I don't know. I just had a very strong knee-jerk reaction to certain people wanting Dorn to be a Bhaalspawn so much that they treat "No information" as "Well, there's nothing that says he isn't, so he MUST be a Bhaalspawn." And when people disagree, they reiterate the "No information, so it must be so", because that's the outcome they want. Me, I think not, but we'll really find out in BG2. I doubt they would bring it up in the first game anyhow, because we didn't even find out that Imoen was a Bhaalspawn until the second game. I'm just saying, give it a rest. I don't think he will be, but even if he is, I doubt we players will find out until game 2. Why? The original game is CHARNAME's story. Not Imoen's and not Dorn's. It's an intensely personal story, and didn't expand until CHARNAME was kidnapped to Amn.
1, A spiritual conception. Like in the Old Book, the woman is impregnated by Bhalls "Divine Spirit". This would leave no "genetic" traces except his Essence. It does raise questions about why the child is not a clone of hers, however.
Well, it would depend on how this impregnation worked. If it still uses an ovum then it would never generate a clone of the mother. Then the question would be where the other half of the genetic information comes from.
It's kind of a big deal to forget though. Besides, a third Bhaalspawn in the party would cause dramatic changes to the game (for instance, why would Irenicus abduct only the PC and Imoen)
@scriver... spiritual pregnance... so his mother was virgin when she get pregnant? (besides the fact she behavior herself as a hooker...).
So... Is Dorn the new Jesus? ! Of course not but i hope you look now that your entire theory comes from Jesus conception in christian mitology, by the absent of data you made a conception of an entire theory without trustworthy information.
In doubt we wait to see, you can argue that we don't have enough data to discard Dorn as an Bhaalspawn (and i would disagree, the single fact of parents from different races already show us that Dorn isn't a bhaalspawn), but to say that lack of information confirms your argument is crazy.
So... Is Dorn the new Jesus? ! Of course not but i hope you look now that your entire theory comes from Jesus conception in christian mitology, by the absent of data you made a conception of an entire theory without trustworthy information.
No. You might notice I referenced "the Old Book" (the Bible), but it was only to help explain what I was saying. Saying it's "entirely from Christian mythology is like saying example number two is entirely from Greek mythology becaus Zeus, while in the shape of a bull, makes a woman pregnant with the Minotaur; or Norse mythology because Loki gets pregnant with Sleipnir while in the shape of a mare. While similar, none of those myths are the basis for the two theories, though I will admit that their part of the cultural heritage that shapes my views on divine conceptions.
In doubt we wait to see, you can argue that we don't have enough data to discard Dorn as an Bhaalspawn (and i would disagree, the single fact of parents from different races already show us that Dorn isn't a bhaalspawn), but to say that lack of information confirms your argument is crazy.
If you go back and reread my post, I think you can find that not only did I several times say I did not think Dorn was a Bhaalspawn (disregarding the times I've argued that he's not in this thread and others), but also that I am in fact arguing the opposite of what you are saying I am.
@Kamuizin Wouldn't that be "The Anti-Christ", given his alignment? No, I guess more like the Bhaal-Jesus, which acts more like the "Anti-Christ". "Behold, I am Wonder Bread... the Anti-Crust!"
When @LadyRhian stated that all bhaalspawns share the mother's race you replied:
"Have we seen any Bhaalspawn's mother except CHARNAME's and Dorn's? "
By another side there's this quote from you:
"There is nothing suggesting he would be a Bhaalspawn." and "As I said above, there is absolutely no reason to assume so. He shares a name with a Bhaalspawn, but that is irrelevant."
And your last post feel like a defense for Dorn being a bhaalspawn.
Besides your last argument, the others where pretty simple and straight showing that you don't believe him to be a bhaalspawn, but this last one kinda of counter say everything you stated before, for that reason i questioned your last statement.
Ps: The Jesus joke was just an opportunity comment, feel funny when i wrote it, so don't take that to a personal side, cos it isn't personal (don't know if you're christian or not).
And here religion is getting mixed in again. Let's not have another religious discussion, please. It's just getting ridiculous. Dorn's father was an orc, his mother a captured slave woman. Orc + Human = Half-Orc = Dorn. Why is this so hard to grasp for people? Bhaal isn't even implicitely mentioned anywhere. And @Cheesebelly is right. Have you any idea how this would affect BG 2's story? I don't think that's the intention of the dev team.
@Kitteh_On_A_Cloud the fact someone used the words "Jesus" or "christian" doesn't mean another religious debate, i just made a joke, took care of pre-apologise to avoid trouble and @scriver just told he had no problem with it, perceive that your post is the continuation of this begin of a "religious debate".
@kamuizin No! The last thing we want to do is cause offense! After all, it is the crime of all crimes in today's world.
