There are more things to worry about if you use SCS. Balors on SCS have vorpal hits with no save (not sure on exactly which difficulty levels, but at least on Insane it's like this). Only death ward and protection from magical weapons protect against it as far as I know.
Can someone confirm whether this is true? I don't believe unmodded vorpal hit death is blocked by (unmodded) death ward, and I'm pretty sure SCS doesn't change that. iirc there's an optional aTweaks component that mods death ward to block vorpal hits, which would seem to support my suspicions.
@ithildurnew In EE, Death Ward blocks vorpal strikes even without mods. It was only in the unmodded pre-EE game that vorpal strikes blocked Death Ward. Back then, only an upgraded Hindo's Doom or weapon immunities could block a vorpal strike.
Aren’t there also threats that can dispel on-hit as well as have a chance to vorpal? I recall a discussion about how the only character that could safely survive that thing was a mage with PfMW and other defenses to stop the dispel from taking place. I want to say it was the Planetar, but I’m probably wrong and suffering from bad memories about them.
Does anybody know how to reliably beat Bassilus with low level (3) party? Because with the SCS he can have access to spells like Divine Protection or Entropy Shield. With these spells it is difficult/impossible to interrupt his spellcasting and he can cast his high level spells And if he has memorized Aerial Servat (this is random) and summons him, you have to quickly run away from that location.
Because with SCS spell selection is random, he can has completly different spell and then Wand of Magic Missile can interrupt all his spells. But on no reload run you can´t bet on the possibility that his spell selection will be favourable for charname.
SCS 32 with IWD spells does change the game for clerics rather significantly; no longer are they pushovers compared to SCS mages.
Asking for a reliable strategy without specific party makeup/equipment is a shot in the dark, but one approach for minimizing risk is to use positioning/strategically placed summons (or a sacrificial target) to get him to waste some of his arsenal while Divine Protection runs out. You're going to want to have in reserve magic missile/chromatic orb etc to disrupt and someone (Kivan with Archer kit works well) with as good a ranged THAC0 as you can get at that level. Clear out the rest of the map before taking him on. I assume you plan on dealing with his minions using the conversation options. If he pulls an Aerial Servant... do you have aTweaks installed?
Generally a level 3 party doesn't have a lot of options for taking on an enemy caster whose levels are that much higher unless using lots of thick cheese; you're essentially playing craps which for a no reload run is not a good strategy. Aerial Servant vs level 3 party is a bad idea (especially if you have aTweaks installed with their instant invisibility)
Nothing wrong with waiting until the party gains some levels for a no reload run.
@semiticgod Thanks for clarification; still have some bits where I'm not quite sure what EE changed vs classic, that's good to know... vorpal hits are a good way to end no reload runs.
Silence is a good spell if he fails. Be prepared to run if he doesn't.
Does Algernon's Cloak work in your set-up.
If it does, you can charm him and get him to fight Zargal. If Bassilus wins, put him next to a ghoul until he is held and then fight him.
Invisibility can be useful. Use a mage to lure Aerial Servant away and then cast invisibility or use an invisibility potion.
You can also wait him out until his spells wear off.
No, I don´t have this part of Atweak. I remeber that when I played with Atweak, I was afraid of Aerial Servant even in Underdark.
My party is kensai, Ajantis, Kagain, Branwen, Imoen and Neera. I will send Korgan with The One Gift Lost to clear the zombies and interrupt his first spell. Branwen will be casting Silence and Neera Larloch´s Minor Drain. If he fail his save against Silence, it is over. If he cast Aerial Servant, I will run away.
Silence is a good spell if he fails. Be prepared to run if he doesn't.
Does Algernon's Cloak work in your set-up.
These are the most reliable methods. If you're willing to exploit line of sight, you can try multiple casts of silence from off screen until one of them lands.
SCS limits the number of things you can cheese this way though, and you have to do them a heck of a lot more intelligently or risk instant destruction. I can only think of 4 or 5 difficult fights in BG1 where out-of-range bombardments help: Basillus (If you mess up, the guy has level 6 priest spells and is utterly terrifying), the Red Wizards (this doesn't even work that well I've found), Kirian's party, Drasus' group (Drasus can Enrage, mages can buff with mGoI and have Chaos), the Bandit camp (kind of? More like getting them all to attack you and choke-pointing areas with Webs and a Cloudkill spell), and the Undercity party which... honestly, you might as well those Wands of Fire on SOMETHING.
