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Diablo IV(4)

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  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,162
    - more runewords

    That would be awful. I mean, almost everyone prefers Diablo 2 PRE enigma and other OP runewords.

    I would prefer if they add a optional "GR like end game"

    And MAYBE having magic working more like D1, where investing into MAG/ENERGY actually is useful or like some mods like path of diablo, where bone spear is buffed by your energy attribute. My fear is that more they change, more likely they will ruin the classes. Change D2 to make it more like D1 will be welcomed. Change to make more like D3 will be awful.

  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 21,618
    - more runewords

    That would be awful. I mean, almost everyone prefers Diablo 2 PRE enigma and other OP runewords.

    I would prefer if they add a optional "GR like end game"

    And MAYBE having magic working more like D1, where investing into MAG/ENERGY actually is useful or like some mods like path of diablo, where bone spear is buffed by your energy attribute. My fear is that more they change, more likely they will ruin the classes. Change D2 to make it more like D1 will be welcomed. Change to make more like D3 will be awful.

    Let me rephrase it - not more high-level runewords, but more low-level or even mid-level runewords. Not Enigma-style but more words for single player, for more general play. See https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/comment/1129840/#Comment_1129840

    SorcererV1ct0r
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 21,618
    edited May 2020
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    Well, it looks like we probably ARE getting that Diablo 2 Remaster coming later in the year, and it looks like it's been outsourced just like Warcraft III. A word of warning in advance: the MAIN issue with WCIII Reforged is that they made the old game not accessible to download even off your Blizzard account page. I (and I can't stress this enough) STRONGLY suggest every get a copy of the 1.12 installers from somewhere (either from your original discs or anywhere else you can find them) as well as Patch 1.13c and save them to an external hard drive or anywhere you keep your stuff stored. Because in all likelihood, you won't be able to download the original client anymore once it's out.

    It's my guess only, but I'd say they will follow the route of their Starcraft remaster - which made original Starcraft free and available for a free download. https://starcraft.com/en-us "A new era of StarCraft has arrived. Play for free or upgrade to StarCraft: Remastered to unlock 4K graphics, 16x9 aspect ratio, and more!"

  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,162


    Amazing video above from MrLLamaSC, the greatest D2 speedrunner.

    I an in favor of NO CHANGES. Is not that Diablo 2 is a perfect game. Is just that the ““solutions”” to D2 problems tends to make the game far worse. For example, energy being worthless. You can >

    A ) Make energy like MAG from D1(a requirement to learn magic and a stat that buffs magic), some mods like Path of Diablo makes ENERGY buff skills like Bone Spear.

    B ) Remove attributes, make 100% of your char DNA tied to stat stickie gear and everyone a clone.

    A good change to D1 lack of build diversity would be A, but blizzard decided for B on D3. And will choose B for a D2 remaster...

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,632


    Amazing video above from MrLLamaSC, the greatest D2 speedrunner.

    I an in favor of NO CHANGES. Is not that Diablo 2 is a perfect game. Is just that the ““solutions”” to D2 problems tends to make the game far worse. For example, energy being worthless. You can >

    A ) Make energy like MAG from D1(a requirement to learn magic and a stat that buffs magic), some mods like Path of Diablo makes ENERGY buff skills like Bone Spear.

    B ) Remove attributes, make 100% of your char DNA tied to stat stickie gear and everyone a clone.

    A good change to D1 lack of build diversity would be A, but blizzard decided for B on D3. And will choose B for a D2 remaster...

    There are still bugs that can legitimately be fixed in regards to skills. I know for a fact that there is a Fire Skill for the Sorceress that only does half the damge of the tooltip. And there has to be SOME way to store items that isn't tied to the design philosophy of the year 2000. Even BG:EE upgraded the amount of arrows you could have in a stack.

