Incidentally, I don't know if 'ploughed the lowlands low' was ever intended as some sort of double entendre in the song- might just be my own filthy mind at work. In any case, it's never occurred to Tenya and I don't think anyone has the heart to suggest and then have to try and explain what they mean to her. Kids obviously do often sing lyrics to pop tunes they don't really understand the meaning of. Tenya doesn't sing that line on screen anyway. She just likes the bit about bodies rolling.
UPDATE:- It almost definitely is. Turns out it's actually very hard to find English folk songs that aren't about sex and death in some way.
Also, here's the other updated file with the scripts changed so that Tenya's health is topped up more often during the confrontation with Lethe, hopefully ensuring that she doesn't die hanging the game in cutscene mode:
so does this mean your officially back to modding?
I'm afraid not. I have about three books now that I'm supposed to be writing, so I need to focus on that and at least get one properly finished soon, so it's not a good time for me to become too distracted with other stuff. I enjoy writing Tenya probably more than any other character, but, well, I get money for other things I write. If I become better off financially and there are people still interested maybe I'll go back to her.
Sorry, I made a mistake with a couple of scripts, leaving an extra bracket that wasn't necessary. I've also looked at a couple of other little things, but they all seem to be working as they should. As ever though, my testing is on a 'vanilla' game with no other mods installed.
Oh, one thing people might have missed as Tenya isn't voiced (if I had the money to spare maybe I'd have tried to hire someone), but she does have text that pops up for actions. For example, if made the party leader she says 'Well why don't you just put ME in charge?' - obviously a reference to the movie Aliens.
She also sings a couple lines of a ballad called 'Young Edwin in the Lowlands Low', a heartwarming tale about a sailor who returns to see his lover, and then is murdered by her parents for his gold and his body dumped in the ocean. It's not actually intended to be a threat toward the games Edwin. I won't post all the lyrics, but this is the verse she's singing:
The fishes of the ocean swim o'er my lover's breast, His body rolls in motion I hope his soul's at rest. The shells upon the sea shore, rolling to and fro, Remind me of Young Edwin that ploughed the lowlands low.
I just listened to a version of this song by famous old english folk-rock veterans band - Steeleye Span, album *Now We Are Six Again*, it's simply called "Edwin" there, but it's that song.
Here's a rough history of the song in question, and you see there are lots of slightly different versions of the lyrics. Tenya just sings two lines, and it's a different version still:
Oh, the fishes of the ocean, swim o'er the man's breast... His body rolls in motion, his soul be now at rest.
It's a kind of more sea shanty-ish version I guess. I think that's how I first stumbled upon it - I had the idea that it might be funny or cute for Tenya to sing a sea shanty or two so I started searching the web for some.
Not in the forseeable future I'm afraid. I've only ever had a bunch of vague ideas about what I would do, like maybe you would encounter her again trying to hunt down Neb, or maybe just looking for the Bhaalspawn because she feels abandoned. I thought about having the Bhaalspawn be able to influence Tenya's growth in all sorts of ways, from alignment to stats and skills, maybe even class to some extent. But it's just thoughts and ideas - I never got as far as making a proper outline.
And now I'm just too busy with other things. Never say never of course, but it's not likely to be for quite a while. Of course if anyone else wants to do it they're welcome to.
Not in the forseeable future I'm afraid. I've only ever had a bunch of vague ideas about what I would do, like maybe you would encounter her again trying to hunt down Neb, or maybe just looking for the Bhaalspawn because she feels abandoned. I thought about having the Bhaalspawn be able to influence Tenya's growth in all sorts of ways, from alignment to stats and skills, maybe even class to some extent. But it's just thoughts and ideas - I never got as far as making a proper outline.
And now I'm just too busy with other things. Never say never of course, but it's not likely to be for quite a while. Of course if anyone else wants to do it they're welcome to.
@Coutelier If you ever do decide to more it would be most welcome. This has been a great NPC, especially since it is based on an existing character within BG. The ideas you mentioned sound really good. Regardless though, thanks for the update. Thanks again and may the RL work you are doing go well.
