He doesn't have to. Hitting zero bugs will require an infinite amount of time
Does he really believe that it is possible to hit zero bugs? LOL, that would be a first in the history of computer software!
I would recommend shooting for something more realistic
Realistically speaking? I'd say that if they can get BG2:EE to where BG:EE was at 1.2, they can call it a day. The games will never be completely bug-free, but they don't need to be; if the devs had made the minimal effort necessary to fix the most glaring problems in BG2:EE post-launch, they wouldn't be facing the pressure they're currently under.
So when is the new faster patches thing you guys talked about already way back when BGEE patch 1.2 was released, and then multiple times since, coming? The delay between BG2EE 1.2 and 1.3 is already months longer than even the the wait for BGEE 1.2 was.
I could also point out that @Dee already said that BG2EE 1.3 had under 30 bugs left back in August, or that the last 6 BGEE 1.3 bugs took you guys a month to fix.
Yes, I'm awfully negative, but to the outside observer absolutely nothing seems to have changed even though you guys yourselfs have, again and again, said that it would.
Here we are again though with you guys apparently aiming for some kind of perfect patch when other developers are quite happy to release patches that fix couple, or even just one, issue. This kind of approach to patching seems to be the main cause of your glacial patching speed.
Sorry, no. There is always a better word than misdiagnosing a serious medical condition, especially if you're intending that label as an insult.
The work we are doing right now is preparing for beta. There are seventeen open issues; the issues that remain are ones that need to be fixed, and they're worth fixing right.
I forgive you, and I appreciate you editing your post.
The waiting isn't fun, I know, but we really are getting down to the last few issues; the only unfortunate thing is that those last few issues are significant enough that we can't ignore them. As soon as we're ready for beta testing there will be a lot of information to peruse with regard to everything that's been done. I know that Beta isn't the finish line, but it's the next milestone.
@Dee: And that, right there, is exactly where Beamdog is going wrong.
BG:EE's 1.3 beta lasted six months. BG2:EE has been in its current state for almost a year. The smart thing, at this point, would be to release the beta as an actual patch - yes, of course some issues may persist, but the game would still be more stable and playable overall than it currently is. After that, sure, have a beta, tinker as much as you want, and release the end result as a third patch. But withholding basic support for eighteen months at minimum? Have you all lost your minds?
There are seventeen open issues; the issues that remain are ones that need to be fixed, and they're worth fixing right.
So it a progress, a little one but progress none the less keep going guys we all be glad to get our hands on the beta and the final patch when that will be release
it's absolutely not given that a current beta released as an actual patch is in fact more stable than the previous stable version. while trying to fix things, you usually break others (or find other things relating that need to be fixed too). In the interim, things can be much much worse than before that fix ...
So it's not as easy (and by far "smart") to release a beta as a patch. Next thing would be people complaining bad patch quality, introducing new bugs instead of reducing their number. Also, a beta has not got extensive testing before release, so how can a publisher guarantee there are no hidden surprises in the new version he did not even know about yet? it would be plain unprofessional to act that way.
Well, I think that all the beta tests Beamdog has had up until now, has shown themselves worthy. It was this extensive beta-testing the reason we can more or less consider the 1.3 version of BGEE as the most bug-free version of BG1 there have ever been. It will likely be again extensive beta-testing the reason IWDEE will be released without troubles.
So no wonder they haven't changed their strategy. If it works, why do they need to change it? As the previous beta-testing experience has shown, it's maybe the only way for Beamdog to release the end-product as bug-free as they can.
Yes, we have waited for this patch too long already. But it would be a fail if after such a long wait they release a patch that again has huge bugs and/or cause huge problems. The only way for Beamdog to release a patch that doens't have them is to use the beta-testing stage.
Maybe they could do it all faster. Maybe they had to finish working on BG2EE first, then move to IWDEE. Maybe they could release patches for BG2EE in the winter of 2013-2014.
But now, after all these months, I would choose to wait longer to finally get the most polished version of BG2 ever than to get a temporary patch.
the 1.3 version of BGEE as the most bug-free version of BG1 there have ever been.
I just want to point out that the above statement is false.
Unless bugs like wrong icons on the ground or the fact that Phandalyn isn't actually a Paladin are considered more important than broken quests or worse
Sure, a patch should be properly tested before release, especially if it's big. However, that is absolutely no excuse for having BG2:EE in its current state for almost a year, possibly going well over a year considering the patch's current pre-public-beta state.
Since the last BG2 patch 10 months ago, Beamdog worked on other projects. They released BG:EE 1.3, which is nice, but was not needed like the BG2 patch is. They also released BG:EE for Android, putting out a new product while the one your customers had already bought remains full of bugs, and that's the free market equivalent of flipping off said customers. And the worst offense: they have developed, and are going to release before the BG2 patch, a new EE game.
And don't tell me the people who worked on modernizing and testing IWD couldn't have worked on the BG2 patch instead, because I'm fairly sure those tasks require a very similar skill set. This is bad market behavior, and it shows that as a developer Beamdog cares less for providing proper support for their products than they should.