In BG2, it's a little more useful, and I bombard Beholders every time I can because I simply don't trust any other way of dealing with it.
Cheese is also kind of subjective. Are Spike Traps cheesy? Bounty hunter traps? Planetars? Hordes of summons? These are all things that make the game easier in some way or another than if you didn't use them, so the question might as well be why we install SCS if we're going to use kits instead of plain classes or even 6 Fighters. In the end, each person has an individual level of cheese that they're willing to go up to, and I'd say everyone should just play up to that level of cheese. We have runs by people like semiticgod who did things like Wand of Lightning exploit Wishes during the siege of Ust Natha, dispelled Polymorph when it was still dispellable to gain an additional 4 APR or something, and other ridiculous, amazing things that I personally wouldn't feel comfortable with, to runners like Charleston Templar and Wise Grimwald who seems to be playing straight from the book who probably wouldn't feel comfortable with tactics I use.
I don't think we should judge each other over different tactics, as long as it's not things like "console in the godbow at the beginning of the game lol" or other similar shenanigans.
So I killed him. Ajantis and Kagain are dead but not chunked. It didn´t work how I planned it (he hit Branwen and kensai with Greater Command but it took him some time to kill Ajantis and Kagain so Branwen and kensai woke up and killed him) but charname is alive.
So I killed him. Ajantis and Kagain are dead but not chunked. It didn´t work how I planned it (he hit Branwen and kensai with Greater Command but it took him some time to kill Ajantis and Kagain so Branwen and kensai woke up and killed him) but charname is alive.
What I like about the game, is that so often it doesn't pan out as planned. If it did, we would soon get bored.
It was merely a question with an observation. To me it just seemed strange but I guess that is because I also play out of the box with no prebuffing unless I can justify it with in game lore, no fog of war casting unless I scouted with reason and the foe is hostile for reasons, etc etc.
What are y'alls opinions on maintaining a completely separate reload practice run while attempting a main run? It would be used to practice encounters and unknown zones.
My BG1 gameplay has gotten to the point where I can, with some consistency, get to SoD, but my SoD gameplay is progressing slowly because of having to restart. I can't consistently get to/past Bridgefort yet and haven't been to Athkatla since the original games came out.
I'm getting a bit bored of BG1 and discouraged overall.
What are y'alls opinions on maintaining a completely separate reload practice run while attempting a main run? It would be used to practice encounters and unknown zones.
My BG1 gameplay has gotten to the point where I can, with some consistency, get to SoD, but my SoD gameplay is progressing slowly because of having to restart. I can't consistently get to/past Bridgefort yet and haven't been to Athkatla since the original games came out.
I'm getting a bit bored of BG1 and discouraged overall.
Personally I don't use that sort of practice either alongside or separate to a no-reload run (though I occasionally reload an autosave to try and work out how I died if that is not clear). However, others do and I think you should do what feels right to you.
I do recognize what you say about SoD though - it took me quite a while to feel confident about getting through that.
One possible alternative you might want to consider is not doing SoD on some of your runs, so that Athkatla doesn't miss you too much .
It was merely a question with an observation. To me it just seemed strange but I guess that is because I also play out of the box with no prebuffing unless I can justify it with in game lore, no fog of war casting unless I scouted with reason and the foe is hostile for reasons, etc etc.
Well if you read a forum discussion about role-playing vs powergaming, or some threads like the no-reload thread, you'll find huge differences in styles of play. People have very different notions of what they find enjoyable or reasonable. I for one am happy to play with full HPs on leveling up, changing NPC classes/kits, shoplifting by NPCs when my main character is of good alignment, and in my current LoB run I've used invisible blockers a few times simply because my party lacked the means - or I the skill - to handle a powerful enemy. Am not proud of it, but the SCS/LoB Dwarven warders in Durlag's Tower to name one group, are extremely deadly. And the vast majority of encounters I still handle more "honorably".