@Coutelier I don't THINK i've reported this before, but if Tenya dies before she kills the witch trying to take the bowl from her, the witch cannot be killed UNTIL Tenya is raised from the dead. She will just keep taking damage. Happened twice so far so fairly certain something unusual is going on.
@Coutelier I don't THINK i've reported this before, but if Tenya dies before she kills the witch trying to take the bowl from her, the witch cannot be killed UNTIL Tenya is raised from the dead. She will just keep taking damage. Happened twice so far so fairly certain something unusual is going on.
Do you mean if Tenya dies before getting the bowl back and thanking her for the lesson? The witch is immortal until that point, although you only have to hit her to trigger it. I'm afraid there isn't a script for if Tenya dies, so until there's time to work on it I'm afraid you'll just have to try and keep her alive (in truth I think it's quite an easy encounter - just ignore the other enemies she summons).
I suppose if Tenya dies and you manage to retreat and resurrect her in a temple that might trigger the next scene to happen there (if you hit the witch before you left) - I've not tried that. But then you could just go back and kill her, if you want.
TBH I dont remember if it was right before or right after. One of the elementals hit her I think was the killing stroke on Tenya. * It does work if going to a temple to get her raised and THEN coming back again, trigger still works. I just happened to have a scroll handy so used that. Done it both ways. Still works just looks a little strange. Just collatin data on the encounter in case anyone else runs into it.
The witch has an item that prevents her HP dropping below 1 (to prevent her from dying before the whole scene can play out and Tenya gets the functioning bowl). That item gets destroyed during the scene when Tenya gains control so then the witch can be killed normally. If there's time I'll look into some alternatives, but obviously the end goal of the encounter is meant to be that Tenya ends up with a working bowl.
I don't know if this is intended or if it is the effect of a mod. Tenya casts two hold spells followed by DUHM and Rigid Thinking. I usually go straight to Tenya at the beginning of the game. Unless my character is a beserker or similar, he/she gets held. Game over.
If he/she doesn't get held then when rigid thinking is cast he/she continues to fight Tenya after she has yielded with the result that she goes hostile again. If, later on I charm her, I cannot give her the bowl, the options don't allow it. so Tenya becomes unrecruitable. It would be great if changes were made to enable her joining when she is charmed. (Hint... hint.)
If that is what is supposed to happen fine. I can live with it and probably work out a solution too. I already have some ideas.
I usually have a pick pocket get the bowl upon first meetn the fishermen, so when I then meet T she automatically wants to join when I give her the bowl.
I usually have a pick pocket get the bowl upon first meetn the fishermen, so when I then meet T she automatically wants to join when I give her the bowl.
Without a thief, I could also charm Sonner and go with him to meet an ankheg. They shouldn't be a problem for him since he has an enchanted flail, and if he fails, well that's life and I have myself a bowl.
I didn't change any of Tenya's combat script from the base game. Completing her mission in the way the game intends can be tricky sometimes. I don't recall if she uses her own combat script or a generic cleric one, but if Rigid Thinking is causing a lot of problems for people maybe it can removed if doing so wouldn't cause any other problems. I'll see what others think and maybe look into it.
I didn't change any of Tenya's combat script from the base game. Completing her mission in the way the game intends can be tricky sometimes. I don't recall if she uses her own combat script or a generic cleric one, but if Rigid Thinking is causing a lot of problems for people maybe it can removed if doing so wouldn't cause any other problems. I'll see what others think and maybe look into it.
I think that this is a problem that can be worked around if players know about it ahead of time. The work-arounds however mean that you cut out the fight with her which is not what is intended.
Another problem is that a lot of cleric spells (command and hold being examples of this) cannot be used against her because if she is unconcious as the critical time (When she would have yielded) she will not yield later and you are forced to kill her. From a role playing perspective IMO it would be good if you could charm her and then get her to join the party.
However, it is your mod to do with as you like. These are just suggestions.
@Wise_Grimwald I believe your installation contains SCS: the Smarter Priests component is likely what's giving Tenya higher spell levels.