    JuliusBorisov
  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,162
    Due how D2 handles frames, you also has bugs like this. Casting speed differences in human and vampire form

  • BallpointManBallpointMan Member Posts: 1,560
    With Starcraft 1 remaster, it's my understanding that they made virtually no changes to the game. A big part of that is because they wanted to preserve the current playstyle for SC1, due to it being a thriving esport in South Korea.

    WC3 remaster did make some changes in the form of bug fixes and some minor stat overhauls (I believe) - but nothing too significant.

    Seems likely that D2's remaster wouldnt go too far beyond that. It'll either have exactly zero changes, or perhaps a handful of bugs + quality of life and UI changes.

    Just my guess, tho.

  • lroumenlroumen Member Posts: 2,285
    edited May 2020
    D2 is not balanced enough. Fun, but not balanced to make more build viable.

    They definitely should add low and mid level runewords that give interesting abilities and not op crap. You can use Eld, the second rune, only in late game runewords and never in shields while it gives an interesting buff for shields specifically imho. Other early game runes (nef, Ith) are not that much better off.

    Skills need fixing and synergies need rebalancing. If you need to max 3 skills to make 1 skill viable, then there is definitely something wrong. Low end skills getting 4 synergies gives the impression it should become viable while most are still not okay.


    I still need to get reaper for d3 and Necromancer. Are they good expansions?

  • AdulAdul Member Posts: 2,002
    edited May 2020
    lroumen wrote: »
    I still need to get reaper for d3 and Necromancer. Are they good expansions?

    While I'm more of a D2-type of Diablo fan and I have my numerous issues with D3, I think Reaper is a really good expansion. It adds not only a new chapter to the story campaign, but also an entire new dimension to the endgame in the form of adventure mode, bounties, and rifts. In addition, if you're so inclined, adventure mode lets you completely skip the story and play just for the basic gameplay loop and endgame progression. (Which is ideal for me, because I personally think those are the strongest elements of the game and the plot is mostly drivel.)

    The necromancer is... well, it's a D3 class. If you want another class, it's fine, but don't expect it to be anything special. It suffers from the same issues as all the other D3 classes, and perhaps it's even worse because the lack of proper character progression during levels 1 to 70 becomes really obvious when you play the necromancer, as all of your summon skills can summon the maximum number of allies as soon as you unlock them, which really highlights the fundamental design flaws in D3's early game.

  • kanisathakanisatha Member Posts: 1,215
    In an era where every single RPG apparently has to be TB, I would rather play D4 than BG3. The game actually looks quite good. However, they have this stupid thing of needing to always be online and where other players can enter into your game, and that's a hard deal-breaker.

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,632
    edited May 2020
    Adul wrote: »
    lroumen wrote: »
    I still need to get reaper for d3 and Necromancer. Are they good expansions?

    While I'm more of a D2-type of Diablo fan and I have my numerous issues with D3, I think Reaper is a really good expansion. It adds not only a new chapter to the story campaign, but also an entire new dimension to the endgame in the form of adventure mode, bounties, and rifts. In addition, if you're so inclined, adventure mode lets you completely skip the story and play just for the basic gameplay loop and endgame progression. (Which is ideal for me, because I personally think those are the strongest elements of the game and the plot is mostly drivel.)

    The necromancer is... well, it's a D3 class. If you want another class, it's fine, but don't expect it to be anything special. It suffers from the same issues as all the other D3 classes, and perhaps it's even worse because the lack of proper character progression during levels 1 to 70 becomes really obvious when you play the necromancer, as all of your summon skills can summon the maximum number of allies as soon as you unlock them, which really highlights the fundamental design flaws in D3's early game.

    Couple notes: one is that Reaper of Souls absolutely saved the game. The combat engine was always good in this game, but the loot tables on release were absurd, bland, and utterly uninspired. It wasn't just sub-par, it was actively bad. And you can't have an ARPG with bad loot. When Josh Masquera went in and said "we need to get rid of the auction house, and we need to totally overhaul the loot", the higher-ups gave in. Reaper of Souls influence is even felt currently in World of Warcraft in the World Quest system. It is essentially Diablo 3's Adventure Mode Bounties.

