@TStael You misunderstand me. I'm not saying restricting birth control is helpful or good, neither was I making a moral judgement. My point was simply that education is more important. You can make any tool in the world available to everybody, but without the knowledge or judgement of how or when to use it, that tool is wasted and serves no one. Condoms and pills are inanimate, its people that decide how, when, or what they do. This could just be my experience, but everytime the concept of "should birth control be available to teenagers" comes up, no one discusses also educating our children on why its important to begin with. I'm not anti birth control, one child is enough for my wife and I believe me, but the importance of proper health and sex education should never take a back seat to what are simply tools.
I am not sure from which country you come from, i.e. if the attitudes are rational or moralizing, and if available combo of education and birth control is helpful or harmful.
I will not tell you how you should feel about your pants. I don't think you are qualified to tell about mine. And as to young persons: their home should help them to have solid sense of self-worth and respect for others, so pants are off or on without any sort of pressure - predatory, peer or societal.
"True love waits" is putting pressure and to me disgsustingly prying on a young person's hihgly privately felt sexuality, as much as "if you love me, you let me satisfy myself" is going for the same, just from the opposite angle.
If I appear boorish, I am sorry - but there is nothing unrecognisable abou the language you use, and that you are no longer a poor, as you might have been when you possibly studied, and wished to love or lust sincerely wihtout begetting.
Should birth control be availble to teenagers? Yes, obviously. If their parents supported them in their development, they will use it happily, or happlily keep their pants on. If their parents did not - at least the harm is minimized.
Will all teenagers always avoid sex if contraception is unavailable? Obviously not. Should they want to? Up to them. Should all sex be consensual - most obviously.
You know it to be so; that teenies will not abstain even if it is risky. Abstinence or punishment still, I read.
Edit: added "or keep their pants happily on" to third last paragraph to pre-empt that incorrect concept that allowing young persons to make informed choices is to push them to copulate. It is very obvious to me, but possibly less so to those that imagine on-kept pants as worty of a default better judgement than, say, happily and consensually thrown off ones. ;-)
@TStael I really don't understand your hostility. At no point have I told you or anyone about their or my pants, I haven't even voiced an opinion on abstinence vs birth control.
@TStael I really don't understand your hostility. At no point have I told you or anyone about their or my pants, I haven't even voiced an opinion on abstinence vs birth control.
Really now. The reason I reacted to you originally was because you said, give or take: "What is this fuss about (concerning the "Affordable Healthcare Act" being repelled) - people can just choose to keep their pants on!"
I remember your post quite well. I put it to you: my "hostility" is same as you to accept your post, and that some slight criticism might follow.
It only disagree with you. I am not hostile.
It saddends me you not see it this way. If I can do more, do tell.
Not to mention, as a result of Pence's anti birth control policies, Indiana is currently experience an outbreak in AIDS over the last couple of years. It's absolutely insane.
How is birth control regulation the main factor in this? People chose whether they want to keep in their pants or not.
Okay, I feel like I'm communicating poorly, because thats not the intent of my argument. Above the posters comment seems to place the entirety of the blame Indiana's outbreak to lack of available condoms. Ignoring the affordale healthcare act entirely, my point is that availability or lack of tools cannot be the reason for something that requires concious active thought to enact. People will choose to use condoms or not, but it is those choices that carry the consequences. People will choose to have sex, its human nature. I am neither condemning nor encouraging in these posts. I merely am trying to emphasize educating people about the benefits and cons of sex, in addition to effective and safe methods of birthcontrol, will have more long term benefits than holding birth control itself (it is merely a tool) as the be all end all answer. @TStael
Fact check Finland: sexually permissive, and active nation - with high access to sexual education, contraception, family planning and abortion. High national happiness, low in termination compared.
Your "brith control is an inane tool" viewpoint is one that I wish you'd refresh.
If my PC gaming rig was torn from my hands, because maybe I PC game away "wihtout considering console" - I tell you:
I'd be most furious, and even more commited to PC.
Fact check Finland: sexually permissive, and active nation - with high access to sexual education, contraception, family planning and abortion. High national happiness, low in termination compared.