Despite these powergamey habits I consider myself a reasonably fair player. E.g. I don't attack non-hostile characters that I know will go hostile after talking to them. I don't kill good-aligned characters that happen to have good gear (though I allow pickpocketing and I sometimes look the other way when gnolls attack a certain drow ranger). I don't use short-duration pre-buffs unless the party are aware of an imminent danger. Charname generally needs to stick their neck out as I can't have Charname taking NPCs on a dangerous journey and then have those NPCs carry Charname through (although am aware that some classes such as shamans or skalds are intrinsically better suited for safe-keeping). Also I value NPCs' lives about as much as Charname's life, always trying to keep everyone alive even if that puts Charname at a greater risk.
Also some people power through one run and role-play the next: someone who uses Silence on Bassilus in one run doesn't have to do the same every time they play through BG1.
What are y'alls opinions on maintaining a completely separate reload practice run while attempting a main run? It would be used to practice encounters and unknown zones.
My BG1 gameplay has gotten to the point where I can, with some consistency, get to SoD, but my SoD gameplay is progressing slowly because of having to restart. I can't consistently get to/past Bridgefort yet and haven't been to Athkatla since the original games came out.
I'm getting a bit bored of BG1 and discouraged overall.
Wouldn't that be even slower and more boring though? Maybe not if you're doing the practice run with a different character/party? I've tried something like that once or twice before, continuing a failed no-reload run to pioneer for a new reload run, but I lacked the discipline. I just felt more invested in the no-reload run.
Like @Grond0, I do feel you on SoD though. Of all the no-reloaders on this forum I think I have the worst balance against Belhifet. So I'd say feel free to play with a separate test run. And if it doesn't work for you, why not share your bottlenecks with us and people will surely have some good tips for you. Also I think you tend to solo a lot. Playing a party might be something for you to try. Slower progress but more tactical options, more flexibility, more APR, etc. (If the slower progress really bothers you, try recruiting NPCs at the latest moment for them not to lag behind.)
What are y'alls opinions on maintaining a completely separate reload practice run while attempting a main run? It would be used to practice encounters and unknown zones.
My BG1 gameplay has gotten to the point where I can, with some consistency, get to SoD, but my SoD gameplay is progressing slowly because of having to restart. I can't consistently get to/past Bridgefort yet and haven't been to Athkatla since the original games came out.
I'm getting a bit bored of BG1 and discouraged overall.
I've done something similar for optional fights I deem too dangerous for my current runs. I only split off a save if I determine that I'm not keeping the result of a fight, successful or not, and if the practice goes well, I ban myself from that fight for the current run.
For example, a run awhile back I wanted to test Mage vs Mage duels in the Ust Natha pits. I was pretty confident I would lose them and decided to make a save dedicated to that series of duels. I did end up losing to a Flesh to Stone at some point, but the important thing was I never intended to keep the result either way. And if I had won, I would bar myself from that fight until my next run.
Also, to learn different things, it seems definitely OK to play no-reload for a bit: I made it to mid or late SoA with a Skald once before dying, but completed the game anyways. That extra bit of experience is probably what pushed my actually successful Skald run through.
(As a side note, I'm feeling a little called out right now by @Blackraven as my two successful runs to date were the Shaman and Skald that were notoriously danger averse )
As for SoD, there's definitely a learning curve that will absolutely kill you if you're not prepared. I think it took me like 6-7 runs to get past all the "you die instantly if you're not prepared" moments, but once I figured out what they were I don't think I've lost a run in SoD since. A lot of that is that I stopped doing a lot of optional battles, since the additional experience and items are almost never worth it. If you want, I can try to remember each of the gotcha moments I lost to, and how I avoid them now.
Cheese and powergaming balance out with challenge runs. They kind of lead to each other. In my first no-reload run with the Party of Spiders, I made it a challenge run so I could stress-test the spider gnome trick. I had a powerful tool, so I increased the difficulty to compensate. Likewise, in my poverty run, I started out with a challenge run and then used exploits to pave the way, like using the Wand of Lightning trick to get better Wish results in ToB.
The more you use exploits, the more you feel compelled to increase the difficulty. The more you increase the difficulty, the more you use exploits. Likewise, the less you use one, the less you'll use the other. The solo LoB challenge is an excellent example: it's nearly impossible to do it truly exploit-free, and most of the time it's very, very exploit-intensive.
I've cranked up both exploits and difficulty as far as it can go, and it burned me out pretty bad. There's nothing wrong with exploits per se, but they do encourage some playstyles that aren't quite as fun in the long run.
