Polish prime minister declared state of emergency over coronavirus. All borders are closed, any Polish national that wants to go back to Poland needs to undergo a 14-day quarantine. Schools are closed, public events banned, everyone stock up food, toilet paper and all other vital products. At the moment there are over 120 confirmed cases of corona in Poland with 3 fatalities. It doesn't look well...
The fact that the rest of the world and all of corporate America are taking such drastic measures is STILL not kicking in for some people here in the United States. The amount of people still insisting it's "just the flu" is, at this point, just mind-blowing. I imagine no one in Europe who has eyes and ears has the luxury of taking such a ridiculous position anymore. Either every medical expert in the world is dead wrong, or these people are about to get hit by the biggest shock to what they think they know in their lives.
Part of it is that in a lot of places, it's barely been felt. My local grocery store has certainly been hit hard by people in crisis mode, but not to the extent that it looks much worse than, say, July 3rd. While I was out the only out of the ordinary things were the people I saw wearing masks and possibly gloves. This store is under 50 miles from its counterpart in Kirkland, WA, where the shelves have been stripped bare.
The response to this isn't really something to critique on the individual level. There is a plan in place, although I agree the authorities took too long to implement it. But for most people in the US, including a lot of people in King, Pierce, and Snohomish counties, things haven't yet changed much beyond business as usual.
Schools are closed tomorrow, and that's definitely going to make an impact. But... better than worrying about what people are thinking, focus on what the government is or is not doing.
Also, pretty much no one has a proper context for what's happening outside of fiction - and fiction (especially film, like Contagion) tends toward extremely lethal diseases that can be cured very quickly through heroic action. Plus the media and government have not been entirely informative about what's happening. The reporting on Life Care Center was not particularly thorough until someone was finally able to get some more numbers out to the public - such as how the number of deaths had spiked dramatically starting February 18th. Or how Life Care Center was way behind the curve on even trying to deal with this situation, almost to the point of apathy. To the point of 70 employees being exposed and quarantined and a few dozen residents dead as their illness wasn't taken seriously.
I see a vital need to keep people informed, let them know what they need to do to be as safe as possible, and please please please don't try to panic everyone. Hopefully the US will improve on this in the coming week.
I am generally okay with schools closing and working from home more even though the rebel in me thinks it is an overreaction.
...
I think we should just act a whole lot cleaner and considerate to others for a few months and we will be fine.
If only there was some kind of leader who could come up with a plan and convince people to follow it...
'Let it run it's course' isn't going to get you many votes...
Maybe I’m a pessimist, I just think this calls for a plan, not ad-hoc measures based on abstract fear.
That is all we are getting at this time. Oh, crap--let's outlaw groups of people greater than 100! No, wait--50. Yes, let's outlaw groups of people greater than 50. I don't recall there being an "except in cases of viral outbreak" clause in the First Amendment, but here we are.
I am curious: how far are people willing to go to combat this virus and its spread? We already cannot visit restaurants, movies, casinos, sporting events, other public events, bars, and so on. What else can we give up or cut out under the guise of "keeping people safe"? Some primaries and caucuses are being postponed--what happens if it flares up again in November? Will that election be suspended, as well, because the risk of having too many people in one place is too great?
I still don't know what people don't understand about what happened in China, Iran, and is now happening in the major countries in Europe that we think we are immune to. I really don't. Yes, the United States is bigger, a much larger land mass. Yes, it's going to initially be a huge problem in our biggest population centers. It's not going to be everywhere at once. But anyone in Italy right now will tell you they were singing the exact same Pollyanish tune as little as 4 or 5 days before everything went to hell in a handbasket. I understand what this is going to do to people economically. I understand it will be an almost untenable situation. It's why evictions and utility shut-offs are being mandated to STOP immediately. The economic stimulus that is going to be required to get people through this is going to DWARF 2008. But the fact is this: based on about half a dozen other countries at this point. If we don't implement these measures, starting today (and honestly, even that is going to be too late in our biggest cities), then we are not going to have the ICU capability to treat patients. And doctors will have to choose who gets ventilators and who doesn't. Meaning, who lives and who dies. Meaning that your 85-year old grandmother would be left to drown in the fluid in her lungs to save the 40-year old father of three. And frankly, the UK had a "plan" to only let the young get infected, and they now seem to rather quickly be realizing it might not have been a good one.