Your "brith control is an inane tool" viewpoint is one that I wish you'd refresh.
If my PC gaming rig was torn from my hands, because maybe I PC game away "wihtout considering console" - I tell you:
I'd be most furious, and even more commited to PC.
I was referring to procco's comment. Again, I never said birth control was bad I don't know where you are pulling this from. You said yourself in your latest comment, 'High access to SEXUAL EDUCATION, contraception, family planning and abortion." I never once suggested anything be taken away from anyone neither. You called my posts, "Hostile and blameful" from the beginning and I have no idea how you reached that conclusion.
If anyone feels that another commenter is being disrespectful, or in any way breaking the Site Rules, do NOT bring it up in the thread itself. Having been on this site for quite some time, I can confirm that directly accusing another user of bad behavior in the thread itself has NEVER done any good.
Not "seldom." Not "rarely." Never.
Instead, report the post that breaks the site rules and/or contact a moderator via PM. The moderators will review the situation and deliberate on what action to take (you will not be informed if the other user has been reprimanded). That's what we're here for.
@semiticgod I believe we are just going through a miscommunication, and I was just trying to figure out the thought process. I do think this has gone on long enough though and will drop it. I apologise.
When one of those demographic groups was enslaved for 245 years, and only won a nominal amount of equal civil rights about 50 years ago, it matters a great deal. Even if you want to subscribe to the theory that the Congressional Black Caucus is racist (which I won't), at least they'd have a good reason to be if that was the case. The historical atrocities white people of European descent have committed upon Native Americans and African-Americans in this country are boundless, nothing less than genocide and centuries of human bondage. The residual effects of that kind of evil DO NOT go away with the wave of a wand, or a few decades after sweeping them under the rug. America has never really reckoned with what lies at the base of it's founding, which is mass slaughter and slavery. So no, I really don't have a problem with black congressmen having their own "club", so to speak.
@jjstraka34 I can see that line of reasoning and it makes sense from that view point. But answering segregation and exclusion with more of the same prevents people from being able to move forward.
America is not free of racism, but there has indeed been a reckoning. Aside from perhaps a few isolated pockets here and there, you can't grow up in the United States without learning about the Native American genocide and slavery multiple times, and you can't live in the United States without hearing about race and racism and its history at least occasionally. I read about it in the news at least once a week--more often than I hear about the economy.
I'd say that remembering that part of our history is one of the single most important things about American culture. If you ask any American about racism in America, they might give you a thousand different answers, but ALL of them will know exactly what you're talking about.
The only nation I know of that's been comparably hard-nosed about confronting its past is Germany. And, I assume, South Africa.
In a lot of places, these kinds of atrocities aren't even taught in school--and sometimes, the government actively censors the subject. In China to this day, you can't study the Cultural Revolution without the permission of the Chinese Communist Party, and the government has been very vocal about the evils of "historical nihilism," which they explicitly define as any history that makes the Party look bad.
@jjstraka34 I can see that line of reasoning and it makes sense from that view point. But answering segregation and exclusion with more of the same prevents people from being able to move forward.
The Congressional Black Caucus and organizations like the NAACP exist because African-Americans have had to historically band together in solidarity to survive in a country that treated them as less than human, and then second-class citizens. Neither are guilty of exclusionary malice, simply a historical need to organize as a group to exert influence. The Congressional Black Caucus was founded in 1971, a mere 7 years after the Civil Rights Act. So look, if someone wants to argue that these organizations are "racist", that's fine. I find it completely disingenuous, but as I'm finding myself saying more and more these days, I have neither the time nor inclination to change anyone's mind about it. My energy can be spent elsewhere if that's the case. I'm not interested in converting anyone to my point of view, so I'll express it and move on.
Fact check Finland: sexually permissive, and active nation - with high access to sexual education, contraception, family planning and abortion. High national happiness, low in termination compared.
Your "brith control is an inane tool" viewpoint is one that I wish you'd refresh.
If my PC gaming rig was torn from my hands, because maybe I PC game away "wihtout considering console" - I tell you:
I'd be most furious, and even more commited to PC.