Thanks for the information. That will also be what makes her so powerful if and when she joins. So it probably isn't this mod that is causing the problem at all. When installing SCS, am I correct in assuming that the smarter priests module is something that I can leave out? If so @Coutelier doesn't need to do anything as it is something for individual players to sort out for themselves. However, it is something that needs to be brought to the community's attention, perhaps an addendum to the Read Me is in order to avoid my problem re-emerging for somebody else.
@Neverused whilst it is not really related to this thread, will that be why Gavin is also a bit on the powerful side? Other clerics such as Helarine don't seem to be, installation order perhaps being important.
EDIT
Having read the SCS Read Me on smarter priests, I don't think that the smarter priests module is the issue. It only raises the intelligence not the level of the priest. If she were ALMOST at level 5 instead of being at level 5, there would be no problem as she wouldn't be able to cast Rigid Thinking. Possibly the ideal would to have her level dependant on the PC's level. i.e. Level 4 if he/she is at a low level and level 5 if he/she is at a higher level that can dispell magic and the like. That's something to think about. Having the problem of Rigid Thinking for high level parties might even make the encounter more interesting, though doing that might make the programming more problematic.
I just wanted to say I'm delighted by this mod! Tenya was always one of the BG NPCs that stuck with me because of how tragic a story she had, and I always wished there was something more we could do for her than hand her back to Umberlee. And now this! Even if it doesn't continue to BG2, just being able to take her under our wing for one game is still really nice.
Just one question: will this work with SoD? Okay, two--is there a reason given for why Tenya isn't around in SoD (I'm assuming not)? It's always jarring when characters suddenly disappear with no reason given.
I just wanted to say I'm delighted by this mod! Tenya was always one of the BG NPCs that stuck with me because of how tragic a story she had, and I always wished there was something more we could do for her than hand her back to Umberlee. And now this! Even if it doesn't continue to BG2, just being able to take her under our wing for one game is still really nice.
Just one question: will this work with SoD? Okay, two--is there a reason given for why Tenya isn't around in SoD (I'm assuming not)? It's always jarring when characters suddenly disappear with no reason given.
If I recall, she switches to a jarring "I have an even better paying job for you after this" before disappearing.
I just wanted to say I'm delighted by this mod! Tenya was always one of the BG NPCs that stuck with me because of how tragic a story she had, and I always wished there was something more we could do for her than hand her back to Umberlee. And now this! Even if it doesn't continue to BG2, just being able to take her under our wing for one game is still really nice.
Just one question: will this work with SoD? Okay, two--is there a reason given for why Tenya isn't around in SoD (I'm assuming not)? It's always jarring when characters suddenly disappear with no reason given.
If I recall, she switches to a jarring "I have an even better paying job for you after this" before disappearing.
Aw, that's disappointing. Still really like the concept, though.
@Apocrypha What I have found in using NPC's that have nothing written for them in SoD is that stay in the party as there is no kickout/leave dialogue written for them. So far I have found the NPC's White and Mur'Neth stay with you.. In this instance the characters no longer have PID but will still have basic selection sounds that they had in BG. The NPC's I mention show up in the CHARNAME's room in the Ducal palace after the end of the intro dungeon. I have not gotten Tenya to this spot so can't confirm as with the others I mentioned.
I am currently in Dragonspear Castle with Tenya. No new dialogue, but she is a very competant cleric having reached the 500,000 experience cap.
I am wondering if Tenya for SoA is on the horizon yet as when/if I beat SoD it will be a while before I can play SoA as I will be out to India/Nepal, possibly a day trip into Bhutan.
Firstly, thanks for the mod, its a great work. Been playing the mod for a while now and it seems what you have here is a mod that offers something different (rather than the standard NPC+a few interacions+romance).
