I cannot find the mod again, but I had an Imoen character mod for Neverwinter Nights 2 SoZ (Storm of Zehir occurs a couple of years after ToB events) which really was awesome and gave a very nice backstory to the character, I really enjoyed it. I'll try and find that for you if I can.
Actually, the Imoen Romance mod was recently updated (v. 3.3). It's now officially complete (barring bugfixes) and features both SoA and ToB content. You can get the finished mod here. It's BG2:EE compatible and installs fine on the latest patch.
Now, I have yet to finish my playthrough with it, but from what I've seen so, it is much, much better than most people make it out to be. Actually, there are several misconceptions floating around which I'd like like to specifically address.
Misconception #1: The mod is angsty, violent and features rape and physical abuse. The Imoen Romance mod was originally conceived by a guy called Lord Mirrabbo almost 15 years ago. The version he wrote was very different in tone and featured rape trauma and the option to inflict physical violence through dialogue. This version is the source of much of the infamy that still surrounds the mod today. In 2010 or so, different people took over the development of the mod. It was pretty much rewritten from scratch, the offensive content removed. The writing is still dark(ish) in tone, but (IMHO) very much in line with the canon portrayal of Imoen. I mean, read Imoen's canon dialogues in Chateau Irenicus and tell me they're not dark in tone.
Misconception #2: The mod rubs incest in your face Again, I haven't played through the complete mod yet, but the lovetalks I've seen haven't been anything out of the ordinary. Nothing that I've read suggests that this mod was made with incest-fetishists in mind, a claim many people like to make. Sure, your common origin does get brought up at some point, but I don't think it ever becomes the focal point in Charname's relationship with Imoen.
Now, much could be said about the morality of love between siblings, and I know these forums are not a place for such a debate. However, let me say this: if two consenting adults of sound mind want to engage in a romantic relationship, who are we to say it's wrong or they shouldn't? In fact, can we say anything against consensual incest that could not also be used against more conventional sexual minorities? I've had lengthy debates about this topic, and it amazes me how people who are otherwise very tolerant and LGBT-friendly can be so outright condemning of consensual love between siblings. Yes, they probably shouldn't have children because of genetic makeup, but the same also applies to carriers of hereditary diseases and many island populations (such as Great Britain). Besides, Imoen's not even your sister, but half-sister (at most). But I digress.
Misconception #3: The mod portrays Imoen in a completely uncharacteristic way. This is a matter of opinion more than anything, but all the interjections and lovetalks I have had so far have been very much in keeping with how I've come to picture Imoen in my head. Though Imoen's been through a lot, she's still the mischievous happy-go-lucky gal we all love (or hate). There is a lot of joking and retrospection, as well as some new developments, but nothing that sticks out too much. I'll give my complete impressions once I've finished the game.
Misconception #4: The mod is bug-ridden and nearly impossible to finish due to flaws in programming and design. There are some conditions you need to satisfy for certain lovetalks/events to trigger, and yes, it is possible to screw the romance up if you're insensitive or overly eager to get in her britches. However, the same also applies to Aerie's romance, and if I remember correctly, Jaheira's is pretty easy to screw up as well. As far as bugs go, I haven't experienced any. In fact, so far my experience has been totally seamless.
Misconception #5: The mod features horrible music. Err, well, to each their own. I know some people like her romance theme. Personally, I find it less than stellar, but nothing too out of place.
Welp, this turned out much longer than I intended. If anything, I wish people would give this mod a shot rather than taking what people say at face value. I believe most people who hate this mod have either never played it, or they have played the old version and never taken another look.
Is is possible for this explanation to be provided by the Solar, even if Imoen isn't in your party?
Imoen must be in the party (since she has to witness the whole scene), and I'm fairly certain that either the romance or friendship path has to be active as well.
Imoen's backstory has always struck me as sloppily hazy, in my opinion. Does anyone else have a different point of view?
Apart from the unexplained belt in BGII, I haven't had any issues with the writing. But then my standards are fairly low apparently, as I tend to find entertainment media to be entertaining, something which rubs cultural snobs the wrong way usually. A claim I've seen around the forums a few times though is that Imoen wasn't ever intended to actually have a very big role at all and indeed her inclusion in BGII was very last minute. Don't know how accurate that is, but it would explain her writing being "sloppily hazy" if true I guess?
From what I understand, Imoen was a late addition to BG1, and was originally intended to suffer a plot death midway through BG2, so it wouldn't surprise me if they never really fleshed things out carefully.
Imoen's backstory has always struck me as sloppily hazy, in my opinion. Does anyone else have a different point of view?
Apart from the unexplained belt in BGII, I haven't had any issues with the writing. But then my standards are fairly low apparently, as I tend to find entertainment media to be entertaining, something which rubs cultural snobs the wrong way usually. A claim I've seen around the forums a few times though is that Imoen wasn't ever intended to actually have a very big role at all and indeed her inclusion in BGII was very last minute. Don't know how accurate that is, but it would explain her writing being "sloppily hazy" if true I guess?
Imoen's unexplained belt is actually due to engine limitation. There was no way back then to give her an "impossible to die" effect in Chateau Irenicus, except by giving her a Min1HP belt. These belts are used to prevent plot-related and canonical character from dying (Irenicus, Aran Linvail, Amelyssan, Bodhi etc...). They simply made a special one for Imoen because its the only time a member of your party actually needs it plot-wise, which means it's the only one you have access to in an inventory.
I agree with everything you guys have said and I have nothing against playing the mod. It's more of a personal issue: she is already one of your closest friends (if you're good or neutral, that is), plays a major role in SoA as irenicua hostage and is also one of the most charismatic joinable npc's out there. As a character I feel that making her a romance option is putting too much weight on her shoulders.
Thank you @Ballad for your comments. I'm glad to hear that the mod has been updated and completed. I played with it years ago and really enjoyed it. I look forward to installing it for my next go at BG2.
@Ballad the problem I have with the music besides it not being very good is that it is way too loud. It's about twice as loud as the rest of the game and turning down the sound for each conversation is really annoying.