I was referring to procco's comment. Again, I never said birth control was bad I don't know where you are pulling this from. You said yourself in your latest comment, 'High access to SEXUAL EDUCATION, contraception, family planning and abortion." I never once suggested anything be taken away from anyone neither. You called my posts, "Hostile and blameful" from the beginning and I have no idea how you reached that conclusion.
Did you not say - give or take, "what is the fuss (about Affordable Healthcare Act being repelled) - it is anyone's choice just to keep their pants on!"
You did - and here we are.
If I must explain your stance as such, I stick with: a PC gaming rig is confiscated, because a teenie might not have considred that a controller is migthy fun!
Only I think both PC and Console fans like what they do, and would not any of either bullied!
Consensual, optimally protected intercourse either in a committed relationship, or as a mutually wanted casual sexual release is generally positive for human health, and brings pleasure and happiness.
Aren't you forgetting something or rather someone important?
God. Not all of us humans know what God wants and knows, but some of us do. And should we not listen to those enlightened by God's wisdom?
God invented sex for procreation. If you have sex for pleasure (and especially if you have it before marriage!) are you not defying God?
What good is a "generally positive" effect for human health if you will end up in hell?
You should at least consider adjusting your lifestyle to what other people tell you that God wants.
Really? This is a question? Sure doesn't look like a one.
@jjstraka34 That does make sense. My main concern is that, even in cases where there is zero malice involved, actions can still create resentment. Someone can see a group like that as saying that only that group has worth or a say in this issue. Its not intent, so much as perceived intent.
Now more than ever I regret that Norway and Iceland are not in the EU with FI, DK & SE - so that we could have a proper Scandi lobby.
With Merkel and Gauck, I am in fact very thankful to Germany for statesmen provided. As Yennefer had to take the flack so we could keep on loving our boy Geralt, I am sorry to see Gauck go - to me he was a fatherly figure for the continent.
In fact, I admire Gauck, and will miss him a bit, regardless of his successor. And do so with Merkel, for her more thankless task for one more term.
@jjstraka34 That does make sense. My main concern is that, even in cases where there is zero malice involved, actions can still create resentment. Someone can see a group like that as saying that only that group has worth or a say in this issue. Its not intent, so much as perceived intent.
"In all things, charity."
I admit I project your "just keep your pants on" thing, and I am sure most Scandis will be able to take any flack back from you, should you like to generalise.
But...
Are you seriously suggesting people whose ancerstors were slaves will soon be oppressive? If simply they want to count their blessings of democratic influence, accumulation of which is desperately needed in de facto bi-party system, I suggest you welcome it as any other such lobby, for fairness.
When one of those demographic groups was enslaved for 245 years, and only won a nominal amount of equal civil rights about 50 years ago, it matters a great deal. Even if you want to subscribe to the theory that the Congressional Black Caucus is racist (which I won't), at least they'd have a good reason to be if that was the case. The historical atrocities white people of European descent have committed upon Native Americans and African-Americans in this country are boundless, nothing less than genocide and centuries of human bondage. The residual effects of that kind of evil DO NOT go away with the wave of a wand, or a few decades after sweeping them under the rug. America has never really reckoned with what lies at the base of it's founding, which is mass slaughter and slavery. So no, I really don't have a problem with black congressmen having their own "club", so to speak.
My family members where enslaved for 500 years by Black and Arab Muslims. I guess when I see Blacks or Muslims in congress I should protest?
When one of those demographic groups was enslaved for 245 years, and only won a nominal amount of equal civil rights about 50 years ago, it matters a great deal. Even if you want to subscribe to the theory that the Congressional Black Caucus is racist (which I won't), at least they'd have a good reason to be if that was the case. The historical atrocities white people of European descent have committed upon Native Americans and African-Americans in this country are boundless, nothing less than genocide and centuries of human bondage. The residual effects of that kind of evil DO NOT go away with the wave of a wand, or a few decades after sweeping them under the rug. America has never really reckoned with what lies at the base of it's founding, which is mass slaughter and slavery. So no, I really don't have a problem with black congressmen having their own "club", so to speak.