And then I realized that my IWD:EE preorder badge shows the inconsistency between what I'm spouting above and what I do. Yeah... I have an impulse shopping problem, alright?
Sorry, no. There is always a better word than misdiagnosing a serious medical condition, especially if you're intending that label as an insult.
The work we are doing right now is preparing for beta. There are seventeen open issues; the issues that remain are ones that need to be fixed, and they're worth fixing right.
Do those issues include fixing the issue with Intel GPUs that was introduced in whatever changed for the BGEE 1.3 patch?
Sorry, no. There is always a better word than misdiagnosing a serious medical condition, especially if you're intending that label as an insult.
The work we are doing right now is preparing for beta. There are seventeen open issues; the issues that remain are ones that need to be fixed, and they're worth fixing right.
Do those issues include fixing the issue with Intel GPUs that was introduced in whatever changed for the BGEE 1.3 patch?
I'm unaware of something like that. Are you talking about the issue with your Surface Pro?
It's likely that the same issue will persist, although from what you said before it sounded like the fix was to not do the workaround you had to use prior to the patch; but if it's something you'd like to see looked at more seriously, I recommend posting a bug report in the Bugs section.
Ill save this for when i have time to edit it... its a rant right now... but on a side not: beamdog is not the demon spawn that is EA... and this sure as hell isnt battle field 4... have some perspective...
How about providing the freaking links in the OP, for crying out loud?
What links are you referring to?
The patch is downloaded through the game's launcher, the Beamdog client, or Steam, depending on how you installed it. It's treated as an update to the game; there's no external patch file that you need to download manually.
Comments
I could also point out that @Dee already said that BG2EE 1.3 had under 30 bugs left back in August, or that the last 6 BGEE 1.3 bugs took you guys a month to fix.
Yes, I'm awfully negative, but to the outside observer absolutely nothing seems to have changed even though you guys yourselfs have, again and again, said that it would.
Here we are again though with you guys apparently aiming for some kind of perfect patch when other developers are quite happy to release patches that fix couple, or even just one, issue. This kind of approach to patching seems to be the main cause of your glacial patching speed.
The work we are doing right now is preparing for beta. There are seventeen open issues; the issues that remain are ones that need to be fixed, and they're worth fixing right.
The waiting isn't fun, I know, but we really are getting down to the last few issues; the only unfortunate thing is that those last few issues are significant enough that we can't ignore them. As soon as we're ready for beta testing there will be a lot of information to peruse with regard to everything that's been done. I know that Beta isn't the finish line, but it's the next milestone.
BG:EE's 1.3 beta lasted six months. BG2:EE has been in its current state for almost a year. The smart thing, at this point, would be to release the beta as an actual patch - yes, of course some issues may persist, but the game would still be more stable and playable overall than it currently is. After that, sure, have a beta, tinker as much as you want, and release the end result as a third patch. But withholding basic support for eighteen months at minimum? Have you all lost your minds?
while trying to fix things, you usually break others (or find other things relating that need to be fixed too). In the interim, things can be much much worse than before that fix ...
So it's not as easy (and by far "smart") to release a beta as a patch. Next thing would be people complaining bad patch quality, introducing new bugs instead of reducing their number.
Also, a beta has not got extensive testing before release, so how can a publisher guarantee there are no hidden surprises in the new version he did not even know about yet? it would be plain unprofessional to act that way.
So no wonder they haven't changed their strategy. If it works, why do they need to change it? As the previous beta-testing experience has shown, it's maybe the only way for Beamdog to release the end-product as bug-free as they can.
Yes, we have waited for this patch too long already. But it would be a fail if after such a long wait they release a patch that again has huge bugs and/or cause huge problems. The only way for Beamdog to release a patch that doens't have them is to use the beta-testing stage.
Maybe they could do it all faster. Maybe they had to finish working on BG2EE first, then move to IWDEE. Maybe they could release patches for BG2EE in the winter of 2013-2014.
But now, after all these months, I would choose to wait longer to finally get the most polished version of BG2 ever than to get a temporary patch.
Unless bugs like wrong icons on the ground or the fact that Phandalyn isn't actually a Paladin are considered more important than broken quests or worse
Since the last BG2 patch 10 months ago, Beamdog worked on other projects. They released BG:EE 1.3, which is nice, but was not needed like the BG2 patch is. They also released BG:EE for Android, putting out a new product while the one your customers had already bought remains full of bugs, and that's the free market equivalent of flipping off said customers. And the worst offense: they have developed, and are going to release before the BG2 patch, a new EE game.
And don't tell me the people who worked on modernizing and testing IWD couldn't have worked on the BG2 patch instead, because I'm fairly sure those tasks require a very similar skill set. This is bad market behavior, and it shows that as a developer Beamdog cares less for providing proper support for their products than they should.
And then I realized that my IWD:EE preorder badge shows the inconsistency between what I'm spouting above and what I do. Yeah... I have an impulse shopping problem, alright?
Thank you
Beta!
Beta!
Beta!
What about now?
The patch is downloaded through the game's launcher, the Beamdog client, or Steam, depending on how you installed it. It's treated as an update to the game; there's no external patch file that you need to download manually.