Other than that, the Imoen romance is the best romance mod I've played and I've played a few.
Same dad. Different mom's. So you're half siblings. Not thrice removed cousins on your brothers aunts side.
You can get silly with the whole race thing and go daddy had you a white boy human and daddy had Imoen a black girl human, since people seem to think skin color and nationality is a different race for some screed up reason.
You + Imoen = mocha baby... but still have same daddy.
So yeah race doesn't apply in this instance.
Personally I dont have an issue. It's make believe fantasy in a game that allows us to play evil characters so why not add some of that taboo in.
Daddy is a depraved evil god of murder and probably would have did himself if it could have fathered another kid to help him ressurect his own hide.
The reason the original game didn't have it is most likely because of above. Same daddy... not good for PR/Sales.
You know, this "incest" thing about Imoen was something quite a few people living in the middle ages experienced. I.e. Anne Boleyn, Henry VIIIs second wife, was accused (among other things) of incest with her brother George - a man she never grew up with and met with first time when she was a grown-up woman, if I remember correctly, and one she was quite flirty with (as well as the rest of the court of Henry VIII). Some historians believe she actually did have intercourse with her brother, in an attempt to conceive a son for Henry VIII. People growing up in different places with the same fathers weren't uncommon, and some of them engaged in romance before they found out who they were. Some also grew up close without knowing they had the same father.
Also, while GRRM takes matters somewhat to the extremes, the Targaryens and their habit of wedding brother and sister as well as the not-so-secret affair between the Lannister siblings in Game of Thrones also has a historic equivalent: ancient Egypt.
My point is simply that even though such behavior isn't condoned today in most civilized countries, it has historic as references as well references in literature, and personally I don't see any problems with it in a fantasy role playing game with a heavy medieval backdrop. To each his (or her) own. It's not like the main character nor Imoen are aware of any of this until Spellhold anyway. But it's not my cup of tea, and therefore I (probably) won't install it. Still, considering Bhaal the "biological" father for both is in my opinion anthropomorphism (where "anthropos" here reads all playable races, of course, not only humans )
What I didn't like about the mod was all the sexual violence. That is very disturbing to me, and I chose not to play it after reading many reviews. No one needs that kind of energy on their life, fictional or not. The "incest" (debatable) thing is easy enough to overlook, but sexual violence is absolutely not, even if it's just words.
@Ballad Thank you for the information on the updated mod. Can you answer some questions for me, based on your experiences so far?
Is there any traces of sexual violence in the mod left over? What do you mean by dark? Is there a lot of sexuality in the mod? This is a personal preference: is there a lot of parenthetical descriptions in the mod? Example: (and her flowing locks rippled in the breeze, and/or she brushed up against your skin, and/or she breathed deeply as you kissed her under the moonlight, and/or insert other cheesy physical description here that is reminiscent of romance novels)
Mmm one second... let me think about the "incest" matter...
You are in a game where you can steal, murder innocents, betray people, including your friend, including betraying them by sacrifying them in a summoning circle, turn yourself into a kind of insane monster-bloody-killing-machine, fuck with evil drows, romance a fucking butcher called Dorn, wreck into a marriage and slaughter all the invitees, pact with devils, kill people during their sleep, help the development of slavery and... incest, something only considered as "bad" merely because it -could- cause some genetic trouble if you have children together, without harming anyone around except the those two, is shocking you?
Are you sure the problem doesn't only lie in your scale of values, here?
@Ballad Thank you for the information on the updated mod. Can you answer some questions for me, based on your experiences so far?
Is there any traces of sexual violence in the mod left over? What do you mean by dark? Is there a lot of sexuality in the mod? This is a personal preference: is there a lot of parenthetical descriptions in the mod? Example: (and her flowing locks rippled in the breeze, and/or she brushed up against your skin, and/or she breathed deeply as you kissed her under the moonlight, and/or insert other cheesy physical description here that is reminiscent of romance novels)
@mashedtaters , thank you for your positive feedback. I'm still in SoA and so can't answer your first and third questions with total certainty. There haven't been any references to sexual violence so far, and I sure hope it keeps that way. Sexuality-wise, well, the mod does assume a (potential) sexual attraction between Charname and Imoen and it does get brought up, albeit (so far) in a covert way. For instance, in one of the early dream sequences you visit an old memory of glimpsing Imoen naked while the two of you went skinny-dipping in a lake near Candlekeep. There is also a dream where she kisses you, and the kiss is detailed in a fairly sexual manner. I didn't find anything wrong with either instance (they are tactfully written) but I can see it not appealing to people who are more interested in befriending rather than romancing Imoen. Then again if that is the case with you, I'd suggest checking out the Imoen Friendship mod instead.
By dark I mean "matching Imoen's canon SoA personality". She's severely shaken by her two consecutive periods of torture and imprisonment by Irenicus. Themes of pain, loss and death get brought up a lot and she needs quite a bit of reassuring and comforting. In the same breath I must stress that there's still a lot of her pre-Irenicus personality left, and this manifests as a healthy dose of light-hearted dialogue and humor.
As for your question about parenthetical descriptions, I regret to inform that yes, parentheses get employed in many of the lovetalks and dream sequences. I am not fan of this style of description either, mainly because it is not used in the unmodded game and therefore sticks out. If you can bring yourself to look past this stylistic flaw, however, I'm sure you'll find that the dialogue itself is very well-written and blends in with the unmodded game.
Anyway, I'll post a more detailed, in-depth review once I finish the game.
From what I understand, Imoen was a late addition to BG1, and was originally intended to suffer a plot death midway through BG2, so it wouldn't surprise me if they never really fleshed things out carefully.
That was indeed intended. She was never supposed to rejoin you in Spellhold, she was supposed to have died from the extraction. If you play the game with this in mind, you will see a lot of "evidence" of this in the dream sequences. Things like Imoen saying "You will come too late. Didn't I say you would come too late?"