@subtledoctor agreed to most extent.
I don't make statements about the economy because you are perfectly right that it will for sure be shitty in a few months laying for a long time. I am no expert knowledge that regard and have no idea how it will recover and how many are going to suffer (all).
But health care wise I know that we can have a decent summer in which governments can prepare for the return of covid in fall. Yes, we will see it back either in current form or mutated form (whichever comes first or feels worst). But also yes, being more clean and conscious will help in the long run.
I actually think the WHO might just be running this as a response test scenario in case something more deadly pops up, but that is beside the matter.
I am curious: how far are people willing to go to combat this virus and its spread? We already cannot visit restaurants, movies, casinos, sporting events, other public events, bars, and so on. What else can we give up or cut out under the guise of "keeping people safe"?
In the case of Germany and other European countries? That would include clubs, museums, theaters, exhibitions, brothels, playgrounds, hotels/hostels/motels, saunas, water and entertainment parks, game centres, zoos, gyms, as well as churches and other places of worship.
Things which will not close inside Germany are grocery stores, supermarkets, hardware stores, pharmacies, drug stores, gas stations, banks, as well as post offices and laundromats. And it seems that service providers such as opticians, hairdressers and craftsmen can also continue to work for the time being. However, all other kinds of shops pretty much get closed this Wednesday.
Interesting of note is that the Sunday sales ban will be lifted.
Polish prime minister declared state of emergency over coronavirus. All borders are closed, any Polish national that wants to go back to Poland needs to undergo a 14-day quarantine. Schools are closed, public events banned, everyone stock up food, toilet paper and all other vital products. At the moment there are over 120 confirmed cases of corona in Poland with 3 fatalities. It doesn't look well...
I have been there, my friend - it sounds and looks scary at first, but it's for our own safety.
Stay strong, Poland!
When you see harsher and harsher measures being put in day by day, understand why. These Governors and Mayors are being given updates by local hospital administrators. They are telling them, "we have this many tests, we have this many patients, we have this many beds left, we have this many ventilators and respirators left". The general public does not have this information, as that WOULD cause a panic, but city and state leaders almost certainly DO have those numbers.
And frankly, the UK had a "plan" to only let the young get infected, and they now seem to rather quickly be realizing it might not have been a good one.
That was never the UK plan. It's always been assumed that large numbers of people were going to get infected at some point, so action is being aimed at protecting vulnerable groups and minimizing the peak numbers - hopefully to a level the NHS can realistically deal with.
I agree with you that it does though seem the progress of the disease has been up to a week faster than earlier predictions had suggested. As a result the Prime Minister has announced some major changes in advice today. In broad terms that's suggesting:
- that those over 70 and other vulnerable groups should self-isolate for the foreseeable future (likely to be several months).
- if anyone has symptoms, they and all their household should stay at home for 14 days.
- everyone else should practice social distancing as much as possible (not engaging in group activities, working from home wherever that can be done etc).
Unlike other countries, all the above are only advisory measures. Though the government has the legal power to require such actions, for the time being they feel that strong advice is more likely to gain social compliance over a long period than a change in the law.
One particular point where the UK remains different from most countries, is that schools are not being advised to close. That partly reflects the lower susceptibility of children, but also recognizes that closing schools would introduce other problems (such as distracting health care workers and potentially bringing grand parents more into contact with children). School closures remain an option though as a further measure to take at a later stage in the progression of the disease.
When you see harsher and harsher measures being put in day by day, understand why.
I already know why: "Never let a crisis go to waste". The push for Medicare for All has never been stronger and de Blasio already suggested nationalizing medical equipment production companies, along with mandating that they go into production mode 24/7. We are forbidden from gathering in groups of 50--correction, the White House just suggested 10--so getting together to protest against anything is not possible. Just out of curiosity, those are guidelines and not laws--it is not *illegal* to gather in groups larger than 50. We are all, essentially, being ordered to stay in our homes--martial law does not require tanks rolling down Main Street, especially when fear will do it more efficiently.
