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Best summon for a Dragon Disciple? [SCS; full party; no-reload; trilogy planning]


Assuming I'll make it alive to lvl 14, my options from there on seem to be:

1. Mordenkainen Sword:
Rumor has it that it's THAC0 10, APR 1, and hits as +4 - if correct, I can't see what the hype is.
(e.g. Firkragg is supposed to be AC -12; so basically the Sword will maybe hit it every 10 rounds or so)
Its immunities sound a cheesy tanking option, which I hope SCS actually annuls. (I'm not sure, but SCS mages probably also know to Magic Missile or Death Spell them to death or just ignore the sword.)

2. Djinn/Efreeti
In my tweak install they are "gated", i.e., they should not be susceptible to Death Spell. They are really annoying if hit by AoE spells of your party, if memory serves. (And they don't die easily: my recent Guarded Compound fight on the lower floor lasted some 20 minutes due to their Efreeti coming back like 4 times.)
Though I suppose Efreeti can be safely carpet-bombed with Incendiary Cloud/DBF/FB from the party and act as a perfect decoy. (Just not useful against Fire Giants and such...)

Djinn sounds like a finickier option, but perhaps offers other offensive capacity?


3. Pit Fiends [lvl 7 or 8 or 9]
Due to the competition of spell picks the lvl 7 version is perhaps best? Then there is the trouble of PfEvil management, in case someone uses Remove Magic on the party or you summon something else (Kithix, elemental staves etc.)


Others:
I imagine that Hakeshaar etc. are too risky and not worth the bother.

Skeleton Warriors may be nerfed in my install that replaces all +1 weapons with "fine" ones. (Haven't seen if that also applies to the lvl 15 version.)


Or should I just go summonless until I get to the planetar (if I survive that far).
I really would like a repeatable summon that can make a dent at the Dragons (which in my install have enhanced HP!).


Opinions very welcome.



semiticgodJuliusBorisov

Comments

  • YgramulYgramul Member Posts: 1,059

    Ygramul said:

    1. Mordenkainen Sword:

    Its immunities sound a cheesy tanking option,

    The cheese factor with Mord's is exactly why must people like it so much.

    Me, I would go with efreet. The whole fire theme works well for a (Red) Dragon Disciple.
    I heard that it turns on you after its 1st resurrection. Is that true?

    That means that for the price of one Efreeti summon you have to fight an Efreeti yourself 3 times...?!?

  • DragonKingDragonKing Member Posts: 1,663
    If only there was a Dragon summon spell, or transformation.

    Alas, this isn't sacred two where I got to pretend o was burning villages and villagers.

    Ygramul
  • Jaheiras_WitnessJaheiras_Witness Member Posts: 563
    I don't recall exactly but I believe Mordy's Sword has 2 APR and a low THAC0. Also does decent damage on hit. Best use is against fighters, clerics, thieves and monsters that can't cast spells as they effectively cannot damage it.

    Skeleton Warriors still great even if their weapon is nerfed. Still plenty of monsters that don't require magical weapons to be hit.

  • subtledoctorsubtledoctor Member Posts: 11,468
    Ygramul said:

    Me, I would go with efreet.

    I heard that it turns on you after its 1st resurrection. Is that true?

    That means that for the price of one Efreeti summon you have to fight an Efreeti yourself 3 times...?!?
    I feel like I've had that happen to me before, but really it's a bug with some script or other (maybe an old version of SCS, or a bad cross-mod interaction) - not an indelible feature of the summon. IMHO this type of "resurrection" should not happen at all, whether with your own summons or with enemies. Except in very rare, story-driven encounters like the demon in TotSC.

  • YgramulYgramul Member Posts: 1,059

    Ygramul said:

    Me, I would go with efreet.

    I heard that it turns on you after its 1st resurrection. Is that true?

    That means that for the price of one Efreeti summon you have to fight an Efreeti yourself 3 times...?!?
    I feel like I've had that happen to me before, but really it's a bug with some script or other (maybe an old version of SCS, or a bad cross-mod interaction) - not an indelible feature of the summon. IMHO this type of "resurrection" should not happen at all, whether with your own summons or with enemies. Except in very rare, story-driven encounters like the demon in TotSC.

    It may be thematic with Efreeti being "unreliable when abused" -- but since the engine does not give you an option to dismiss a summon, it practically renders the spell useless, it seems.


    @Jaheiras_Witness
    Do you know a specific source for Mordenkainen Sword stats?

    My priority is whether it can reliably damage Dragons, Balors, bosses etc.

  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 14,092
    @Ygramul: Checked the file (SWORD01.cre) in Near Infinity. It won't hit dragons very often, but it can tank them.

    Magical Sword:
    36 HP
    Level 10
    AC -20
    THAC0 6
    1 attack per round
    5d4+4 damage per hit
    Immunity to basically all disablers
    12 STR
    9 DEX
    9 CON
    25 INT
    9 WIS
    18 CHA
    100% resistance to everything besides magic and magic damage
    Save vs. death: 8
    Save vs. wand: 10
    Save vs. polymorph: 9
    Save vs. breath: 9
    Save vs. spell: 11
    Class: Gnoll

    YgramulJuliusBorisovlolienNimran
  • YgramulYgramul Member Posts: 1,059

    @Ygramul: Checked the file (SWORD01.cre) in Near Infinity. It won't hit dragons very often, but it can tank them.
    ....
    12 STR
    9 DEX
    9 CON
    25 INT
    9 WIS
    18 CHA
    ....
    Class: Gnoll

    Thanks,
    with 18 CHA, I'll have it romance Viconia (at least it is not an Elf).



    --

    It seems that short of the various Pit Fiends, there are no summons that are reliably strong against bosses.

    I really wish Efreeti was a summon that wouldn't turn on you. Would have been thematically great to have it around, lobbing Fireballs alongside.

  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 19,771
    The Mordenkainen Sword's Class: a Gnoll?

    image

    loliensemiticgodNimranNoobacca
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,326
    This thread needs more summoned cows.

  • DragonspearDragonspear Member Posts: 1,825
    I could kinda see Animate Dead for an evil Dragon Disciple. You're beginning to work on the basics to Dracolichdom

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