And yeah, her original addition to the first game was just so that people could have a good-aligned thief from the start, so they wouldn't have to use Montaron. If he would've been neutral alignment, the series would look a lot different today.
On a fun sidenote, the other superb game of 1998, StarCraft, had the exact same incident where Sarah Kerrigan, who would later become the most iconic StarCraft character and one of the most known video game villains, was also a late addition in the same style as Imoen.
Given how often the gods/titans/etc bone their relatives in various mythic arcs, a romane with Imoen late in ToB has some resonance with ascending to the vacancy left by Bhaal, though the HUGE amounts of value dissonance involved means that no big-name developer would touch it with a 10 foot pole, hence why it will only exist with a community modification.
If you follow that theme, it would make the most sense as a romance that only works if you accept the Solar's final offer, and elevate Imoen with you in some fashion.
IS there any place where I could find the original dark imoen romance mod? I'm eager to read it. So many people pointing that it is dark in tone, that it is making me genuinely curious
@Arthas , you can get it here (files under Lord Mirrabo's original). I haven't tried that version in over a decade and I highly doubt it will install on BG2EE. If you have the energy to read through it, please share your impressions/experiences here. I'm curious as well.
Attention @mashedtaters, @Arthas and others who have asked about my impressions of the Imoen Romance mod.
I just finished the SoA portion of the mod. Since so many people seem interested in the general concept of the mod but are reluctant to try it because of the original version's poor legacy, I thought it would be a good idea to write a review that's also an overview of sorts, giving people an accurate idea what to expect. So without further ado, here's
Ballad's Review of the Imoen Romance modification v3.3, part I, Shadows of Amn
I'm going to start by saying that I'm in no way affiliated with the makers of this mod and all my thoughts and impressions are my own. I came to the mod with very low expectations, driven mostly by curiosity, but also a desire to experience a more "full" Imoen, one that would be on par with her portrayal in BG1NPC project and SoD (both of which I loved). I've always thought Imoen was the most interesting female NPC in the series, yet the original games didn't quite succeed in realizing her potential as Charname's closest companion.
I'll give you the bottom line straight away: the mod delivers. It has exceeded my expectations in every which way and is completely undeserving of the scorn and infamy that surrounds it. I find it well-written, nuanced and emotionally complex. In fact, I'm going out on a limb and say it is better than any of the four original romances in the game. And by better I mean deeper, more detailed and emotionally involving. I find the mod's portrayal of Imoen to be perfectly in line with both the main saga (BG1, SoD and BG2) as well as the writing of the BG1NPC mod. This alone is, in my opinion, a laudable accomplishment.
It is not an easy or uncontroversial experience, however, and neither is it flawless and devoid of its shortcomings. I would definitely recommend it for mature audiences only. In order to enjoy this mod, you need to be open to experiencing themes of sexual attraction between (putative) siblings as well as severe emotional trauma, including a brief allusion to sexual violence (rape). These are heavy topics, although the mod does handle them with the utmost tact. From a gameplay perspective, the mod is easy to navigate and virtually bug-free, though there are a couple of visual hiccups and spelling errors.
To make this very long post more readable, I'm going to divide it into three segments. In the first one, I'll talk about the mod's contents, ie. what is included, what to expect et cetera. I'll also give a short synopsis to those who are curious but not adventurous enough to play the mod for themselves. In the second segment, I'll talk about the writing, that is style, characterization and word choices. Lastly, I'll address issues related to functionality and gameplay mechanics, including scripts, visuals and sound.
1. Content
Basically, the Imoen Romance mod does three things.
First, it improves the original writing and characterization of Imoen by extending some of her (already existing) dialogue sequences. It also fills several gaping holes in the original script by adding new dialogue when it is really called for. For example, when you pick up Imoen at Spellhold, you actually get to introduce her to your party members (I always though it weird that no one said anything in the original game). Take her to your stronghold and she'll have her say. And so on. There are also a lot of new interjections and reactions to game events. In the original game, she was practically a ghost, especially in and around Athkatla. With the mod installed, she'll react to stuff like the Planar Sphere and the Druid Grove. In fact, you might even want to save a couple of quests for Chapter 6 just to see her talk.
Second, the mod adds a lot of new inter-party banter. She'll play with Minsc (and Boo), listen to Keldorn's lectures, get nagged at by Jaheira and so on. If you have Aerie in her party, the two will become fast friends, resulting in a lot of gossiping and joking behind Charname's back. Needless to say, this is a very welcome addition (in the unmodded game, she has virtually no banter with anyone).
Third, there is the romance component, undoubtedly the mod's main offering. Now, it is very important to understand that the mod assumes a latent romantic/sexual attraction between Charname and Imoen. Your relationship is already established, you've known each other since childhood, grown up together and been on the road ever since Sarevok killed your foster father. You've always looked after each other's backs, been best friends, but there's always been one possibility left unexplored. Now, with Imoen kidnapped, the latent feelings start bubbling up. In short, by installing the mod, you acknowledge the possibility of you being more than friends/siblings. If this bothers you, don't install the mod.
Down the road, you can choose to stay friends. However, it is very clearly not the intended path for the player to take. This is a romance mod first, a friendship mod second.
Thematically, the mod was written with a good aligned player in mind. There are selfish/evil choices, but they always result in the termination of your relationship. Also, if you are playing a callous/evil/power-obsessed Charname, you'll likely find the dream sequences / dialogues too mushy and the allusions to your shared experiences too, well, unrealistic. Imoen is much like Aerie in that she likes her guys and gals caring, empathetic, wise, but also strong and decisive. If your Charname doesn't fit that profile, you are not going to get much out of this mod.
