those in creative control for another project (the PS:T one which was then cancelled for unknown reasons). Foley, in the interview explained how the BG2 expansion was going to play out and what it would have involved."
"Yes, this is correct"
"f it was due to Latina getting BG3, that makes no sense as BG3 is 100s of years in the future"
"However, people wonder - what does stop Beamdog from working on an expansion now, considering the Planescape game got cancelled"
"WotC is stopping them obviously. It’s why I asked Foley if he’d be interested in writing an unofficial expansion mod for BG2"
"Yes."
"WotC is stopping them." Yup, totally all Beamdog's decision. @DinoDin DId you even read this?
Yeah, just goes to show that the opinions of hate groups and literal hate speech are more important and worth catering to than any other group in WotC's eyes.
Yeah, just goes to show that the opinions of moral authoritarians stuffed on 1984 and versed enough in doublethink to call themselves "liberals" (Jesus!) are more important and worth of trust, than any person's who just doesn't like leftist SJW propaganda shoved down their throats, or an actual trans person's who asked to not paint a target on their back.
^ This viewpoint is as much (or as less) valid as yours that I've just quoted. I'll leave it up to you decide how much validity they both equally share
PS That is to say, you may not disagree with "SJW garbage" without also acknowledging that "hate speech" is a wildly gross overstatement.
Yeah, just goes to show that the opinions of hate groups and literal hate speech are more important and worth catering to than any other group in WotC's eyes.
PS That is to say, you may not disagree with "SJW garbage" without also acknowledging that "hate speech" is a wildly gross overstatement.
I have seen the comments calling trans people disgusting, and calling for the lynching of Amber. If literal death threats (over a computer game ffs) aren't hate speech, please tell me what is.
Comments
i would not really call shadowrun dragonfall or hongkong trash. it's just for some reason no one wanted to make modules for it. there is only like 1 series made for those and compared to say nwn it has nothing really in comparison.
it seems unless your a Bethesda game or the game already had an active modding community no one wants to mod it at all.
Obviously spoilers
Just kidding, but if for then missing doesn't work, leveling is too slow, and spell slots is not intuitive, will the game change more the rules than SCL? Because SCL at least maintained the "leveling" aspect... You don't see lv 120 chars everywere.
But, yeah.... I really do wish to see more custom content related to the lesser modded games out there. Drakensang being a prime example.
That may sound counter-intuitive, but I truely believe it. The reason is it does not do as good as your imagination. D&D is an imaginative game, whether you play it with just dice and pencils, with miniatures or on the computer. I don't think 3D graphics add to that, they detract from it, replacing your imagination with the a graphics rendering.
When Minsc yells "Full Plate and Packing Steel" I can imagine what his face looks like while he runs into battle .... but I can't actually see it. In NWN or NWN2 for example I can actually see the character's faces and it is pretty bland.
Same with the scenery, NWN2 has for its day really good graphics, but it can't compare with the detail my imagination can build from the 2-D canvas used in BG.
Thanks WotC and Larian, you are actively killing Baldur's Gate. The REAL Baldur's Gate.
What's your evidence for this?
In fairness - that isn't evidence. It's speculation.
You can join the Wild Surge Discord and read it for yourself.
care to show me this info in a pm? if not can you link me to the wild surge discord so i can see it myself.
Do you think that BG3 can block the development of NWN2 EE or something similar? But considering that beamdog is porting the games to console, i don't know if WotC is blocking the development of older games that hard.
So your best evidence is someone you can't name posted something on social media?
I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think WotC can greenlight a project to a video game company, ostensibly sign a contract and then just renege.
Yes, even without hard evidence it is extremely plausible in terms of previous WotC decisions about dropping old editions in favor of pushing the new ones in the spotlight. I was surprised that they allowed SoD, even if it was just an expansion.
It was more like an informal interview. But WotC probably retain the right to approve or disapprove any creative liscenes in their contracts. Heaven knows hundreds of tv shows have had contracts for more seasons than they got because some executive changed their minds.
@Zaxares @byrne20 Have you tried looking in the Wild Surge thread? I suppose could also link you.
Thanks Andrew and Amber for all the hard work you guys did and sorry it drew the ire of a hate group.
So I read the interview, and my takeaway is still that the dropped BGEE content has nothing to do with Larian or even WotC. Seems it was a decision that rests with Beamdog and not really anybody else. In fact this matches up with the timeline of their releases since post SoD, they did Planescape EE, NWN EE and now Axis and Allies.
I can't even blame them, from a bottom line perspective here. Those seems like the smarter things to work on if your goal is to make money.
"Yes, this is correct"
"f it was due to Latina getting BG3, that makes no sense as BG3 is 100s of years in the future"
"However, people wonder - what does stop Beamdog from working on an expansion now, considering the Planescape game got cancelled"
"WotC is stopping them obviously. It’s why I asked Foley if he’d be interested in writing an unofficial expansion mod for BG2"
"Yes."
"WotC is stopping them." Yup, totally all Beamdog's decision. @DinoDin DId you even read this?
^ This viewpoint is as much (or as less) valid as yours that I've just quoted. I'll leave it up to you decide how much validity they both equally share
PS That is to say, you may not disagree with "SJW garbage" without also acknowledging that "hate speech" is a wildly gross overstatement.
I have seen the comments calling trans people disgusting, and calling for the lynching of Amber. If literal death threats (over a computer game ffs) aren't hate speech, please tell me what is.