Show Planescape:Torment Enhanced Edition some love on GoG (GOGMIXES)
themazingness
Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 702
So Planescape:Torment Enhanced Edition could use some love over at GoG. There is this great feature called GOGMIXES that let you create a list of games and review them.
Unfortunately, the second highest one (could easily become the first) on Planescape:Torment Enhanced Edition's page has some blatantly false information (like saying the Enhanced Edition games don't give Black Isle credit) and is inflammatory. It is entitled "Beamdog Is the Parasite of the Industry."
So, go show Planescape:Torment some love and upvote some of the other lists that you like. It isn't fair that this game is getting bad publicity just because of Dragonspear controversy.
The store page can be found here:
https://gog.com/game/planescape_torment_enhanced_edition
Unfortunately, the second highest one (could easily become the first) on Planescape:Torment Enhanced Edition's page has some blatantly false information (like saying the Enhanced Edition games don't give Black Isle credit) and is inflammatory. It is entitled "Beamdog Is the Parasite of the Industry."
So, go show Planescape:Torment some love and upvote some of the other lists that you like. It isn't fair that this game is getting bad publicity just because of Dragonspear controversy.
The store page can be found here:
https://gog.com/game/planescape_torment_enhanced_edition
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Comments
Me myself; I'm sick & tired of those individuals whose lives are evidently so very full, rich and fulfilling that they each made multiple alt accounts and been systematically down voting each & every post they find by any other member who has ever posted anything with which they don't agree ever since Siege of Dragonspear was released. The fact that GOG does no real moderation of their forum greatly exasperates this situation. Even if all GOG did was to ditch the forum reputation system and limit reviews to those accounts which own the game in their GOG account it would greatly remedy this gaming the system issue.
Honest question, not saying they do or don't, but I haven't seen Black Isle anywhere "in my face" yet.
Credits -> usually chronological order (oldest/original last/bottom).
Every Game:
Options -> Movies -> Orignal Credits
You can see the full credits of the original team in the Credits (available through Game options):
Also, the blog entry introducing PST:EE says thank you to the original team in the first place. http://blog.beamdog.com/2017/04/planescape-torment-enhanced-edition-is.html
I find it strange that not giving credit is even a point to bring up in a review. Beamdog had to get the rights, which means they could have been required leave the Black Isle loading screen in. Clearly they weren't. It really isn't up to the consumers what trademarks, copyright notices, etc. are given. That's the decision of the laws, rights holders, and publishers.
Or maybe it was, but those people were weird and wrong.
When you play this game, are you playing a Beamdog game? Or a Black Isle Studios game?
Not legally, then the answer is "neither", but in the common sense of the phrase.
You'd never know from playing the game. From JuliusBorisov's post, it would appear that "Black Isle Studios" no longer appears anywhere in the game itself.
Is that right? Wrong? I dunno.
It is what it is. Make of it what you will.
You asked "Is that right?" The answer is, no, it is wrong. There are three places where credits are given to the original creators--the Beamdog "Opening" movie, the "Original Planescape:Torment" credits, and the "Credits." These are also the only places where Beamdog is mentioned aside from that note from Chris Avelonne. And you can hardly blame him for not crediting Black Isle when he's the representative from the original project.
There is not one place where names are named (except the WotC Dungeons & Dragons screen) where Black Isle isn't there alongside Beamdog.
So back to the original problem that I mentioned that you say I'm detracting from, it is patently false to claim that original credit isn't given. And the only reason legality is a part of it is because those are the normal ways American video game makers give credit. It's how it's done. But I would also argue that if that wasn't how it was done that it would be up to those involved how credit is given or whether it is at all. Just like I wasn't credited for the Dead Sea Scrolls and James Earl Jones wasn't credited for being the voice of Darth Vader, there are crediting decisions outside of the realm of legality. I gave those examples above so clearly I was arguing about more than legal issues. What I am saying is reviewers didn't make the game or have claim to it in any way except as players, unless by some slim chance they were on the original team (which is credited, so that would be a moot point).
Wait, so GOG pulled the original PST from sale once the EE was released??
Damn, that's a bad idea (whoever's it was).
Due to licensing agreements, Interplay hasn't been able to produce or distribute D&D games (even ones they developed) for at least a decade now. That aside, there was some rumbling about Interplay restarting BIS back in 2012, but nothing came of it.
Since Hasbro/WotC owns the game, I can see them being understandably leery about letting the old BIS title card stick around when the owner of the mark was likely digging it out to gain media exposure. Every person that was on the original team still has their personal credit, but unless Hasbro buys back the name, unintentionally advertising a zombie brand of a competitor is an awkward position to be in.
So... funny story... it looks like WotC forgot to renew the US Trademark on "Planescape: Torment" and as of early this year, it was considered abandoned.
Quick, who wants to help me start up a Planescape: Torment pizza chain? It's The Best Slice in all of Sigil!
PS: How come nobody's upset that the TSR logo is gone?
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/beamdogishit
The biggest problem with GOG is that it allows anyone to review a game regardless of whether they have it in their account. The top review actually demanded Beamdog employees apologize to his small group of narrow minded bigots, LOL. Nevertheless, someone started this counter-GOGmix:
https://www.gog.com/mix/beamdog_is_not_the_parasite_of_the_industry
I'm pretty sure that "someone" is the same @themazingness that started this discussion.
Still, it's good to see that PST:EE is gaining positive reviews. As noted in GOG's current top-rated review ("5/5! This game is great but I'm still upset about other games."), not a lot of people are having an issue with this particular release. If anything, they're holding a grudge for unrelated reasons.
I think the main reason of the hate is because of that: the original versions of BG I and II, IWD and now PST are not avaible for purchase. The only legal option is buy those EE. I really want to have those games, but I don't want a modded version labeled as "Enhanced Edition" on my account. So, how should I proceed?
If Beamdog is really good at making those EE, why don't let the original ones on GOG for separete purchase, like it was before? It seems like they don't trust that their product will sell enough, so you need remove the option of choice from costumers.
Of course, if this is not Beamdog's fault, then at least they can ask GOG to let the originals going back to the store - or even making a publicy note telling that is GOG fault. As long as this doesn't happen, Beamdog will be labeled as "the parasite of industry".
Oh well better for them to wait for sales I guess=P
Just because a product exists in digital form, it doesn't follow that it works much differently than physical distribution. GOG may have offered it earlier, but they were not given perpetual rights to sell copies of PST by the owner/publisher of the game. PST may have been digitally distributed, but the situation is really no different than a publisher discontinuing an old edition of a book in favor of a newer one. Even if they never posted a word about it, it would have been a reasonable enough guess that Beamdog was never able to make those sorts of decisions. In some ways I find their calm, vague answers rather professional, because it means that they don't want to throw their licensing partner (*cough* Hasbro *cough*) under the bus to appease "community outrage."
I feel like the tone of conversation would be different if people were asking questions like: "Can you explain anything about licensing decisions on concurrent sales of original and Enhanced Editions?" instead of: "Why did Beamdog take away the original games on GOG?"