Now, onto the specifics. There is one lovetalk in Chateau Irenicus (not much of a lovetalk really). After Imoen's taken in, there are three new dream sequences which happen after you've had the original three. These dreams are about your relationship with Imoen rather than Irenicus and your heritage. The actual romance starts when you rescue her, that is, in Chapter 4. There are six or so lovetalks that happen after you escape Spellhold (in the Underdark). In these talks, Imoen will confess to also having had dreams about you, too. Daydreams, to be specific. Eventually, she'll tell you what went down in Spellhold while you were hunting trolls and dragons around Athkatla. This is probably the most emotionally challenging part of the mod as it includes an allusion to sexual violence. Since people are going to ask, I've included a full spoiler below:
Imoen recounts how Irenicus started experimenting on her. At first, it was bearable. As the days went on, however, it got much worse. Irenicus, it seems, become increasingly frustrated by Imoen's capacity to resist the taint within her. When no amount of torture and pain would yield results, Irenicus had a duergar slave have his way with Imoen, who, weakened by torture, had no energy to put up a fight. The incident broke Imoen's spirit, and she turned into the Slayer, tearing the duergar to pieces. Next day, Irenicus was able to drain Imoen of her soul.
Now, despite being very hard to read, I was favourably impressed by how well the mod addressed the issue. It is very tactfully written, and you actually feel her pain as she recounts it. When I first read through it, it actually made me cry, no kidding. It doesn't feel unnecessary or out of place as I had feared; actually, it fits right in with the other atrocities Irenicus has committed and gives you a real reason to hate the man.
After you get out of the Underdark, Imoen will prompt you to camp. This only happens if you've had all the necessary lovetalks while in the Underdark, so it is advisable to take your time while there. What results is probably the most memorable and well-executed romance scene I've seen in a video game, period. If you want to spoil yourself, read on below:
Imoen calls for the party to make a campfire that night. Seated in a circle, she pulls out a magical instrument and begins to play. It is revealed that Winthrop used to be a bard of sorts before settling down in Candlekeep and taught Imoen how to play. She then performs a ballad that draws on her recent emotions and experiences, to the great surprise and delight of the party. A lot of pent up emotion is released.
Next morning, Imoen wakes Charname up with a bucket of cold water. You get the choice to chase her, and if you do, you run after her into the forest. When you catch her, the two of you roll in the grass. This marks a turning point for the story: you can either kiss her and have sex, becoming lovers, or play it off, staying friends.
After the campfire scene, there is one more lovetalk which happens a day or so after you get Imoen's soul back from Bodhi. From a gameplay perspective, it is perhaps the most difficult one to get right. Basically, Imoen is convinced that your relationship is wrong and you have to talk her into believing otherwise. If you get it right, the SoA portion of the romance will finish on a happy note. If not, well, you can still be friends.
2. Writing
In general, I thought the mod was very well-written. It does take its liberties, both thematically and stylistically, however. The writers of this mod had balls (figuratively; the lead writer's a woman) - the mod does not aim to be unobtrusive and quietly blend in with the rest of the game. It clearly wants to rouse the player and make the game events feel more immediate and visceral.
There are a lot of descriptive passages written in parentheses among spoken lines. Personally, I wish the writers would have separated the descriptions from the dialogue, making them different strings as in the main game. This is a minor complaint, however, and doesn't take away from the experience once you get used to it.
Personally, I found Imoen's portrayal to be spot on. That is, she really feels and sounds like the Imoen from BG1, SoD and vanilla BG2. In fact, I sometimes even forgot that her voiced dialogues were not part of the mod. Though the mod was written before SoD was even conceived, there is no inconsistency between the expansion's events and the mod's writing (though obviously the events of SoD are not referred to as such). This is, in my opinion, the mod's greatest achievement.
There are also some things that aren't that great. Though I really liked the overall tone and atmosphere of the mod, I didn't think much of the way the incest issue got brought up towards the end. I suppose it was unavoidable - after all, the game makes it clear you are related. However, it gets too much limelight IMO - it almost feels as though the mod is trying to create an issue where there isn't one. To give you an example:
If you have Jaheira in your party, she will be openly disapproving of your relationship, going on a tirade how perverted and against the natural order of things it is. Now, I found her reaction to be distasteful and out of character - more fitting to some fundie loon with a lack of wisdom and common sense (*cough* Anomen) than a mature druid with her both feet on the ground. Surprisingly, Keldorn's comments were much more level-headed and in keeping with his original writing. He even goes on to give his blessings, though he says your actions are against what he's been taught at the order.
Finally, there were a couple of instances in the wording I did not agree with. In one of the dream sequences, a younger version of Charname is referred to as "teen guy", an expression I found both too contemporary and American. Why not "young lad" or something to that effect? There is also the occasional spelling error and typographical mistake (too many spaces, bad punctuation), though nothing too obtrusive.
3. Functionality
One of the biggest complaints directed at the Imoen Romance mod is that it is buggy and very easy to screw up. My experiences were on the contrary: aside from some minor visual errors, I didn't encounter a single bug during my playthrough. I also found the mod to be very intuitive to navigate. So long as you don't rush your way through the game, there is little chance you're going to miss a dialogue or a lovetalk. Also, the romance is fairly easy to complete successfully. Unlike with Viconia and Jaheira, you don't have to play games or wait for a specific scripted event to occur.
All the lovetalks except the campfire scene are on a timer and occur between 40 real life minutes of in-game time. They are not bound to specific events in the main plot, so you can skip stuff like the Sahuagin city and Ust Natha without the fear of running into a dead end. Even if you don't get all the lovetalks while in the Underdark, I've been told you can still get the campfire scene and finish the romance later in the game.
Most lovetalks are very easy to see through. Don't be a tactless douchebag and you'll do fine. I've heard some of the dialogue options only work if you have a sufficiently high wisdom score. I can't personally confirm or deny this rumor: my charname had 16 Wis and I was able to complete the romance successfully. During the more difficult sequences, you need to be sympathetic to Imoen's emotions while staying true to your own needs and feelings.
The bulk of the mods contents come in the form of dialogue, but there are a couple of cutscenes, mainly the dream sequences. These are well-executed, for the most part. I did encounter one awkward scripting error during one of the dreams where a younger version of my gnomish Charname had a mismatching sprite (elf). It was unintentionally hilarious, especially since the game goes on to tell you how you feel "smaller and akwardly proportioned". In another dream, there were visible seams between the background textures, which was a bit jarring.