I agree--the virus is bad and it is killing people. Our reaction to it, collectively, is actually *worse* than the disease itself--people are shaming other people for "not being socially distant enough": how *dare* the Governor of Oklahoma take a picture of his family out at a restaurant on Saturday evening! That social influencer--I forgot her name because that is unimportant--who posted a video of herself supposedly licking an airplane toilet seat, trying to start some sort of "corona challenge"? Her actions are irrelevant; what is important are the reactions of the people to her video, many of which called for her to be placed in jail. Really? On what charge? What *law* did she violate by taking a video of herself licking a toilet seat? Did she hold a gun to someone's head and force *them* to lick a toilet seat? The media coverage of the story paints a picture so dire that an elderly couple sat in their car and cried for 45 minutes because they thought that by going into a grocery store they would *die*. Democrats applaud when measures are passed/enacted that give Trump *more* power to deal with the outbreak--the same man they were accusing, only 3 months ago, of "abuse of power"?
Now I know how Bernie Sanders felt the day after Super Tuesday. What the hell happened and what planet am I on?
Anyway....since older people are more susceptible to cornoavirus and we aren't supposed to be in groups totalling more than 50 people, I guess that means Congress is suspended untilt he crisis has passed. I can live with that.
Just finished grocery shopping. Got everything we needed from meat, to eggs, to vegetables and canned goods and pasta (although the pasta was hidden). Over stocked because, we didn’t do grocery shopping in awhile and were out of the basics, and this was posted outside the store:
What worries me, is no ending date posted on the piece of paper.
When you see harsher and harsher measures being put in day by day, understand why.
I already know why: "Never let a crisis go to waste". The push for Medicare for All has never been stronger and de Blasio already suggested nationalizing medical equipment production companies, along with mandating that they go into production mode 24/7. We are forbidden from gathering in groups of 50--correction, the White House just suggested 10--so getting together to protest against anything is not possible. Just out of curiosity, those are guidelines and not laws--it is not *illegal* to gather in groups larger than 50. We are all, essentially, being ordered to stay in our homes--martial law does not require tanks rolling down Main Street, especially when fear will do it more efficiently.
I agree--the virus is bad and it is killing people. Our reaction to it, collectively, is actually *worse* than the disease itself--people are shaming other people for "not being socially distant enough": how *dare* the Governor of Oklahoma take a picture of his family out at a restaurant on Saturday evening! That social influencer--I forgot her name because that is unimportant--who posted a video of herself supposedly licking an airplane toilet seat, trying to start some sort of "corona challenge"? Her actions are irrelevant; what is important are the reactions of the people to her video, many of which called for her to be placed in jail. Really? On what charge? What *law* did she violate by taking a video of herself licking a toilet seat? Did she hold a gun to someone's head and force *them* to lick a toilet seat? The media coverage of the story paints a picture so dire that an elderly couple sat in their car and cried for 45 minutes because they thought that by going into a grocery store they would *die*. Democrats applaud when measures are passed/enacted that give Trump *more* power to deal with the outbreak--the same man they were accusing, only 3 months ago, of "abuse of power"?
Now I know how Bernie Sanders felt the day after Super Tuesday. What the hell happened and what planet am I on?
Anyway....since older people are more susceptible to cornoavirus and we aren't supposed to be in groups totalling more than 50 people, I guess that means Congress is suspended untilt he crisis has passed. I can live with that.
This libertarian gobbledygook is going to get us precisely nowhere in the coming weeks and months. As for Trump using more power, well, yeah, CLEARLY he IS the President and is the only one vested to make these decisions and moves. So while it would be better to have just about anyone else in the position, they aren't, so what does it matter?? I DON'T dismiss the chance he will use this to nefarious ends. It's more likely than not that he will. As for Congress not being in session, the amount of aid packages that are going to have to be passed to prop up the economy through this are going to be absolutely unprecedented.
I am generally okay with schools closing and working from home more even though the rebel in me thinks it is an overreaction.
...