Was reading some of the prev comments. Have you thought about adding a "Cleric of Umberlee" kit for ? That could allow for Tenya to treat as a sort of "big brother/sister" style character. You could also then add in some new features based on Umberlee, such as interactions with pirates (particularly in Brynnlaw). You could also set the goal for Tenya as helping her to find a place for herself. It seemed to me that Byrnnlaw would be a good location for her to find a new home, based in the Umberlee temple there. That would tie in with the games storyline as it frees up a place in the group for Imoen when she is freed (often find I have to dump someone at that point!)
Comments
Also, here's the other updated file with the scripts changed so that Tenya's health is topped up more often during the confrontation with Lethe, hopefully ensuring that she doesn't die hanging the game in cutscene mode:
BGEETenya15b
Once I've got confirmation that the Neb issue is resolved I'll update the link on the first post in this thread.
BGEETenya15c
- Steeleye Span, album *Now We Are Six Again*, it's simply called "Edwin" there, but it's that song.
Oh, the fishes of the ocean, swim o'er the man's breast...
His body rolls in motion, his soul be now at rest.
It's a kind of more sea shanty-ish version I guess. I think that's how I first stumbled upon it - I had the idea that it might be funny or cute for Tenya to sing a sea shanty or two so I started searching the web for some.
will we ever see BG2 Tenya?
And now I'm just too busy with other things. Never say never of course, but it's not likely to be for quite a while. Of course if anyone else wants to do it they're welcome to.
I suppose if Tenya dies and you manage to retreat and resurrect her in a temple that might trigger the next scene to happen there (if you hit the witch before you left) - I've not tried that. But then you could just go back and kill her, if you want.
* It does work if going to a temple to get her raised and THEN coming back again, trigger still works. I just happened to have a scroll handy so used that. Done it both ways. Still works just looks a little strange. Just collatin data on the encounter in case anyone else runs into it.
If he/she doesn't get held then when rigid thinking is cast he/she continues to fight Tenya after she has yielded with the result that she goes hostile again. If, later on I charm her, I cannot give her the bowl, the options don't allow it.
If that is what is supposed to happen fine. I can live with it and probably work out a solution too. I already have some ideas.
Another problem is that a lot of cleric spells (command and hold being examples of this) cannot be used against her because if she is unconcious as the critical time (When she would have yielded) she will not yield later and you are forced to kill her. From a role playing perspective IMO it would be good if you could charm her and then get her to join the party.
However, it is your mod to do with as you like. These are just suggestions.
@Neverused whilst it is not really related to this thread, will that be why Gavin is also a bit on the powerful side? Other clerics such as Helarine don't seem to be, installation order perhaps being important.
EDIT
Having read the SCS Read Me on smarter priests, I don't think that the smarter priests module is the issue. It only raises the intelligence not the level of the priest. If she were ALMOST at level 5 instead of being at level 5, there would be no problem as she wouldn't be able to cast Rigid Thinking. Possibly the ideal would to have her level dependant on the PC's level. i.e. Level 4 if he/she is at a low level and level 5 if he/she is at a higher level that can dispell magic and the like. That's something to think about. Having the problem of Rigid Thinking for high level parties might even make the encounter more interesting, though doing that might make the programming more problematic.Just one question: will this work with SoD? Okay, two--is there a reason given for why Tenya isn't around in SoD (I'm assuming not)? It's always jarring when characters suddenly disappear with no reason given.
I have not gotten Tenya to this spot so can't confirm as with the others I mentioned.
I am wondering if Tenya for SoA is on the horizon yet as when/if I beat SoD it will be a while before I can play SoA as I will be out to India/Nepal, possibly a day trip into Bhutan.
I like how you 'fleshed' her out.
Was reading some of the prev comments. Have you thought about adding a "Cleric of Umberlee" kit for ? That could allow for Tenya to treat as a sort of "big brother/sister" style character. You could also then add in some new features based on Umberlee, such as interactions with pirates (particularly in Brynnlaw). You could also set the goal for Tenya as helping her to find a place for herself. It seemed to me that Byrnnlaw would be a good location for her to find a new home, based in the Umberlee temple there. That would tie in with the games storyline as it frees up a place in the group for Imoen when she is freed (often find I have to dump someone at that point!)