Thank you for some of the explanation why you would do such things. I sure understand diverse play styles and I don't mind any of them. I have been on all sides of the coin, just the recent fifteen years completely on the no exploit side.
All I asked was why one would play this way, not state that one cannot or should not play this way. Perhaps the cheese mention is a trigger for such a response, then I apologise for the misunderstanding. Cheese is not bad; it is to me something you do when you have absolutely no pleasure in an encounter or have done everything before it and cannot progress reliably.
Still, what remains. I just don't understand why in a noreload you need to install something like scs and the exploit some encounters; could it be that you are simply not high level enough, or don't have the reliable gear or spells to have a good chance to survive, or not the right party composition, or maybe some encounters should just be skipped in a noreload altogether. Why a difficulty enhancement mod and not experience it to its fullest?
Same as I will never understand why people rush to shoal or the basilisks for XP while they can play the main story and get levels that way, and then slowly venture a bit around the main questline to get more XP and items. Or why people steal algernons cloak without the quest having been triggered.
@lroumen: I didn't think you were being judgmental. I don't recall seeing that kind of judgment on this forum for years. No need to apologize; you are A-okay.
Yeah, sorry, I was probably the one who sounded a bit antagonistic: my bad.
I'll try to answer the early-experience thing, though: low levels in D&D 2e suck. A Thief, Bard, Mage, Sorcerer or Monk with 16 CON must be level 3 (fewer for mages with a familiar, I guess) before they're guaranteed to be safe from being 1-shot by a Kobold or Hobgoblin arrow. Warriors can't tank anything outside of like Kobolds at low levels: they're in very real danger of getting killed in two hits in a lot of cases. I don't know about everyone, but I don't consider it to be fun whatsoever when a natural 20 forces me to roll up another character. Getting characters to level 4 or 5 is where the actually interesting gameplay and decision-making happens: spellcasters have actual options, warriors can survive a couple hits, thieves' abilities aren't failing 95% of the time (just 70% ) and so on and so forth.
As to why people install difficulty/challenge mods while still making some parts of the game easy: for me, it's because the base game A.I. and encounters are far too easy and not enjoyable to play against anymore. From the Amazons actually ambushing you during travel, having to fight Sarevok's Acolytes in BG2, to thieves being smart and trying to backstab the weaker members of the team, I don't think I could play through those encounters without feeling... empty, I guess, without the added difficulty. SCS even makes several encounters impossible to cheese, such as not being able to firebomb the Amazons since they're in a different map, or not fighting only Sarevok.
To put the two paragraphs together, cheesing the early-game doesn't make the end-game difficulty from SCS any less: it just lets me get there more reliably. More importantly for me, I don't have to play at low levels because frankly that's my least favorite period of the game, mods or not. I understand that it's part of the journey for some people, but those mostly empty wilderness areas in BG1 are not that fun for me: I generally only go out of my way now for specific loot or tomes since otherwise it's the same story of "kite and shoot" over and over.
Thank you for some of the explanation why you would do such things. I sure understand diverse play styles and I don't mind any of them. I have been on all sides of the coin, just the recent fifteen years completely on the no exploit side.
All I asked was why one would play this way, not state that one cannot or should not play this way. Perhaps the cheese mention is a trigger for such a response, then I apologise for the misunderstanding. Cheese is not bad; it is to me something you do when you have absolutely no pleasure in an encounter or have done everything before it and cannot progress reliably.
Still, what remains. I just don't understand why in a noreload you need to install something like scs and the exploit some encounters; could it be that you are simply not high level enough, or don't have the reliable gear or spells to have a good chance to survive, or not the right party composition, or maybe some encounters should just be skipped in a noreload altogether. Why a difficulty enhancement mod and not experience it to its fullest?
Same as I will never understand why people rush to shoal or the basilisks for XP while they can play the main story and get levels that way, and then slowly venture a bit around the main questline to get more XP and items. Or why people steal algernons cloak without the quest having been triggered.
Sorry, ranting.
People are just different and look for different things from the game. Your posts suggest that you consider RP a significant part of the enjoyment for your game - but it has almost no significance in mine. Hence, I don't do things like following the expected story line, or using NPCs and following the interactions between them - why would I when that holds no interest for me?