I think we should just act a whole lot cleaner and considerate to others for a few months and we will be fine.
Not to call out a single poster, but this is representative of what I’ve seen a lot: “just work from home” and “just stay indoors for two months and then when you emerge, everything will be fine.”
That is pure fantasy. The vast majority of people don’t have jobs that allow working from home. Most people will not get paid while staying home to take care of kids. A LOT of people cannot take in stride a two-month hit to their finances. And a LOT of businesses cannot either. There are going to be long-term repercussions.
Not to mention, the goal here is to flatten the curve - i.e. slow down the rate of transmission. That means still expecting most people will in fact get infected. A policy geared toward containment is bad policy, because containment isn’t going to happen. Hard quarantine followed by “back to normal” won’t flatten the curve, it will just delay the spike. In 1918 there were multiple “aftershock outbreaks” because that’s what happens with all-or-nothing attempts at containment. Flattening the curve means managing transmission of the virus, not trying to prevent it.
Maybe I’m a pessimist, I just think this calls for a plan, not ad-hoc measures based on abstract fear.
If only there was some kind of leader who could come up with a plan and convince people to follow it...
It’s easier to treat 1000 people over 2 months than it is over 2 weeks. It’s what flattening the curve is attempting to do at this point.
What worries me, is no ending date posted on the piece of paper.
There are no ending dates or time frames on any of these measures coming out. Don't gather together in groups greater than 50--until we tell you otherwise. Restaurants, bars, gyms, movie theaters, etc are closed--until we tell you otherwise. Stay at home and socially distance yourself from other people--until we tell you otherwise.
In the Netherlands and some other countries the closure end date is after 3 weeks. For us that means April 5 or thereabouts.
However, I am sure measures will last longer than that.
What worries me, is no ending date posted on the piece of paper.
There are no ending dates or time frames on any of these measures coming out. Don't gather together in groups greater than 50--until we tell you otherwise. Restaurants, bars, gyms, movie theaters, etc are closed--until we tell you otherwise. Stay at home and socially distance yourself from other people--until we tell you otherwise.
Mostly because they don't know, I gather
Look, I'm not a fan of government by any means, but this kind of thing is why we pay them our hard-earned dollars in the first place. Maybe my scientific background has something to do with it, but I really don't think this is some nefarious experiment in mind control...
Mexico is considering putting up a physical barrier along their northern border to help slow the spread of coronavirus from entering their country via the United States.
Look, I'm not a fan of government by any means, but this kind of thing is why we pay them our hard-earned dollars in the first place. Maybe my scientific background has something to do with it, but I really don't think this is some nefarious experiment in mind control...
Neither do I, but I recognize the signs of a blatant power-grab when I see one. Once the current outbreak is over, there will be recurring ones on a smaller scale from time to time--rolling lockdowns will become the norm so they may keep them small. Once people become accustomed to them, though, they will simply accept them.
Mexico is considering putting up a physical barrier along their northern border to help slow the spread of coronavirus from entering their country via the United States.
Look, I'm not a fan of government by any means, but this kind of thing is why we pay them our hard-earned dollars in the first place. Maybe my scientific background has something to do with it, but I really don't think this is some nefarious experiment in mind control...
Neither do I, but I recognize the signs of a blatant power-grab when I see one. Once the current outbreak is over, there will be recurring ones on a smaller scale from time to time--rolling lockdowns will become the norm so they may keep them small. Once people become accustomed to them, though, they will simply accept them.
Kind of like, say, speed limits? Maximum weight-loads on elevators? Fire codes? Capacity limits for buses/airplanes/traincars?
There's a very fine difference between fellow humans oppressing each other because they can't reach a consensus on something, and taking drastic measures against external threat.
What worries me, is no ending date posted on the piece of paper.
There are no ending dates or time frames on any of these measures coming out. Don't gather together in groups greater than 50--until we tell you otherwise. Restaurants, bars, gyms, movie theaters, etc are closed--until we tell you otherwise. Stay at home and socially distance yourself from other people--until we tell you otherwise.
well schools are 3 weeks.
Hockey is till we say so, but better than basketball who just outright cancelled the season.