Some wisdom from Salman Rushdie:
"The idea that any kind of free society can be constructed in which people will never be offended or insulted is absurd. So too is the notion that people should have the right to call on the law to defend them against being offended or insulted. A fundamental decision needs to be made: do we want to live in a free society or not?"
This forum is a "meta-community," so I think his question applies just as well.
@kamuizin: I can easily see how this topic is going the religious route, dragging the Bible with it to explain some or the other 'untouched impregnation' of Dorn's mom so he indeed is a Bhaalspawn. Also, my post was a warning to NOT go that route. If it was a continuation, I would have participated in the religious debate, which I'm not. Read the intent of my post, please.
Now we're discussing about discussion... well let's just let it go, before we discuss about the discussion that started the discussion !
Finally, a good call for sure. Kitteh could certainly use to stop making trouble and you could use to not make inanely stupid jokes. There's my two bits that I'm sure *everyone* heartily enjoys.
On that last picture, I am trying to decide if the gold thing is glasses on his eyes, or he sees through the "Eyes" in his helmet and the gold thing is a really extreme nose piercing....
On that last picture, I am trying to decide if the gold thing is glasses on his eyes, or he sees through the "Eyes" in his helmet and the gold thing is a really extreme nose piercing....
Now that you have mentioned it.... It cant be unseen.
@Quartz: Well excuuuse me if I just don't want this topic to go into one or the other weird direction again. We already got religious debates in the Gay Romance topic, I think that's enough. I wasn't even fully participating, so I don't see how I was 'creating trouble' at all. Most of the time I'm pretty much a reasonable person, I think. Anyway, let's finally get on-topic again.
How about we just start discussing what kind of dentist Dorn has? For being a half orc, he surely has some nice teeth!
This. Man, people are spoiled with sexy half-orcs! I mean I guess he has to meet that 17 Charisma requirement somehow, so I suppose it would be all the more difficult to be an influential leader if he were an ugly SOB.
1. Where did you find that beautiful close up. Saved to computer.
2. I dunno. To each their own there, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and all that. I think he's kinda hot. He has that strong man sort of charm about him without losing too much elegance. The goatee helps with that. Umm ... he has good cheekbones, but I guess that's a matter of personal taste as well. Also, for being a half-orc his nose is fairly human, none of this upturned nostrils business.
3. I know you understand this, but I'm saying this just in case someone jumps us: Of course yes, Charisma depends far more on personality than looks, but looks can help. Please don't give us the "DATS NOT WUT CHARISMA MEENS!!" lecture.
Comments
So... Is Dorn the new Jesus?
In doubt we wait to see, you can argue that we don't have enough data to discard Dorn as an Bhaalspawn (and i would disagree, the single fact of parents from different races already show us that Dorn isn't a bhaalspawn), but to say that lack of information confirms your argument is crazy.
No. You might notice I referenced "the Old Book" (the Bible), but it was only to help explain what I was saying. Saying it's "entirely from Christian mythology is like saying example number two is entirely from Greek mythology becaus Zeus, while in the shape of a bull, makes a woman pregnant with the Minotaur; or Norse mythology because Loki gets pregnant with Sleipnir while in the shape of a mare. While similar, none of those myths are the basis for the two theories, though I will admit that their part of the cultural heritage that shapes my views on divine conceptions.
If you go back and reread my post, I think you can find that not only did I several times say I did not think Dorn was a Bhaalspawn (disregarding the times I've argued that he's not in this thread and others), but also that I am in fact arguing the opposite of what you are saying I am.
"Have we seen any Bhaalspawn's mother except CHARNAME's and Dorn's? "
By another side there's this quote from you:
"There is nothing suggesting he would be a Bhaalspawn." and "As I said above, there is absolutely no reason to assume so. He shares a name with a Bhaalspawn, but that is irrelevant."
And your last post feel like a defense for Dorn being a bhaalspawn.
Besides your last argument, the others where pretty simple and straight showing that you don't believe him to be a bhaalspawn, but this last one kinda of counter say everything you stated before, for that reason i questioned your last statement.
Ps: The Jesus joke was just an opportunity comment, feel funny when i wrote it, so don't take that to a personal side, cos it isn't personal (don't know if you're christian or not).
Also I am neither offended nor Christian, I count myself among the agnostic atheists, so no worries.
Some wisdom from Salman Rushdie: This forum is a "meta-community," so I think his question applies just as well.
1. Where did you find that beautiful close up. Saved to computer.
2. I dunno. To each their own there, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and all that. I think he's kinda hot. He has that strong man sort of charm about him without losing too much elegance. The goatee helps with that. Umm ... he has good cheekbones, but I guess that's a matter of personal taste as well. Also, for being a half-orc his nose is fairly human, none of this upturned nostrils business.
3. I know you understand this, but I'm saying this just in case someone jumps us: Of course yes, Charisma depends far more on personality than looks, but looks can help. Please don't give us the "DATS NOT WUT CHARISMA MEENS!!" lecture.