    The Necromancer is, sorry to say, half-baked at best. I'm glad it's there, but it's really evident. Many skill trees only have 3 options where other classes have at least 5 or 6. Initially on release, even the male and female portraits seemed......off. They have since been remedied. As for leveling one, I mean, Corpse Explosion is so wildly overpowered while leveling that it's insane to even consider going another route for 1-70. All in all, it can't hold a candle to Diablo 2's Necro, but very few RPG classes in general can do so. Grim Dawn's Necromancer is a pretty good heir to the throne though. Halfway through my current campaign, with gear bonuses, I'm up to 12 active minions.

    Adul
  • lroumenlroumen Member Posts: 2,285
    Thank you for the feedback. I will run through d1, d2 and d3 a final time and then get back to bg

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,632
    Due how D2 handles frames, you also has bugs like this. Casting speed differences in human and vampire form


    I mean, this is a whole other problem. The fact that actual gameplay mechanics rely on a 28 FPS framerate. Dark Souls 2 had this problem at launch and they had to path it out. Frames are an INTEGRAL dynamic of casting speed in Diablo 2. I don't even know how you get around that in a remaster.

  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,162
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    one is that Reaper of Souls absolutely saved the game. The combat engine was always good in this game, but the loot tables on release were absurd, bland, and utterly uninspired. It wasn't just sub-par, it was actively bad. (...)

    The Necromancer is, sorry to say, half-baked at best. I'm glad it's there, but it's really evident.(...)

    RoS only saved Diablo's loot. All other AWFUL ideas of Jay Wilson still in the game. For a complete view on his ideas, here is a video



    Summarizing his ideas on how to fix diablo.
    • Sorceress is too popular on D2 and Barb too unpopular, so lets make every class gear and plays like Barb. Now monks needs a big and sharp axe to deal unarmed damage (around 13m)
    • A lot of afixes is too complicated to my dumb brain. Lets make everyone gearing towards weapon damage and stat stickie gear (this change RoS fixed) (around 12m)
    • Potions are too good. Instead of making taking time to drink potions like on Dark Souls, Gothic and other games, lets add a mmosih cooldown on potions (18m)
    • Characters are disposable. RPG's, doesn't matter if is the JRPG's or WRPG's, are always about characters. But for him, they are disposable.
    • Necromancer was too well implemented on D2, so lets remove it and put a boring which doctor on D3.
    • (...)

    Necro DLC, i own it but honestly, is very lackluster compared to D2. No interesting curses, all corpses are the same and the JRPG level of androgeny of the male necromancer doesn't help either.

  • BallpointManBallpointMan Member Posts: 1,560
    New quarterly update out today.

    https://news.blizzard.com/en-us/diablo4/23529210/diablo-iv-quarterly-update-september-2020

    The big takeaways seem to be that the skill tree is pretty massive, and you cant reasonably fill the whole thing out by the end of the game.

    Also the idea that they're going to fold more power back into the character rather than into items (which should make a certain somebody who loves doing naked runs happy, I should think).

    Lastly - I like the idea of each class having a core mechanic that is different. The Sorceress's sounds pretty cool to me.

    JuliusBorisov
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,632
    edited September 2020
    New quarterly update out today.

    https://news.blizzard.com/en-us/diablo4/23529210/diablo-iv-quarterly-update-september-2020

    The big takeaways seem to be that the skill tree is pretty massive, and you cant reasonably fill the whole thing out by the end of the game.

    Also the idea that they're going to fold more power back into the character rather than into items (which should make a certain somebody who loves doing naked runs happy, I should think).

    Lastly - I like the idea of each class having a core mechanic that is different. The Sorceress's sounds pretty cool to me.

    I think the core ideas are shaping up nicely, but I would now be stunned if this game releases before fall of 2022. I figured we'd at least get the other two classes announced by almost a year since it was revealed.

    BallpointMan
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