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Book/TV/Movie tropes you just can't stand anymore

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  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,938

    Have you noticed how many games there are where there's a "silence" status effect which prevents characters from casting spells, even though nobody actually says incantations while casting the spells? The only games I can think of where people say things while casting spells are DnD games.

    That's why I think it would have been a good idea to have spells broken down into verbal, somatic, and material components. Old 1st ed AD&D included this and it would have added an interesting component to spellcasting. Some spells only had somatic, so no voice needed. And the material components were expensive with some spells so could lead to a small side quest in itself.
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,975
    ThacoBell said:

    Have you noticed how many games there are where there's a "silence" status effect which prevents characters from casting spells, even though nobody actually says incantations while casting the spells? The only games I can think of where people say things while casting spells are DnD games.

    True, although do other D&D games do it besides the Infinity Engine games?
    Neverwinter Nights games do it.
    Every JRPG ever.
    I don't recall them saying incantations in ffx or ffx-2

  • themazingnessthemazingness Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 702
    Zaghoul said:

    Have you noticed how many games there are where there's a "silence" status effect which prevents characters from casting spells, even though nobody actually says incantations while casting the spells? The only games I can think of where people say things while casting spells are DnD games.

    That's why I think it would have been a good idea to have spells broken down into verbal, somatic, and material components. Old 1st ed AD&D included this and it would have added an interesting component to spellcasting. Some spells only had somatic, so no voice needed. And the material components were expensive with some spells so could lead to a small side quest in itself.
    For this reason I feel verbal spells shouldn't be inhibited by heavy armor, and somatic and component spells should only be inhibited by movent-impairing spells. But I can see how it is easier to say silence symbolically limits verbal and nonverbal spell communication, and heavy armor inhibits all arcane magic.
  • mlnevesemlnevese Member, Moderator Posts: 10,214

    They're invading...

    New york... It's always New York... You can count on your fingers how many movies do not start the zombie apocalypse/alien invasion/whatever in New York...
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,938
    mlnevese said:

    They're invading...

    New york... It's always New York... You can count on your fingers how many movies do not start the zombie apocalypse/alien invasion/whatever in New York...
    Hehheh, yep. BUT viruses do love big population centers, so maybe aliens like them as areas with larger food sources as well. Speaking of NY, Escape From New York's idea of turning it into an isolated national prison center maybe just figured the same thing, ALL the crap happening in NY. :)
  • batoorbatoor Member Posts: 676
    edited April 2017
    mlnevese said:

    They're invading...

    New york... It's always New York... You can count on your fingers how many movies do not start the zombie apocalypse/alien invasion/whatever in New York...
    Speaking more broadly...But aren't practically all supernatural/fantasy in tv shows/films taking place in america? Even when the catastrophe is world spanning, somehow the story hardly ever changes the setting through the seasons. It makes sense because most of the production/creation of the show takes place in america, but it still ends up being repetitive and limiting after too many shows have done it^^
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,938



    For this reason I feel verbal spells shouldn't be inhibited by heavy armor, and somatic and component spells should only be inhibited by movent-impairing spells. But I can see how it is easier to say silence symbolically limits verbal and nonverbal spell communication, and heavy armor inhibits all arcane magic.

    @themazingness Yep, easier. But details sure make things stand out. At least we have the tweaks mods that allows casting in armor with a chance of failure, for a start. Kinda like spellcasting arm movements apparently being hard coded into the game (wierd with power word spells).



  • ArdanisArdanis Member Posts: 1,736
    mlnevese said:

    They're invading...

    New york... It's always New York... You can count on your fingers how many movies do not start the zombie apocalypse/alien invasion/whatever in New York...
    Depends on what you're watching, for me it's usually Tokyo :D
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    sarevok57 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    Have you noticed how many games there are where there's a "silence" status effect which prevents characters from casting spells, even though nobody actually says incantations while casting the spells? The only games I can think of where people say things while casting spells are DnD games.

    True, although do other D&D games do it besides the Infinity Engine games?
    Neverwinter Nights games do it.
    Every JRPG ever.
    I don't recall them saying incantations in ffx or ffx-2

    That's the point. The spell for preventing mages from casting spells is called "Silence" even though the magic system doesn't specify that mages must be audible for spells to function. I have seen this trope in a great many fantasy games.
  • KuronaKurona Member Posts: 881
    Final Fantasy characters chanted to cast spells until FF7. It wasn't vocalized, but you could see it with their sprites. These days it's just an artifact though.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    edited April 2017
    batoor said:

    mlnevese said:

    They're invading...

    New york... It's always New York... You can count on your fingers how many movies do not start the zombie apocalypse/alien invasion/whatever in New York...
    Speaking more broadly...But aren't practically all supernatural/fantasy in tv shows/films taking place in america? Even when the catastrophe is world spanning, somehow the story hardly ever changes the setting through the seasons. It makes sense because most of the production/creation of the show takes place in america, but it still ends up being repetitive and limiting after too many shows have done it^^
    On that note, a bunch of shows/movies set in Chicago/New York are actually filmed in Toronto. Being a bit of a transit nerd myself I always get a kick when I see some show (say like Suits) featuring characters walking down the middle of some downtown officey place (King and Bay in Toronto) that has streetcar tracks. Neither New York no Chicago have them at the moment (though Chicago has some remnants of them).

