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which do you prefer for multiclass fighter/thief or mage/thief

skaterfezzskaterfezz Member Posts: 43
  1. which do you prefer for multiclass fighter/thief or mage/thief77 votes
    1. fighter/thief
      58.44%
    2. mage/thief
      41.56%
[Deleted User]elminsterJuliusBorisovPibaroBlackravenCrevsDaak

Comments

  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
    atcDaveDungeonnoobjackjack[Deleted User]
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 8,262
    When I was younger I refused to play the game as anything other than a F/T multi.
    PibaroBlackravenjackjack[Deleted User]
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    edited November 2014
    I like my gnome Illusionist/thief. Its got backstabbing, invisibility (less need to put towards Hide in Shadows/Move Silently), spellcasting, trap setting, and wand using.

    (Also all the comments thus far were from the other side. Blue needed someone to comment!)
    JuliusBorisovjackjack
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,714
    I think that fighter's THACO and the second pip helps hugely to hit a target from the shadows. I like to use a backstab a lot and thus find any additional to hit bonus very helpful.

    A fighter/thief is also an excellent archer.

    As soon as I finish developing a fighter/thief as a backstabber and an archer (* in single weapon style, ** in a melee weapon of choice and ** in bows/crossbows) I start developing him for wielding two weapons. Thus this character becomes viable as an excellent fighter in the later stages of the game with lots of APR.

    Overall, I think that a fighter and a thief are combined into a fun and versatile character.
    BlackravenDJKajuru
  • meaglothmeagloth Member Posts: 3,806
    mage>fighter thief=thief
    thus
    mage/thief>fighter/thief
    CrevsDaakSkarose
  • atcDaveatcDave Member Posts: 2,146
    edited November 2014
    Every combination can be interesting and viable. I've played both of these. But I think mage progresses so slowly as it is, I hate to split their experience.
    Although a dual class thief to mage works pretty well; you basically can decide exactly how much , or how little, total experience you're going to waste on thief...
    Post edited by atcDave on
    DungeonnoobJuliusBorisov
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    Fighter/Thief and backstab.
    Blackravenjackjack
  • NimranNimran Member Posts: 4,875
    Everyone knows ferrets are perfect for backstabs.
    Blackravenjackjack
  • dementeddemented Member Posts: 388
    Sceptenar said:

    Thieves are generally shit in combat, and their skills aren't so important that you need all the skillpoints you would get from going pure class so they benefit greatly from having fighter levels.

    Mages on the other hand are very powerful on their own and I don't want to delay their spell progression by muddying the waters with thief levels.

    I disagree. If you play to a thief's strengths then they're quite formidable in combat. Just like you wouldn't have a pure mage learn only offensive spells, you don't use a thief as a pure fighter. They can be devastating when using traps or backstab. They can quickly end what would be a long arduous battle if their skills are well utilized.

    As for the poll I prefer the fighter/thief, but ideally I would dual class.
  • OzzyBotkinsOzzyBotkins Member Posts: 396
    I just like playing single class mages.
    BlackravenDJKajuru
  • BlackravenBlackraven Member Posts: 3,486
    @The_Potty_1 had me laugh. He pretty much summed up my approach to the game. I've really had to force myself to not play Thieves (incl. multis), and I still don't play pure casters.
    What I do like, and now I'm getting a bit more on topic, is playing Mage/Thief or Cleric/Thief and using the caster class to enhance the Thief. This can be done for example with
    - Spells like Knock so you won't have to invest skillpoints in open locks,
    - Invisibility and other Illusion spells for when stealth is failing,
    - Sanctuary (same reason),
    - Detection spells to locate the hidden targets of your backstabs (it allows you to wait with investing skillpoints in Detect Illusions),
    - all kinds of summons to distract opponents so that Charname can hide and prepare another backstab,
    - Buffs like Haste, Stoneskin, Tenser's or DUHM, Holy Power and Righteous Magic to become a more effective combatant.
    Of course at higher levels the Thief will have gained enough skill points beyond Thief-only skills like Detect Traps or Set Traps so that you won't have need for some of the above-mentioned spells anymore.