The mod has a soundtrack of its own. Though I didn't think much of the music at first, it has since grown on me. It serves the atmosphere and Imoen's character well. There is one keyboard piece, in particular, that I've grown really fond of, but also another one which I still dislike (it sounds too much like a baby's lullaby). A lot of people complain about the music being too loud, but I found it to be the same volume as the rest of the in-game music.
Compatibility-wise, the mod seems compatible with most other mods, such as Unfinished Business, the two banter packs and SCS. I am not sure how well it matches with the Imoen friendship mod, but my instincts would advice against running both at the same time.
Finally, the mod has an option for running concurrent romances with the existing NPCs in game. Now, this is a matter of taste more than anything - personally, I find two-timing to be immersion-breaking, but to each their own.
Conclusion (tl;dr)
Despite its poor reputation, the Imoen Romance is a damn fine mod and ranks among the top NPC/story mods I've played in any CRPG. It isn't as polished and streamlined as the BG1NPC project, nor is it for everyone. In order to enjoy this mod, you need to be open-minded and tolerant, both of style and substance. You should also expect to be challenged emotionally. Most of all, you really need to like Imoen and be willing to see her as more than just a one-dimensional plot-device.
Play this mod if: - Imoen has a special place in your heart. - You are not offended by emotionally difficult and complex themes such as violence, self-doubt and sexual attraction between siblings. - You are not turned off by a few minor textual and visual errors.
Don't play this mod if: - You don't care much for Imoen or - play an evil Charname or - romantic and emotionally expressive writing gives you the creeps or - you demand absolute polish and perfection from your mods.
That's it for the SoA portion of the mod. I'll write a follow-up once I finish the Throne of Bhaal. Hopefully, it'll turn out a bit shorter. Heh.
@Ballad Glad to see some love for the Imoen romance mod, especially after all the undeserved hate it got. And you will like the ToB portion (the best part of the rewritten version imo ).
What if Charname is a dwarf, halfling, or gnome? Since there are no "half" varieties of those, one can assume that fertile cross-breeding between those races and humans is biologically impossible.
Thank you for the review @Ballad! I really look forward to completing my current BG run and getting started on BG2. I remembered Imoen recounting what happened to her during Spellhold from my playthrough years ago, and thinking at the time "Wow...**** that guy. Let's go kill him." The mod was well done then (maybe I downloaded a slightly newer, less dark version than the original?) and it sounds like it's even better now!
In another dream, there were visible seams between the background textures, which was a bit jarring.
The mod has a soundtrack of its own. Though I didn't think much of the music at first, it has since grown on me. It serves the atmosphere and Imoen's character well. There is one keyboard piece, in particular, that I've grown really fond of, but also another one which I still dislike (it sounds too much like a baby's lullaby). A lot of people complain about the music being too loud, but I found it to be the same volume as the rest of the in-game music.
Compatibility-wise, the mod seems compatible with most other mods, such as Unfinished Business, the two banter packs and SCS. I am not sure how well it matches with the Imoen friendship mod, but my instincts would advice against running both at the same time.
Hey i'm glad you enjoyed the mod, i'm the coder for it (not the writer that was Israel).
To address some common concern's that people are confused if its still an issue or not.
1. The seams you describe is actually an engine bug introduced in 2.0 BG2EE (ie the last update for this game) this occur's everywhere but is particularly noticeable if you look at water tiles.
2. The mod's music was indeed once too loud (i noticed this too) so around version 2.5 of the mod which was awhile ago, i quietened it down
3. We introduced a change around to make the prompt to camp better for the player, so it'll occur when you've progressed through the romance enough regardless, Prior to this you needed to get to a point of the romance before exitting the underdark, this was done in Version 3.0 (ie when TOB content was first released).
The mod has been made compatible at least with Ascension, the Big World setup, Baldurs Gate Trilogy.
Also i am hearing that the Tweak pack component 'Fixing Imoen interactions in ToB' breaks imoen so watch out for that.
Is there any chance there's a version of this without the, you know, romance part of the mod? I like the sound of giving Imoen some actual banters/reactions, but I REALLY don't want a romance option.
Is there any chance there's a version of this without the, you know, romance part of the mod? I like the sound of giving Imoen some actual banters/reactions, but I REALLY don't want a romance option.
You do NOT have to romance her, with the mod installed.
Comments
Now, I have yet to finish my playthrough with it, but from what I've seen so, it is much, much better than most people make it out to be. Actually, there are several misconceptions floating around which I'd like like to specifically address.
Misconception #1: The mod is angsty, violent and features rape and physical abuse.
The Imoen Romance mod was originally conceived by a guy called Lord Mirrabbo almost 15 years ago. The version he wrote was very different in tone and featured rape trauma and the option to inflict physical violence through dialogue. This version is the source of much of the infamy that still surrounds the mod today. In 2010 or so, different people took over the development of the mod. It was pretty much rewritten from scratch, the offensive content removed. The writing is still dark(ish) in tone, but (IMHO) very much in line with the canon portrayal of Imoen. I mean, read Imoen's canon dialogues in Chateau Irenicus and tell me they're not dark in tone.
Misconception #2: The mod rubs incest in your face
Again, I haven't played through the complete mod yet, but the lovetalks I've seen haven't been anything out of the ordinary. Nothing that I've read suggests that this mod was made with incest-fetishists in mind, a claim many people like to make. Sure, your common origin does get brought up at some point, but I don't think it ever becomes the focal point in Charname's relationship with Imoen.
Now, much could be said about the morality of love between siblings, and I know these forums are not a place for such a debate. However, let me say this: if two consenting adults of sound mind want to engage in a romantic relationship, who are we to say it's wrong or they shouldn't? In fact, can we say anything against consensual incest that could not also be used against more conventional sexual minorities? I've had lengthy debates about this topic, and it amazes me how people who are otherwise very tolerant and LGBT-friendly can be so outright condemning of consensual love between siblings. Yes, they probably shouldn't have children because of genetic makeup, but the same also applies to carriers of hereditary diseases and many island populations (such as Great Britain). Besides, Imoen's not even your sister, but half-sister (at most). But I digress.