My family members where enslaved for 500 years by Black and Arab Muslims. I guess when I see Blacks or Muslims in congress I should protest?
When one of those demographic groups was enslaved for 245 years, and only won a nominal amount of equal civil rights about 50 years ago, it matters a great deal. Even if you want to subscribe to the theory that the Congressional Black Caucus is racist (which I won't), at least they'd have a good reason to be if that was the case. The historical atrocities white people of European descent have committed upon Native Americans and African-Americans in this country are boundless, nothing less than genocide and centuries of human bondage. The residual effects of that kind of evil DO NOT go away with the wave of a wand, or a few decades after sweeping them under the rug. America has never really reckoned with what lies at the base of it's founding, which is mass slaughter and slavery. So no, I really don't have a problem with black congressmen having their own "club", so to speak.
My family members where enslaved for 500 years by Black and Arab Muslims. I guess when I see Blacks or Muslims in congress I should protest?
Whatever floats your boat.....
Why wouldn't someone talk about Blacks enslaving Whites. The Blacks pirates at the time didn't "float their boats" they sunk them and the crew and took the woman for sex slavery. Why would you be so aggressive with your response to my quote?
Slavery is slavery and it does not matter who commits it. We should all be talking about slavery and the repercussions on a global level, not just when it fits our personal agendas.
When one of those demographic groups was enslaved for 245 years, and only won a nominal amount of equal civil rights about 50 years ago, it matters a great deal. Even if you want to subscribe to the theory that the Congressional Black Caucus is racist (which I won't), at least they'd have a good reason to be if that was the case. The historical atrocities white people of European descent have committed upon Native Americans and African-Americans in this country are boundless, nothing less than genocide and centuries of human bondage. The residual effects of that kind of evil DO NOT go away with the wave of a wand, or a few decades after sweeping them under the rug. America has never really reckoned with what lies at the base of it's founding, which is mass slaughter and slavery. So no, I really don't have a problem with black congressmen having their own "club", so to speak.
My family members where enslaved for 500 years by Black and Arab Muslims. I guess when I see Blacks or Muslims in congress I should protest?
Whatever floats your boat.....
Why wouldn't someone talk about Blacks enslaving Whites. The Blacks pirates at the time didn't "float their boats" they sunk them and the crew and took the woman for sex slavery. Why would you be so aggressive with your response to my quote?
Slavery is slavery and it does not matter who commits it. We should all be talking about slavery and the repercussions on a global level, not just when it fits our personal agendas.
If my response constitutes as aggressive then I'm not sure how I'm supposed to respond to anything. If anything it was PASSIVE AGGRESSIVE, and beyond that, I was simply leaving you to your own opinion. I'm not getting dragged into a discussion about global slavery since the dawn of time. The conversation we were having was clearly focused on US history. I don't even know what nationality or race your family members are a part of, what nation or time period we are dealing with, or basically, even the slightest bit of context that would even allow me to respond in a sufficient manner.
My family members where enslaved for 500 years by Black and Arab Muslims. is I guess when I see Blacks or Muslims in congress I should protest?
No, you should go and campaign at that said country for compensation!
But let us be frank - you will not. Or?
This was the frankness of admitting my own shameful thoughts before, while combatting just this false outrage.
The true frankness points to my stakes being particularly heavy as a woman - but the point is, it is not about me, but about my peers, and their children - and fighting for them to have the same intrinsic value and protections, without fault or favour.
So slavery of Whites by Blacks is a non issue because of ( insert excuse here). Slavery is slavery. If you want to get to the root of Humans enslaving Humans you have to research and have knowledge (which is easy to find in this day and age) of ALL instances of Human trafficking. Even the slave trade that is in the USA right now being conducted by the Latinos of Mexico and South American countries by their own people.
Aside from the slave trade @TakisMegas mentioned involving white slaves, there was also a prominent slave trade in the Middle East, in which African slaves were taken to the Arab world rather than the Americas. In terms of the number of slaves, it was actually comparable in size to the Atlantic slave trade, though I understand it was less intensive and took place over a longer period of time.