Here, they are giving businesses the liberty to choose to close or not to close, just like people still have the liberty to go out or stay home. I think my grocery store had a good compromise. Disinfect the entire store (hopefully), open for seniors only and then open for the rest of the public. Less chance of spreading it to the most vulnerable when they need bread and canned soup.
I said in the politics thread, my family went out for dinner at a buffet style restaurant on Saturday. The staff were changing the utensils more often, wiping down the counters every five to ten minutes and the management was disinfecting the seats and tables right after people left. Educating businesses on how to prevent the spread of it will help without going to draconian measures IMO.
That said, I live in a city of about a million people and there have only been 10 cases here to date. We'll see if the attitude changes if it blows up.
Italy which had the #2 ranked healthcare system in the world, reported over 368 deaths within 24 hours. This averaged to about 1 death every four minutes. As such, the fatalities confirmed in the country rose to 1,809.
In 2000 Italy's healthcare system was regarded, by World Health Organization's ranking, as the 2nd best in the world after France, and according to the World Health Organization, Italy has the world's 6th highest life expectancy.
Italy which had the #2 ranked healthcare system in the world, reported over 368 deaths within 24 hours. This averaged to about 1 death every four minutes. As such, the fatalities confirmed in the country rose to 1,809.
In 2000 Italy's healthcare system was regarded, by World Health Organization's ranking, as the 2nd best in the world after France, and according to the World Health Organization, Italy has the world's 6th highest life expectancy.
I'm guessing they're going to have to reclassify what 'requires' a hospital bed. They won't have the luxury of being cautious. That's bad, but probably not catastrophic.
Italy which had the #2 ranked healthcare system in the world, reported over 368 deaths within 24 hours. This averaged to about 1 death every four minutes. As such, the fatalities confirmed in the country rose to 1,809.
In 2000 Italy's healthcare system was regarded, by World Health Organization's ranking, as the 2nd best in the world after France, and according to the World Health Organization, Italy has the world's 6th highest life expectancy.
I'm guessing they're going to have to reclassify what 'requires' a hospital bed. They won't have the luxury of being cautious. That's bad, but probably not catastrophic.
That's what they had to do in Italy. They decided if you are over 80, you don't get a hospital bed.
Italy which had the #2 ranked healthcare system in the world, reported over 368 deaths within 24 hours. This averaged to about 1 death every four minutes. As such, the fatalities confirmed in the country rose to 1,809.
In 2000 Italy's healthcare system was regarded, by World Health Organization's ranking, as the 2nd best in the world after France, and according to the World Health Organization, Italy has the world's 6th highest life expectancy.
I'm guessing they're going to have to reclassify what 'requires' a hospital bed. They won't have the luxury of being cautious. That's bad, but probably not catastrophic.
That's what they had to do in Italy. They decided if you are over 80, you don't get a hospital bed.
Comments
Part of it is that in a lot of places, it's barely been felt. My local grocery store has certainly been hit hard by people in crisis mode, but not to the extent that it looks much worse than, say, July 3rd. While I was out the only out of the ordinary things were the people I saw wearing masks and possibly gloves. This store is under 50 miles from its counterpart in Kirkland, WA, where the shelves have been stripped bare.
The response to this isn't really something to critique on the individual level. There is a plan in place, although I agree the authorities took too long to implement it. But for most people in the US, including a lot of people in King, Pierce, and Snohomish counties, things haven't yet changed much beyond business as usual.
Schools are closed tomorrow, and that's definitely going to make an impact. But... better than worrying about what people are thinking, focus on what the government is or is not doing.
Also, pretty much no one has a proper context for what's happening outside of fiction - and fiction (especially film, like Contagion) tends toward extremely lethal diseases that can be cured very quickly through heroic action. Plus the media and government have not been entirely informative about what's happening. The reporting on Life Care Center was not particularly thorough until someone was finally able to get some more numbers out to the public - such as how the number of deaths had spiked dramatically starting February 18th. Or how Life Care Center was way behind the curve on even trying to deal with this situation, almost to the point of apathy. To the point of 70 employees being exposed and quarantined and a few dozen residents dead as their illness wasn't taken seriously.