During encounters you wonder why anyone would cheese them, doing things like attacking from outside line of sight or area-skipping to dodge spells. Well, if you play solo and very rarely use any consumables, you won't get very far in the game with many classes without using some means to reduce the risk . When playing with a party, like my dwarven fighter Crew, I rarely use that type of cheese - because the risk can normally be managed satisfactorily through dispersal of the party anyway.
Personally, I also like to manage risk, not totally eliminate it. Probably the main reason I play the game is because the results are always slightly different. I regularly trigger traps that could theoretically kill me (and therefore occasionally do) and most of the time leave spell-learning to chance. I roll natural HPs on level up and often let characters conclude a fight even when there is a small danger they will get killed by a high-damage attack. That dancing on the edge quality keeps things interesting to me. That's why I would typically prefer to dodge spells using movement than use something like the Greenstone Amulet before fighting someone like Neira. It seems clear to me that relying on movement results in a more interesting encounter than just attacking when there's no risk from spells - but I realize not everyone thinks the same .
As for SCS, it offers a different set of challenges. Though I think part of the underlying intention for the mod was to reduce the opportunities for cheese, it's only been partly successful in that. In many cases what it does is close off some cheesy tactics, but introduce others. In the final battle for instance you can no longer kill Sarevok easily by triggering multiple traps and can't easily fight just him and Semaj. On the other hand there is now a way you can fire-bomb him from out of sight, which you couldn't do before. Playing under those different constraints may offer a fresh reason to play the game. So too may the fact that SCS eliminates a lot of the AI's stupidity and unreasonably restricted spell availability in the base game. How you weight those depends again on the reasons why you play the game in the first place - if you're largely interested in role playing opportunities then I can see SCS won't do much for you.
(As a side note, I'm feeling a little called out right now by @Blackraven as my two successful runs to date were the Shaman and Skald that were notoriously danger averse )
Ouch haha. In case you weren't joking: I mentioned those classes to soften my stance, naming them as examples of characters that I wouldn't expect anyone including myself to play very offensively in a party.
I was kidding about that, though I will admit I was considering trying a run where my main character was allowed to contribute literally nothing to the game except staying alive outside the forced-solo areas like the Slayer Dream. I would've done it with some already finished class just to prove it was doable but I didn't think it would be very enjoyable. I think I just enjoy playing support classes more due to my personality, or at least feel more comfortable keeping them safe as a strategic decision.
On a slightly different note, it's possible to bomb and kill Sarevok from out of vision in SCS? I thought his acolytes being alive gave him regeneration akin to the Sahuagin Prince, and with his innate Fire resistance I didn't think even 6 Fireballs/round were enough to make a dent on his hitpoints.
On a slightly different note, it's possible to bomb and kill Sarevok from out of vision in SCS? I thought his acolytes being alive gave him regeneration akin to the Sahuagin Prince, and with his innate Fire resistance I didn't think even 6 Fireballs/round were enough to make a dent on his hitpoints.
If you strand him by showing yourself and then going invisible in a corner, he doesn't pick you up again if you don't get into sight range. The only one of his acolytes who wanders is Angelo, so you'll need to kill him separately. With that done though, the rest of them cluster round him and can all be bombed together. Sarevok regenerates (and is unkillable) while one of his acolytes lives, but once they're gone you can just keep bombing away if you want, or run and shoot, or use high weapon speed to nip in and attack, or do stealth attacks round the pillars, or use magic damage, or just buff up and go for the mano a mano solution .
Best (in the sense of "satisfying") way to take care of Sarevok is to lower his STs, and then use the Polymorph Other spell or the wand to turn him into a squirrel.
Comments
If you have a thief it is worth getting for the extra charisma.
Can someone confirm whether this is true? I don't believe unmodded vorpal hit death is blocked by (unmodded) death ward, and I'm pretty sure SCS doesn't change that. iirc there's an optional aTweaks component that mods death ward to block vorpal hits, which would seem to support my suspicions.
ithildurnew you brought up a good point, I have that aTweaks component installed. But thank you semiticgod for clarifying it for the unmodded version
Because with SCS spell selection is random, he can has completly different spell and then Wand of Magic Missile can interrupt all his spells. But on no reload run you can´t bet on the possibility that his spell selection will be favourable for charname.