Misconception #3: The mod portrays Imoen in a completely uncharacteristic way.
This is a matter of opinion more than anything, but all the interjections and lovetalks I have had so far have been very much in keeping with how I've come to picture Imoen in my head. Though Imoen's been through a lot, she's still the mischievous happy-go-lucky gal we all love (or hate). There is a lot of joking and retrospection, as well as some new developments, but nothing that sticks out too much. I'll give my complete impressions once I've finished the game.
Misconception #4: The mod is bug-ridden and nearly impossible to finish due to flaws in programming and design.
There are some conditions you need to satisfy for certain lovetalks/events to trigger, and yes, it is possible to screw the romance up if you're insensitive or overly eager to get in her britches. However, the same also applies to Aerie's romance, and if I remember correctly, Jaheira's is pretty easy to screw up as well. As far as bugs go, I haven't experienced any. In fact, so far my experience has been totally seamless.
Misconception #5: The mod features horrible music.
Err, well, to each their own. I know some people like her romance theme. Personally, I find it less than stellar, but nothing too out of place.
Welp, this turned out much longer than I intended. If anything, I wish people would give this mod a shot rather than taking what people say at face value. I believe most people who hate this mod have either never played it, or they have played the old version and never taken another look.
Other than that, the Imoen romance is the best romance mod I've played and I've played a few.
The current version is 3.5 which is what you will get when you download the mod, the main page of the website might say 3.3 but its 3.5
You can get silly with the whole race thing and go daddy had you a white boy human and daddy had Imoen a black girl human, since people seem to think skin color and nationality is a different race for some screed up reason.
You + Imoen = mocha baby... but still have same daddy.
So yeah race doesn't apply in this instance.
Personally I dont have an issue. It's make believe fantasy in a game that allows us to play evil characters so why not add some of that taboo in.
Daddy is a depraved evil god of murder and probably would have did himself if it could have fathered another kid to help him ressurect his own hide.
The reason the original game didn't have it is most likely because of above. Same daddy... not good for PR/Sales.
Also, while GRRM takes matters somewhat to the extremes, the Targaryens and their habit of wedding brother and sister as well as the not-so-secret affair between the Lannister siblings in Game of Thrones also has a historic equivalent: ancient Egypt.
My point is simply that even though such behavior isn't condoned today in most civilized countries, it has historic as references as well references in literature, and personally I don't see any problems with it in a fantasy role playing game with a heavy medieval backdrop. To each his (or her) own. It's not like the main character nor Imoen are aware of any of this until Spellhold anyway. But it's not my cup of tea, and therefore I (probably) won't install it.
Still, considering Bhaal the "biological" father for both is in my opinion anthropomorphism (where "anthropos" here reads all playable races, of course, not only humans
@Ballad
Thank you for the information on the updated mod. Can you answer some questions for me, based on your experiences so far?
Is there any traces of sexual violence in the mod left over?
What do you mean by dark?
Is there a lot of sexuality in the mod?
This is a personal preference: is there a lot of parenthetical descriptions in the mod? Example: (and her flowing locks rippled in the breeze, and/or she brushed up against your skin, and/or she breathed deeply as you kissed her under the moonlight, and/or insert other cheesy physical description here that is reminiscent of romance novels)
You are in a game where you can steal, murder innocents, betray people, including your friend, including betraying them by sacrifying them in a summoning circle, turn yourself into a kind of insane monster-bloody-killing-machine, fuck with evil drows, romance a fucking butcher called Dorn, wreck into a marriage and slaughter all the invitees, pact with devils, kill people during their sleep, help the development of slavery and... incest, something only considered as "bad" merely because it -could- cause some genetic trouble if you have children together, without harming anyone around except the those two, is shocking you?
Are you sure the problem doesn't only lie in your scale of values, here?
By dark I mean "matching Imoen's canon SoA personality". She's severely shaken by her two consecutive periods of torture and imprisonment by Irenicus. Themes of pain, loss and death get brought up a lot and she needs quite a bit of reassuring and comforting. In the same breath I must stress that there's still a lot of her pre-Irenicus personality left, and this manifests as a healthy dose of light-hearted dialogue and humor.
As for your question about parenthetical descriptions, I regret to inform that yes, parentheses get employed in many of the lovetalks and dream sequences. I am not fan of this style of description either, mainly because it is not used in the unmodded game and therefore sticks out. If you can bring yourself to look past this stylistic flaw, however, I'm sure you'll find that the dialogue itself is very well-written and blends in with the unmodded game.
Anyway, I'll post a more detailed, in-depth review once I finish the game.
And yeah, her original addition to the first game was just so that people could have a good-aligned thief from the start, so they wouldn't have to use Montaron. If he would've been neutral alignment, the series would look a lot different today.
On a fun sidenote, the other superb game of 1998, StarCraft, had the exact same incident where Sarah Kerrigan, who would later become the most iconic StarCraft character and one of the most known video game villains, was also a late addition in the same style as Imoen.
If you follow that theme, it would make the most sense as a romance that only works if you accept the Solar's final offer, and elevate Imoen with you in some fashion.
I just finished the SoA portion of the mod. Since so many people seem interested in the general concept of the mod but are reluctant to try it because of the original version's poor legacy, I thought it would be a good idea to write a review that's also an overview of sorts, giving people an accurate idea what to expect. So without further ado, here's
Ballad's Review of the Imoen Romance modification v3.3, part I, Shadows of Amn
I'm going to start by saying that I'm in no way affiliated with the makers of this mod and all my thoughts and impressions are my own. I came to the mod with very low expectations, driven mostly by curiosity, but also a desire to experience a more "full" Imoen, one that would be on par with her portrayal in BG1NPC project and SoD (both of which I loved). I've always thought Imoen was the most interesting female NPC in the series, yet the original games didn't quite succeed in realizing her potential as Charname's closest companion.I'll give you the bottom line straight away: the mod delivers. It has exceeded my expectations in every which way and is completely undeserving of the scorn and infamy that surrounds it. I find it well-written, nuanced and emotionally complex. In fact, I'm going out on a limb and say it is better than any of the four original romances in the game. And by better I mean deeper, more detailed and emotionally involving. I find the mod's portrayal of Imoen to be perfectly in line with both the main saga (BG1, SoD and BG2) as well as the writing of the BG1NPC mod. This alone is, in my opinion, a laudable accomplishment.