I see a vital need to keep people informed, let them know what they need to do to be as safe as possible, and please please please don't try to panic everyone. Hopefully the US will improve on this in the coming week.
'Let it run it's course' isn't going to get you many votes...
That is all we are getting at this time. Oh, crap--let's outlaw groups of people greater than 100! No, wait--50. Yes, let's outlaw groups of people greater than 50. I don't recall there being an "except in cases of viral outbreak" clause in the First Amendment, but here we are.
I am curious: how far are people willing to go to combat this virus and its spread? We already cannot visit restaurants, movies, casinos, sporting events, other public events, bars, and so on. What else can we give up or cut out under the guise of "keeping people safe"? Some primaries and caucuses are being postponed--what happens if it flares up again in November? Will that election be suspended, as well, because the risk of having too many people in one place is too great?
I don't make statements about the economy because you are perfectly right that it will for sure be shitty in a few months laying for a long time. I am no expert knowledge that regard and have no idea how it will recover and how many are going to suffer (all).
But health care wise I know that we can have a decent summer in which governments can prepare for the return of covid in fall. Yes, we will see it back either in current form or mutated form (whichever comes first or feels worst). But also yes, being more clean and conscious will help in the long run.
I actually think the WHO might just be running this as a response test scenario in case something more deadly pops up, but that is beside the matter.
Things which will not close inside Germany are grocery stores, supermarkets, hardware stores, pharmacies, drug stores, gas stations, banks, as well as post offices and laundromats. And it seems that service providers such as opticians, hairdressers and craftsmen can also continue to work for the time being. However, all other kinds of shops pretty much get closed this Wednesday.
Interesting of note is that the Sunday sales ban will be lifted.
I have been there, my friend - it sounds and looks scary at first, but it's for our own safety.
Stay strong, Poland!
Edit: Epic fail for the guy who didn't even cover his hands...
That was never the UK plan. It's always been assumed that large numbers of people were going to get infected at some point, so action is being aimed at protecting vulnerable groups and minimizing the peak numbers - hopefully to a level the NHS can realistically deal with.
I agree with you that it does though seem the progress of the disease has been up to a week faster than earlier predictions had suggested. As a result the Prime Minister has announced some major changes in advice today. In broad terms that's suggesting:
- that those over 70 and other vulnerable groups should self-isolate for the foreseeable future (likely to be several months).
- if anyone has symptoms, they and all their household should stay at home for 14 days.
- everyone else should practice social distancing as much as possible (not engaging in group activities, working from home wherever that can be done etc).
Unlike other countries, all the above are only advisory measures. Though the government has the legal power to require such actions, for the time being they feel that strong advice is more likely to gain social compliance over a long period than a change in the law.
One particular point where the UK remains different from most countries, is that schools are not being advised to close. That partly reflects the lower susceptibility of children, but also recognizes that closing schools would introduce other problems (such as distracting health care workers and potentially bringing grand parents more into contact with children). School closures remain an option though as a further measure to take at a later stage in the progression of the disease.
I already know why: "Never let a crisis go to waste". The push for Medicare for All has never been stronger and de Blasio already suggested nationalizing medical equipment production companies, along with mandating that they go into production mode 24/7. We are forbidden from gathering in groups of 50--correction, the White House just suggested 10--so getting together to protest against anything is not possible. Just out of curiosity, those are guidelines and not laws--it is not *illegal* to gather in groups larger than 50. We are all, essentially, being ordered to stay in our homes--martial law does not require tanks rolling down Main Street, especially when fear will do it more efficiently.
I agree--the virus is bad and it is killing people. Our reaction to it, collectively, is actually *worse* than the disease itself--people are shaming other people for "not being socially distant enough": how *dare* the Governor of Oklahoma take a picture of his family out at a restaurant on Saturday evening! That social influencer--I forgot her name because that is unimportant--who posted a video of herself supposedly licking an airplane toilet seat, trying to start some sort of "corona challenge"? Her actions are irrelevant; what is important are the reactions of the people to her video, many of which called for her to be placed in jail. Really? On what charge? What *law* did she violate by taking a video of herself licking a toilet seat? Did she hold a gun to someone's head and force *them* to lick a toilet seat? The media coverage of the story paints a picture so dire that an elderly couple sat in their car and cried for 45 minutes because they thought that by going into a grocery store they would *die*. Democrats applaud when measures are passed/enacted that give Trump *more* power to deal with the outbreak--the same man they were accusing, only 3 months ago, of "abuse of power"?