    Nevertheless to me a non-caster is somehow more heroic, having to fight so many fights with the odds against him/her (except of course at the beginning of the game). And I really don't like endgame Mages who can wipe away entire battlefields. I'm Valygar's spiritual brother and I tend to see arcane magic users as cheats.
    DungeonnoobCrevsDaakjackjackJuliusBorisov
  • SceptenarSceptenar Member Posts: 606
    demented said:

    Sceptenar said:

    Thieves are generally shit in combat, and their skills aren't so important that you need all the skillpoints you would get from going pure class so they benefit greatly from having fighter levels.

    Mages on the other hand are very powerful on their own and I don't want to delay their spell progression by muddying the waters with thief levels.

    I disagree. If you play to a thief's strengths then they're quite formidable in combat. Just like you wouldn't have a pure mage learn only offensive spells, you don't use a thief as a pure fighter. They can be devastating when using traps or backstab. They can quickly end what would be a long arduous battle if their skills are well utilized.

    As for the poll I prefer the fighter/thief, but ideally I would dual class.
    Sure thieves can backstab and set traps. But that backstab has to connect, and the extra fighter levels give you a better thac0 to accomplish that. Plus with fighter levels you can also get more proficiency points in a weapon, not only does this make you more accurate, you also do more damage with that weapon, and you can get higher than 18 strength and both of which are then multiplied by the backstab multiplier into even more damage. As for traps, it's just a question of setting them up, and you have plenty of skill points to sink into traps regardless of you multi-classing. The only good reason to go pure thief is to pick up one of the kits.
    jackjack[Deleted User]
  • CrevsDaakCrevsDaak Member Posts: 7,155
    From here to the 9th Layer of Hella I still pick Mage/Thief over any other multi-class*. It's basically the best multi-class option for solo'ing the BG saga*.

    * with the exception of F/M/Ts.
    elminsterGoturalBlackravenSkarose
  • GamingFreakGamingFreak Member Posts: 639
    As ridiculously awesome as Illusionist/Thieves are, I'm partial to meatier thieves who can defend themselves.
    jackjackBlackraven
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • The_Potty_1The_Potty_1 Member Posts: 436
    Ah well, mages don't dilute well. A mage/thief is an interesting build, handy for smaller groups both as a backup mage to the real deal killing machine, and to handle traps etc, but if you're using one to start a fight with some sort of surprise attack, quite possibly a backstab will not be as effective as a chain sunfire, or a chain skull trap, actually any chain you care to mention. So it's a sort of weaker mage. I like my mages with knobs on.

    A fighter/thief is a thief on steroids, you don't lose much thieverosity, or fighterishness, and the whole is better than the sum of it's parts.

    On that note, a fighter/mage is also interesting, but ultimately less than a full mage, and a bit less than a bard as well. Until you get GWW, then it can turn some heads.

    Duals now, anything gets better if you dual to it from a fighter with 5* in a weapon, and if the fighter was a berzerker or kensai, well this is gold.

    Some thief HLAs are kinda game-changers of the same order as mage level 9 spells. Spike traps get a lot of love, although I've never taken to them myself. I prefer the oh-so cheesy combination of slugging a haste potion, setting a time trap, then triggering the fight, sneaking, and positioning near a likely enemy while I wait for the trap to fire. When it does lead in with a backstab, then activate the assasinate HLA, and finish off as many enemies as I can reach while time is stopped. The fighter/thief or fighter>thief wins here due to having more attacks per round.
    JuliusBorisov[Deleted User]
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  •  TheArtisan TheArtisan Member Posts: 3,277
    edited November 2014
    I am an Assassin player. So, F U Fighter/Thieves.

    (jk i have a f/t in my iwdee party dont hurt me)
    BlackravenSkarose
  • 314314 Member Posts: 20
    dual kensai/thief 24/28
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    Where is the F/M/T option ? Best of both worlds :D
    BlackravenJuliusBorisov
  • dreamriderdreamrider Member Posts: 417
    314 said:

    dual kensai/thief 24/28

    Not in BG:EE, you don't!