Asking for a reliable strategy without specific party makeup/equipment is a shot in the dark, but one approach for minimizing risk is to use positioning/strategically placed summons (or a sacrificial target) to get him to waste some of his arsenal while Divine Protection runs out. You're going to want to have in reserve magic missile/chromatic orb etc to disrupt and someone (Kivan with Archer kit works well) with as good a ranged THAC0 as you can get at that level. Clear out the rest of the map before taking him on. I assume you plan on dealing with his minions using the conversation options. If he pulls an Aerial Servant... do you have aTweaks installed?
Generally a level 3 party doesn't have a lot of options for taking on an enemy caster whose levels are that much higher unless using lots of thick cheese; you're essentially playing craps which for a no reload run is not a good strategy. Aerial Servant vs level 3 party is a bad idea (especially if you have aTweaks installed with their instant invisibility)
Nothing wrong with waiting until the party gains some levels for a no reload run.
@semiticgod Thanks for clarification; still have some bits where I'm not quite sure what EE changed vs classic, that's good to know... vorpal hits are a good way to end no reload runs.
Does Algernon's Cloak work in your set-up.
If it does, you can charm him and get him to fight Zargal. If Bassilus wins, put him next to a ghoul until he is held and then fight him.
Invisibility can be useful. Use a mage to lure Aerial Servant away and then cast invisibility or use an invisibility potion.
You can also wait him out until his spells wear off.
My party is kensai, Ajantis, Kagain, Branwen, Imoen and Neera. I will send Korgan with The One Gift Lost to clear the zombies and interrupt his first spell. Branwen will be casting Silence and Neera Larloch´s Minor Drain. If he fail his save against Silence, it is over. If he cast Aerial Servant, I will run away.
These are the most reliable methods. If you're willing to exploit line of sight, you can try multiple casts of silence from off screen until one of them lands.
In BG2, it's a little more useful, and I bombard Beholders every time I can because I simply don't trust any other way of dealing with it.
Cheese is also kind of subjective. Are Spike Traps cheesy? Bounty hunter traps? Planetars? Hordes of summons? These are all things that make the game easier in some way or another than if you didn't use them, so the question might as well be why we install SCS if we're going to use kits instead of plain classes or even 6 Fighters. In the end, each person has an individual level of cheese that they're willing to go up to, and I'd say everyone should just play up to that level of cheese. We have runs by people like semiticgod who did things like Wand of Lightning exploit Wishes during the siege of Ust Natha, dispelled Polymorph when it was still dispellable to gain an additional 4 APR or something, and other ridiculous, amazing things that I personally wouldn't feel comfortable with, to runners like Charleston Templar and Wise Grimwald who seems to be playing straight from the book who probably wouldn't feel comfortable with tactics I use.
I don't think we should judge each other over different tactics, as long as it's not things like "console in the godbow at the beginning of the game lol" or other similar shenanigans.
My BG1 gameplay has gotten to the point where I can, with some consistency, get to SoD, but my SoD gameplay is progressing slowly because of having to restart. I can't consistently get to/past Bridgefort yet and haven't been to Athkatla since the original games came out.
I'm getting a bit bored of BG1 and discouraged overall.
Personally I don't use that sort of practice either alongside or separate to a no-reload run (though I occasionally reload an autosave to try and work out how I died if that is not clear). However, others do and I think you should do what feels right to you.
I do recognize what you say about SoD though - it took me quite a while to feel confident about getting through that.
One possible alternative you might want to consider is not doing SoD on some of your runs, so that Athkatla doesn't miss you too much
Well if you read a forum discussion about role-playing vs powergaming, or some threads like the no-reload thread, you'll find huge differences in styles of play. People have very different notions of what they find enjoyable or reasonable. I for one am happy to play with full HPs on leveling up, changing NPC classes/kits, shoplifting by NPCs when my main character is of good alignment, and in my current LoB run I've used invisible blockers a few times simply because my party lacked the means - or I the skill - to handle a powerful enemy. Am not proud of it, but the SCS/LoB Dwarven warders in Durlag's Tower to name one group, are extremely deadly. And the vast majority of encounters I still handle more "honorably".