It is not an easy or uncontroversial experience, however, and neither is it flawless and devoid of its shortcomings. I would definitely recommend it for mature audiences only. In order to enjoy this mod, you need to be open to experiencing themes of sexual attraction between (putative) siblings as well as severe emotional trauma, including a brief allusion to sexual violence (rape). These are heavy topics, although the mod does handle them with the utmost tact. From a gameplay perspective, the mod is easy to navigate and virtually bug-free, though there are a couple of visual hiccups and spelling errors.
To make this very long post more readable, I'm going to divide it into three segments. In the first one, I'll talk about the mod's contents, ie. what is included, what to expect et cetera. I'll also give a short synopsis to those who are curious but not adventurous enough to play the mod for themselves. In the second segment, I'll talk about the writing, that is style, characterization and word choices. Lastly, I'll address issues related to functionality and gameplay mechanics, including scripts, visuals and sound.
1. Content
Basically, the Imoen Romance mod does three things.First, it improves the original writing and characterization of Imoen by extending some of her (already existing) dialogue sequences. It also fills several gaping holes in the original script by adding new dialogue when it is really called for. For example, when you pick up Imoen at Spellhold, you actually get to introduce her to your party members (I always though it weird that no one said anything in the original game). Take her to your stronghold and she'll have her say. And so on. There are also a lot of new interjections and reactions to game events. In the original game, she was practically a ghost, especially in and around Athkatla. With the mod installed, she'll react to stuff like the Planar Sphere and the Druid Grove. In fact, you might even want to save a couple of quests for Chapter 6 just to see her talk.
Second, the mod adds a lot of new inter-party banter. She'll play with Minsc (and Boo), listen to Keldorn's lectures, get nagged at by Jaheira and so on. If you have Aerie in her party, the two will become fast friends, resulting in a lot of gossiping and joking behind Charname's back. Needless to say, this is a very welcome addition (in the unmodded game, she has virtually no banter with anyone).
Third, there is the romance component, undoubtedly the mod's main offering. Now, it is very important to understand that the mod assumes a latent romantic/sexual attraction between Charname and Imoen. Your relationship is already established, you've known each other since childhood, grown up together and been on the road ever since Sarevok killed your foster father. You've always looked after each other's backs, been best friends, but there's always been one possibility left unexplored. Now, with Imoen kidnapped, the latent feelings start bubbling up. In short, by installing the mod, you acknowledge the possibility of you being more than friends/siblings. If this bothers you, don't install the mod.
Down the road, you can choose to stay friends. However, it is very clearly not the intended path for the player to take. This is a romance mod first, a friendship mod second.
Thematically, the mod was written with a good aligned player in mind. There are selfish/evil choices, but they always result in the termination of your relationship. Also, if you are playing a callous/evil/power-obsessed Charname, you'll likely find the dream sequences / dialogues too mushy and the allusions to your shared experiences too, well, unrealistic. Imoen is much like Aerie in that she likes her guys and gals caring, empathetic, wise, but also strong and decisive. If your Charname doesn't fit that profile, you are not going to get much out of this mod.
Now, onto the specifics. There is one lovetalk in Chateau Irenicus (not much of a lovetalk really). After Imoen's taken in, there are three new dream sequences which happen after you've had the original three. These dreams are about your relationship with Imoen rather than Irenicus and your heritage. The actual romance starts when you rescue her, that is, in Chapter 4. There are six or so lovetalks that happen after you escape Spellhold (in the Underdark). In these talks, Imoen will confess to also having had dreams about you, too. Daydreams, to be specific. Eventually, she'll tell you what went down in Spellhold while you were hunting trolls and dragons around Athkatla. This is probably the most emotionally challenging part of the mod as it includes an allusion to sexual violence. Since people are going to ask, I've included a full spoiler below:
Imoen recounts how Irenicus started experimenting on her. At first, it was bearable. As the days went on, however, it got much worse. Irenicus, it seems, become increasingly frustrated by Imoen's capacity to resist the taint within her. When no amount of torture and pain would yield results, Irenicus had a duergar slave have his way with Imoen, who, weakened by torture, had no energy to put up a fight. The incident broke Imoen's spirit, and she turned into the Slayer, tearing the duergar to pieces. Next day, Irenicus was able to drain Imoen of her soul.
Now, despite being very hard to read, I was favourably impressed by how well the mod addressed the issue. It is very tactfully written, and you actually feel her pain as she recounts it. When I first read through it, it actually made me cry, no kidding. It doesn't feel unnecessary or out of place as I had feared; actually, it fits right in with the other atrocities Irenicus has committed and gives you a real reason to hate the man.
After you get out of the Underdark, Imoen will prompt you to camp. This only happens if you've had all the necessary lovetalks while in the Underdark, so it is advisable to take your time while there. What results is probably the most memorable and well-executed romance scene I've seen in a video game, period. If you want to spoil yourself, read on below:
Next morning, Imoen wakes Charname up with a bucket of cold water. You get the choice to chase her, and if you do, you run after her into the forest. When you catch her, the two of you roll in the grass. This marks a turning point for the story: you can either kiss her and have sex, becoming lovers, or play it off, staying friends.
After the campfire scene, there is one more lovetalk which happens a day or so after you get Imoen's soul back from Bodhi. From a gameplay perspective, it is perhaps the most difficult one to get right. Basically, Imoen is convinced that your relationship is wrong and you have to talk her into believing otherwise. If you get it right, the SoA portion of the romance will finish on a happy note. If not, well, you can still be friends.