    (Note the forum you are in. ;-) )

  • WithinAmnesiaWithinAmnesia Member Posts: 958
    edited November 2014
    I wanted to be a Fighter/Mage so I went with the Next best thing when it comes to all around power. Wands, Casting and 'Descent' Ranged Combat Ability with Lock Picking to boot! Still, Fighter/Mage 'for the win' with PLAT99! http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/37200/super-secret-item-recently-discovered-plat99#latest

    I use this:

    *Stinking Cloud, Fireball, Fireball, Fireball, Fireball, Magic Missile, Magic Missile, Magic Missile, Magic Missile, Magic Missile, Magic Missile, Magic Missile, Magic Missile, Magic Missile. Equip Full Platemail*
    Post edited by WithinAmnesia on
  • WithinAmnesiaWithinAmnesia Member Posts: 958
    edited November 2014
    Gotural said:

    Where is the F/M/T option ? Best of both worlds :D

    Maybe For Solo Play with lots of Potions of Healing and 'Good Reputation' Innate 'Dream Healing Spells'.
    Although good luck in a party with five other party members eating up your experience at level 9 while you stay at level 3 Fighter, Level 3 Mage, Level 5 Thief.

    You can Drop the Backstab and lockpicking and become VERY powerful with Combat Wands while wearing Platemail and being able to use Ranged Weapons.

    'HOW TO WIN: Fighter/Mage Style'.
    1.) Take off your armour while your enemies are in the fog of war.
    2.) 'Spam' Fireball and other Area of Effect spells at your enemies.
    A.) If your enemies are not crazy powerful and don't use bows, 'spam' magic missiles until they are dead.
    B.) If your Enemies use bows, cast fast, and or are Hasted, and or are 'crazy powerful' in general: Equip your armour and 'spam' a 'vendor topped' Wand of Fireballs into the enemy's fog of war location. Then Wand of Monster Summoning 'Monster Army'+ Wand of Stunning + Non-A.o.E. Ranged attacks if they 'charge'.
    C.) If Everything else fails Buff your Character With Positive Spells and Spawn an Army of Monsters with a 'vendor topped' Wand of Monster Summoning and Use Wand of Stunning plus non-Area of Effect damaging spells with the 'charm cloak' and or then quickly don your Armour while in combat and use Ranged Weapon Attacks while retaining your 'monster army' with the Wand of Monster Summoning.

    No Hit Points are usually not lost in Combat [That is what the 'Army of Monsters is for'] so a healer is not needed; just have a stack of Potions of Healing and get the 'Good Reputation' Innate 'Dream Healing Spells' and this should be more than enough for your personal healing needs. Also don't worry about gold for wands either! The money comes easy in the game for the 'vendor wand topping' and You can solo the game with this technique with [what I think is too much] ease!

    Did you ever wonder why there is 'not a lot of' properly scripted Fighter/Mage NPC's in Baldur's Gate; even with ~30 Party NPCs and a plethora of 'would be assassins'?

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Take Care Everyone!
    Post edited by WithinAmnesia on
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    Fighter/thief synergizes better, imo. The mage may be stronger overall, but the fighter gains more from the multiclass. I'd much rather have a fighter/thief and a mage than a fighter and a mage/thief.
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    edited November 2014
    @WithinAmnesia‌ Why would you need healing potions with a F/M/T ? Anything part Mage don't get hit at all with some buffs.

    And the xp split isn't as bad as everyone makes it look.

    When a F/M/T reaches Mage level 9 at 135,000 XP, a singleclass Mage or Sorcerer has 405,000 XP and is level 11. Which means that at this moment, a F/M/T has level 5 spells, and the singleclass also has level 5 spells. Later on when you have HLAs from multiple class's pools, you don't need higher level spell.

    To get back on topic, I prefer Mage/Thief because I think they requiere some more focus and management to shine, where a F/T can hack and slash his way. Plus I prefer anything with some magic.
  • WithinAmnesiaWithinAmnesia Member Posts: 958
    @Gotural‌
    I agree, I just do not use backstab nor hide in shadows even with a thief because I'm lazy. I Mostly use a thief for lock and pocket picking with find traps. I don't mind having no thief abilities for I have played the original game so much, that I know where most every good item is and only a minority of good items are locked away. I also just spam experience and level up faster with two classes and use magic, wands and composite bows to kill every enemy with mostly ease with buffed fighter skills for bows and physical fighting elements (e.g. Hitpoints and Armour Class).
    GoturalMirandel
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