Despite these powergamey habits I consider myself a reasonably fair player. E.g. I don't attack non-hostile characters that I know will go hostile after talking to them. I don't kill good-aligned characters that happen to have good gear (though I allow pickpocketing and I sometimes look the other way when gnolls attack a certain drow ranger). I don't use short-duration pre-buffs unless the party are aware of an imminent danger. Charname generally needs to stick their neck out as I can't have Charname taking NPCs on a dangerous journey and then have those NPCs carry Charname through (although am aware that some classes such as shamans or skalds are intrinsically better suited for safe-keeping). Also I value NPCs' lives about as much as Charname's life, always trying to keep everyone alive even if that puts Charname at a greater risk.
Also some people power through one run and role-play the next: someone who uses Silence on Bassilus in one run doesn't have to do the same every time they play through BG1.
Wouldn't that be even slower and more boring though? Maybe not if you're doing the practice run with a different character/party? I've tried something like that once or twice before, continuing a failed no-reload run to pioneer for a new reload run, but I lacked the discipline. I just felt more invested in the no-reload run.
Like @Grond0, I do feel you on SoD though. Of all the no-reloaders on this forum I think I have the worst balance against Belhifet. So I'd say feel free to play with a separate test run. And if it doesn't work for you, why not share your bottlenecks with us and people will surely have some good tips for you. Also I think you tend to solo a lot. Playing a party might be something for you to try. Slower progress but more tactical options, more flexibility, more APR, etc. (If the slower progress really bothers you, try recruiting NPCs at the latest moment for them not to lag behind.)
I've done something similar for optional fights I deem too dangerous for my current runs. I only split off a save if I determine that I'm not keeping the result of a fight, successful or not, and if the practice goes well, I ban myself from that fight for the current run.
For example, a run awhile back I wanted to test Mage vs Mage duels in the Ust Natha pits. I was pretty confident I would lose them and decided to make a save dedicated to that series of duels. I did end up losing to a Flesh to Stone at some point, but the important thing was I never intended to keep the result either way. And if I had won, I would bar myself from that fight until my next run.
Also, to learn different things, it seems definitely OK to play no-reload for a bit: I made it to mid or late SoA with a Skald once before dying, but completed the game anyways. That extra bit of experience is probably what pushed my actually successful Skald run through.
(As a side note, I'm feeling a little called out right now by @Blackraven as my two successful runs to date were the Shaman and Skald that were notoriously danger averse
As for SoD, there's definitely a learning curve that will absolutely kill you if you're not prepared. I think it took me like 6-7 runs to get past all the "you die instantly if you're not prepared" moments, but once I figured out what they were I don't think I've lost a run in SoD since. A lot of that is that I stopped doing a lot of optional battles, since the additional experience and items are almost never worth it. If you want, I can try to remember each of the gotcha moments I lost to, and how I avoid them now.
The more you use exploits, the more you feel compelled to increase the difficulty. The more you increase the difficulty, the more you use exploits. Likewise, the less you use one, the less you'll use the other. The solo LoB challenge is an excellent example: it's nearly impossible to do it truly exploit-free, and most of the time it's very, very exploit-intensive.
I've cranked up both exploits and difficulty as far as it can go, and it burned me out pretty bad. There's nothing wrong with exploits per se, but they do encourage some playstyles that aren't quite as fun in the long run.
All I asked was why one would play this way, not state that one cannot or should not play this way. Perhaps the cheese mention is a trigger for such a response, then I apologise for the misunderstanding. Cheese is not bad; it is to me something you do when you have absolutely no pleasure in an encounter or have done everything before it and cannot progress reliably.
Still, what remains. I just don't understand why in a noreload you need to install something like scs and the exploit some encounters; could it be that you are simply not high level enough, or don't have the reliable gear or spells to have a good chance to survive, or not the right party composition, or maybe some encounters should just be skipped in a noreload altogether. Why a difficulty enhancement mod and not experience it to its fullest?
Same as I will never understand why people rush to shoal or the basilisks for XP while they can play the main story and get levels that way, and then slowly venture a bit around the main questline to get more XP and items. Or why people steal algernons cloak without the quest having been triggered.
Sorry, ranting.