Comments
I will not tell you how you should feel about your pants. I don't think you are qualified to tell about mine. And as to young persons: their home should help them to have solid sense of self-worth and respect for others, so pants are off or on without any sort of pressure - predatory, peer or societal.
"True love waits" is putting pressure and to me disgsustingly prying on a young person's hihgly privately felt sexuality, as much as "if you love me, you let me satisfy myself" is going for the same, just from the opposite angle.
If I appear boorish, I am sorry - but there is nothing unrecognisable abou the language you use, and that you are no longer a poor, as you might have been when you possibly studied, and wished to love or lust sincerely wihtout begetting.
Should birth control be availble to teenagers? Yes, obviously. If their parents supported them in their development, they will use it happily, or happlily keep their pants on. If their parents did not - at least the harm is minimized.
Will all teenagers always avoid sex if contraception is unavailable? Obviously not. Should they want to? Up to them. Should all sex be consensual - most obviously.
You know it to be so; that teenies will not abstain even if it is risky. Abstinence or punishment still, I read.
Edit: added "or keep their pants happily on" to third last paragraph to pre-empt that incorrect concept that allowing young persons to make informed choices is to push them to copulate. It is very obvious to me, but possibly less so to those that imagine on-kept pants as worty of a default better judgement than, say, happily and consensually thrown off ones. ;-)
I remember your post quite well. I put it to you: my "hostility" is same as you to accept your post, and that some slight criticism might follow.
It only disagree with you. I am not hostile.
It saddends me you not see it this way. If I can do more, do tell.
Edit: grammar, and briefness.
(GOP House)
Fact check Finland: sexually permissive, and active nation - with high access to sexual education, contraception, family planning and abortion. High national happiness, low in termination compared.
Your "brith control is an inane tool" viewpoint is one that I wish you'd refresh.
If my PC gaming rig was torn from my hands, because maybe I PC game away "wihtout considering console" - I tell you:
I'd be most furious, and even more commited to PC.
Not "seldom." Not "rarely." Never.
Instead, report the post that breaks the site rules and/or contact a moderator via PM. The moderators will review the situation and deliberate on what action to take (you will not be informed if the other user has been reprimanded). That's what we're here for.
I'd say that remembering that part of our history is one of the single most important things about American culture. If you ask any American about racism in America, they might give you a thousand different answers, but ALL of them will know exactly what you're talking about.
The only nation I know of that's been comparably hard-nosed about confronting its past is Germany. And, I assume, South Africa.
In a lot of places, these kinds of atrocities aren't even taught in school--and sometimes, the government actively censors the subject. In China to this day, you can't study the Cultural Revolution without the permission of the Chinese Communist Party, and the government has been very vocal about the evils of "historical nihilism," which they explicitly define as any history that makes the Party look bad.
You did - and here we are.
If I must explain your stance as such, I stick with: a PC gaming rig is confiscated, because a teenie might not have considred that a controller is migthy fun!
Only I think both PC and Console fans like what they do, and would not any of either bullied!
Sure doesn't look like a one.
With Merkel and Gauck, I am in fact very thankful to Germany for statesmen provided. As Yennefer had to take the flack so we could keep on loving our boy Geralt, I am sorry to see Gauck go - to me he was a fatherly figure for the continent.
In fact, I admire Gauck, and will miss him a bit, regardless of his successor. And do so with Merkel, for her more thankless task for one more term.
I admit I project your "just keep your pants on" thing, and I am sure most Scandis will be able to take any flack back from you, should you like to generalise.
But...
Are you seriously suggesting people whose ancerstors were slaves will soon be oppressive? If simply they want to count their blessings of democratic influence, accumulation of which is desperately needed in de facto bi-party system, I suggest you welcome it as any other such lobby, for fairness.
Slavery is slavery and it does not matter who commits it. We should all be talking about slavery and the repercussions on a global level, not just when it fits our personal agendas.
But let us be frank - you will not. Or?
This was the frankness of admitting my own shameful thoughts before, while combatting just this false outrage.
The true frankness points to my stakes being particularly heavy as a woman - but the point is, it is not about me, but about my peers, and their children - and fighting for them to have the same intrinsic value and protections, without fault or favour.
The past was not a great time to be alive.