    Occasionally you'll also get them showing the CN tower or some other obvious building too.
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,653
    I think the "silence" thing is a traditional trope of D&D that has spread to other franchises. So the bottom line is that "silence" as the anti-magic condition is a cultural tradition.
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,938
    @BelgarathMTH well, at least the ol 1st Ed. got the idea right, they took the time to make up the three components for each spell, and with some spells silence would make no difference. I think even 2nd edition came up with a kit or two where a class like the Witch could include dancing and other components that might hold up against the .Silence' thing.
    I think vocalize was a latter addition to the game after 1st ed. Obviously that would have to have something other than the verbal component to work. Some sign language or maybe a component that signifies someone talking alot. hehheh. Maybe a a few shots of whiskey or something, :)
  • themazingnessthemazingness Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 702
    edited April 2017
    And for that matter, fire arrows (against soldiers):

    https://youtube.com/watch?v=zTd_0FRAwOQ
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,938
    Ardanis said:

    This is more of a game trope than TV/book, but

    Ever burning torches...

    ...in every single godforsaken dungeon or graveyard you ever have a chance of coming across :facepalm:
    One day I'm oh so making a quest to track down the Mysterious Torchlighter and take his toy, which will extinguish lights in all dungeons but you'll be able to do something cool with your new torch.
    Hehheh, yeah .My brothers and I practiced making real torches not long after getting into AD&D some 30+ years ago. I can definitely say they were NOT everburning, smoked alot, and did not keep well. Was good fun though. :) As I recall, the folks didn't like the fact that we cut up a few straw broomsticks and used the odd rake handle to make them with. :)

  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    @themazingness: Very insightful video.

    Especially the part about penetrating Frenchmen.
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,037
    BillyYank said:


    The Death Star was a stupid idea.

    Think of the money, resources and time it took to build the death stars. Now think about finding a good sized asteroid, mounting a star destroyer engine and guidance package on it and sending it careening into Alderaan. Same result, cheap, easy and effective.
    Yes, the Emperor wanted it for shock value but you are correct--an enormous waste of time and money. The Shadows knew better than that--they had planet-killer weapons but when they wanted to take out an entire planet they used a mass driver system like you mention.
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,938
    mlnevese said:

    Zaghoul said:

    JoenSo said:

    At least the lack of safety rails cut down the cost of the Death star quite a bit.

    Just add to that, put some dadgum seatbelts on the Starship Enterprise. I mean, really, how many times do those folks need to be chucked outa their seats to get the point.
    And the engineer that designed those control panels that explode every time a ship is hit by enemy fire should be fired and arrested...
    Yeah, at least a dadburn surge protector or something, even a dang fusebox for crying out loud.
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,938
    BillyYank said:

    We are the evil (terrorists/criminals/government conspiracy) and we're going to blow this place up because...

    ... um... reasons? Because we're evil?
    Seriously, is it too much to ask that the villains' evil plot makes at least some kind of sense. I shouldn't be sitting there at the end of the movie wondering how the bad guys were supposed to benefit from what they're doing. Or thinking, "wouldn't it have been easier if they just did..." For example:

    The Death Star was a stupid idea.

    Think of the money, resources and time it took to build the death stars. Now think about finding a good sized asteroid, mounting a star destroyer engine and guidance package on it and sending it careening into Alderaan. Same result, cheap, easy and effective.
    Yeah, what, blown up three or something by now? I mean couldn't they put up a backup to guard that entrance the ships are flying into to shoot at the core?
    I mean, DANG, at least put up some heavy chicken wire or SOMETHING. Jeeze.
  • mlnevesemlnevese Member, Moderator Posts: 10,214
    BillyYank said:

    Zaghoul said:

    BillyYank said:

    We are the evil (terrorists/criminals/government conspiracy) and we're going to blow this place up because...

    ... um... reasons? Because we're evil?
    Seriously, is it too much to ask that the villains' evil plot makes at least some kind of sense. I shouldn't be sitting there at the end of the movie wondering how the bad guys were supposed to benefit from what they're doing. Or thinking, "wouldn't it have been easier if they just did..." For example:

    The Death Star was a stupid idea.

    Think of the money, resources and time it took to build the death stars. Now think about finding a good sized asteroid, mounting a star destroyer engine and guidance package on it and sending it careening into Alderaan. Same result, cheap, easy and effective.
    Yeah, what, blown up three or something by now? I mean couldn't they put up a backup to guard that entrance the ships are flying into to shoot at the core?
    I mean, DANG, at least put up some heavy chicken wire or SOMETHING. Jeeze.
    Even a couple of sharp bends in the pipe would have worked.
    Or some strong force fields along the way...
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