I'll try to answer the early-experience thing, though: low levels in D&D 2e suck. A Thief, Bard, Mage, Sorcerer or Monk with 16 CON must be level 3 (fewer for mages with a familiar, I guess) before they're guaranteed to be safe from being 1-shot by a Kobold or Hobgoblin arrow. Warriors can't tank anything outside of like Kobolds at low levels: they're in very real danger of getting killed in two hits in a lot of cases. I don't know about everyone, but I don't consider it to be fun whatsoever when a natural 20 forces me to roll up another character. Getting characters to level 4 or 5 is where the actually interesting gameplay and decision-making happens: spellcasters have actual options, warriors can survive a couple hits, thieves' abilities aren't failing 95% of the time (just 70%
As to why people install difficulty/challenge mods while still making some parts of the game easy: for me, it's because the base game A.I. and encounters are far too easy and not enjoyable to play against anymore. From the Amazons actually ambushing you during travel, having to fight Sarevok's Acolytes in BG2, to thieves being smart and trying to backstab the weaker members of the team, I don't think I could play through those encounters without feeling... empty, I guess, without the added difficulty. SCS even makes several encounters impossible to cheese, such as not being able to firebomb the Amazons since they're in a different map, or not fighting only Sarevok.
To put the two paragraphs together, cheesing the early-game doesn't make the end-game difficulty from SCS any less: it just lets me get there more reliably. More importantly for me, I don't have to play at low levels because frankly that's my least favorite period of the game, mods or not. I understand that it's part of the journey for some people, but those mostly empty wilderness areas in BG1 are not that fun for me: I generally only go out of my way now for specific loot or tomes since otherwise it's the same story of "kite and shoot" over and over.
People are just different and look for different things from the game. Your posts suggest that you consider RP a significant part of the enjoyment for your game - but it has almost no significance in mine. Hence, I don't do things like following the expected story line, or using NPCs and following the interactions between them - why would I when that holds no interest for me?
During encounters you wonder why anyone would cheese them, doing things like attacking from outside line of sight or area-skipping to dodge spells. Well, if you play solo and very rarely use any consumables, you won't get very far in the game with many classes without using some means to reduce the risk
Personally, I also like to manage risk, not totally eliminate it. Probably the main reason I play the game is because the results are always slightly different. I regularly trigger traps that could theoretically kill me (and therefore occasionally do) and most of the time leave spell-learning to chance. I roll natural HPs on level up and often let characters conclude a fight even when there is a small danger they will get killed by a high-damage attack. That dancing on the edge quality keeps things interesting to me. That's why I would typically prefer to dodge spells using movement than use something like the Greenstone Amulet before fighting someone like Neira. It seems clear to me that relying on movement results in a more interesting encounter than just attacking when there's no risk from spells - but I realize not everyone thinks the same
As for SCS, it offers a different set of challenges. Though I think part of the underlying intention for the mod was to reduce the opportunities for cheese, it's only been partly successful in that. In many cases what it does is close off some cheesy tactics, but introduce others. In the final battle for instance you can no longer kill Sarevok easily by triggering multiple traps and can't easily fight just him and Semaj. On the other hand there is now a way you can fire-bomb him from out of sight, which you couldn't do before. Playing under those different constraints may offer a fresh reason to play the game. So too may the fact that SCS eliminates a lot of the AI's stupidity and unreasonably restricted spell availability in the base game. How you weight those depends again on the reasons why you play the game in the first place - if you're largely interested in role playing opportunities then I can see SCS won't do much for you.
Ouch haha. In case you weren't joking: I mentioned those classes to soften my stance, naming them as examples of characters that I wouldn't expect anyone including myself to play very offensively in a party.
On a slightly different note, it's possible to bomb and kill Sarevok from out of vision in SCS? I thought his acolytes being alive gave him regeneration akin to the Sahuagin Prince, and with his innate Fire resistance I didn't think even 6 Fireballs/round were enough to make a dent on his hitpoints.
If you strand him by showing yourself and then going invisible in a corner, he doesn't pick you up again if you don't get into sight range. The only one of his acolytes who wanders is Angelo, so you'll need to kill him separately. With that done though, the rest of them cluster round him and can all be bombed together. Sarevok regenerates (and is unkillable) while one of his acolytes lives, but once they're gone you can just keep bombing away if you want, or run and shoot, or use high weapon speed to nip in and attack, or do stealth attacks round the pillars, or use magic damage, or just buff up and go for the mano a mano solution
"Face ME! Face the new LORD OF MUR.... Squeak ?"