2. Writing
In general, I thought the mod was very well-written. It does take its liberties, both thematically and stylistically, however. The writers of this mod had balls (figuratively; the lead writer's a woman) - the mod does not aim to be unobtrusive and quietly blend in with the rest of the game. It clearly wants to rouse the player and make the game events feel more immediate and visceral.There are a lot of descriptive passages written in parentheses among spoken lines. Personally, I wish the writers would have separated the descriptions from the dialogue, making them different strings as in the main game. This is a minor complaint, however, and doesn't take away from the experience once you get used to it.
Personally, I found Imoen's portrayal to be spot on. That is, she really feels and sounds like the Imoen from BG1, SoD and vanilla BG2. In fact, I sometimes even forgot that her voiced dialogues were not part of the mod. Though the mod was written before SoD was even conceived, there is no inconsistency between the expansion's events and the mod's writing (though obviously the events of SoD are not referred to as such). This is, in my opinion, the mod's greatest achievement.
There are also some things that aren't that great. Though I really liked the overall tone and atmosphere of the mod, I didn't think much of the way the incest issue got brought up towards the end. I suppose it was unavoidable - after all, the game makes it clear you are related. However, it gets too much limelight IMO - it almost feels as though the mod is trying to create an issue where there isn't one. To give you an example:
Finally, there were a couple of instances in the wording I did not agree with. In one of the dream sequences, a younger version of Charname is referred to as "teen guy", an expression I found both too contemporary and American. Why not "young lad" or something to that effect? There is also the occasional spelling error and typographical mistake (too many spaces, bad punctuation), though nothing too obtrusive.
3. Functionality
One of the biggest complaints directed at the Imoen Romance mod is that it is buggy and very easy to screw up. My experiences were on the contrary: aside from some minor visual errors, I didn't encounter a single bug during my playthrough. I also found the mod to be very intuitive to navigate. So long as you don't rush your way through the game, there is little chance you're going to miss a dialogue or a lovetalk. Also, the romance is fairly easy to complete successfully. Unlike with Viconia and Jaheira, you don't have to play games or wait for a specific scripted event to occur.All the lovetalks except the campfire scene are on a timer and occur between 40 real life minutes of in-game time. They are not bound to specific events in the main plot, so you can skip stuff like the Sahuagin city and Ust Natha without the fear of running into a dead end. Even if you don't get all the lovetalks while in the Underdark, I've been told you can still get the campfire scene and finish the romance later in the game.
Most lovetalks are very easy to see through. Don't be a tactless douchebag and you'll do fine. I've heard some of the dialogue options only work if you have a sufficiently high wisdom score. I can't personally confirm or deny this rumor: my charname had 16 Wis and I was able to complete the romance successfully. During the more difficult sequences, you need to be sympathetic to Imoen's emotions while staying true to your own needs and feelings.
The bulk of the mods contents come in the form of dialogue, but there are a couple of cutscenes, mainly the dream sequences. These are well-executed, for the most part. I did encounter one awkward scripting error during one of the dreams where a younger version of my gnomish Charname had a mismatching sprite (elf). It was unintentionally hilarious, especially since the game goes on to tell you how you feel "smaller and akwardly proportioned". In another dream, there were visible seams between the background textures, which was a bit jarring.
The mod has a soundtrack of its own. Though I didn't think much of the music at first, it has since grown on me. It serves the atmosphere and Imoen's character well. There is one keyboard piece, in particular, that I've grown really fond of, but also another one which I still dislike (it sounds too much like a baby's lullaby). A lot of people complain about the music being too loud, but I found it to be the same volume as the rest of the in-game music.
Compatibility-wise, the mod seems compatible with most other mods, such as Unfinished Business, the two banter packs and SCS. I am not sure how well it matches with the Imoen friendship mod, but my instincts would advice against running both at the same time.
Finally, the mod has an option for running concurrent romances with the existing NPCs in game. Now, this is a matter of taste more than anything - personally, I find two-timing to be immersion-breaking, but to each their own.
Conclusion (tl;dr)
Despite its poor reputation, the Imoen Romance is a damn fine mod and ranks among the top NPC/story mods I've played in any CRPG. It isn't as polished and streamlined as the BG1NPC project, nor is it for everyone. In order to enjoy this mod, you need to be open-minded and tolerant, both of style and substance. You should also expect to be challenged emotionally. Most of all, you really need to like Imoen and be willing to see her as more than just a one-dimensional plot-device.Play this mod if:
- Imoen has a special place in your heart.
- You are not offended by emotionally difficult and complex themes such as violence, self-doubt and sexual attraction between siblings.
- You are not turned off by a few minor textual and visual errors.
Don't play this mod if:
- You don't care much for Imoen or
- play an evil Charname or
- romantic and emotionally expressive writing gives you the creeps or
- you demand absolute polish and perfection from your mods.
That's it for the SoA portion of the mod. I'll write a follow-up once I finish the Throne of Bhaal. Hopefully, it'll turn out a bit shorter. Heh.
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Half-dwarf
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Half-goblin
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Half-gnoll
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Half-ogre
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Half-drow
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Half-dragon
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Half-fiend
To address some common concern's that people are confused if its still an issue or not.
1. The seams you describe is actually an engine bug introduced in 2.0 BG2EE (ie the last update for this game) this occur's everywhere but is particularly noticeable if you look at water tiles.
2. The mod's music was indeed once too loud (i noticed this too) so around version 2.5 of the mod which was awhile ago, i quietened it down
3. We introduced a change around to make the prompt to camp better for the player, so it'll occur when you've progressed through the romance enough regardless, Prior to this you needed to get to a point of the romance before exitting the underdark, this was done in Version 3.0 (ie when TOB content was first released).
The mod has been made compatible at least with Ascension, the Big World setup, Baldurs Gate Trilogy.
Also i am hearing that the Tweak pack component 'Fixing Imoen interactions in ToB' breaks imoen so watch out for that.
Let me see if I can find it ...
PS: http://www.spellholdstudios.net/ie/imoenfriendship
I don't know wether or not it works with EE though