Now I know how Bernie Sanders felt the day after Super Tuesday. What the hell happened and what planet am I on?
Anyway....since older people are more susceptible to cornoavirus and we aren't supposed to be in groups totalling more than 50 people, I guess that means Congress is suspended untilt he crisis has passed. I can live with that.
What worries me, is no ending date posted on the piece of paper.
This libertarian gobbledygook is going to get us precisely nowhere in the coming weeks and months. As for Trump using more power, well, yeah, CLEARLY he IS the President and is the only one vested to make these decisions and moves. So while it would be better to have just about anyone else in the position, they aren't, so what does it matter?? I DON'T dismiss the chance he will use this to nefarious ends. It's more likely than not that he will. As for Congress not being in session, the amount of aid packages that are going to have to be passed to prop up the economy through this are going to be absolutely unprecedented.
It’s easier to treat 1000 people over 2 months than it is over 2 weeks. It’s what flattening the curve is attempting to do at this point.
There are no ending dates or time frames on any of these measures coming out. Don't gather together in groups greater than 50--until we tell you otherwise. Restaurants, bars, gyms, movie theaters, etc are closed--until we tell you otherwise. Stay at home and socially distance yourself from other people--until we tell you otherwise.
However, I am sure measures will last longer than that.
Mostly because they don't know, I gather
Look, I'm not a fan of government by any means, but this kind of thing is why we pay them our hard-earned dollars in the first place. Maybe my scientific background has something to do with it, but I really don't think this is some nefarious experiment in mind control...
Okay, that isn't true...but it *is* hilarious.
Neither do I, but I recognize the signs of a blatant power-grab when I see one. Once the current outbreak is over, there will be recurring ones on a smaller scale from time to time--rolling lockdowns will become the norm so they may keep them small. Once people become accustomed to them, though, they will simply accept them.
Kind of like, say, speed limits? Maximum weight-loads on elevators? Fire codes? Capacity limits for buses/airplanes/traincars?
well schools are 3 weeks.
Hockey is till we say so, but better than basketball who just outright cancelled the season.
Here, they are giving businesses the liberty to choose to close or not to close, just like people still have the liberty to go out or stay home. I think my grocery store had a good compromise. Disinfect the entire store (hopefully), open for seniors only and then open for the rest of the public. Less chance of spreading it to the most vulnerable when they need bread and canned soup.
I said in the politics thread, my family went out for dinner at a buffet style restaurant on Saturday. The staff were changing the utensils more often, wiping down the counters every five to ten minutes and the management was disinfecting the seats and tables right after people left. Educating businesses on how to prevent the spread of it will help without going to draconian measures IMO.
That said, I live in a city of about a million people and there have only been 10 cases here to date. We'll see if the attitude changes if it blows up.
Italy which had the #2 ranked healthcare system in the world, reported over 368 deaths within 24 hours. This averaged to about 1 death every four minutes. As such, the fatalities confirmed in the country rose to 1,809.
In 2000 Italy's healthcare system was regarded, by World Health Organization's ranking, as the 2nd best in the world after France, and according to the World Health Organization, Italy has the world's 6th highest life expectancy.
https://philnews.ph/2020/03/16/covid-19-in-italy-1-death-reported-every-4-minutes-due-to-covid-19/
I'm guessing they're going to have to reclassify what 'requires' a hospital bed. They won't have the luxury of being cautious. That's bad, but probably not catastrophic.
That's what they had to do in Italy. They decided if you are over 80, you don't get a hospital bed.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/coronavirus-hit-italy-warns-those-21702596
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/italy-elderly-coronavirus/
Interesting. I would've thought 'under' 80. Pretty cutthroat in Italy I guess...