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The Adventurer's Lounge: Guidance and Support for No Reload Challengers- Newbie or Veteran

Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348
Are you new to the forums? Interested in the No Reload Challenge, but a little overwhelmed? Maybe a little shy about posting in the thread? This is the place for you. The purpose of this thread is to give prospective No Reloaders a chance to introduce themselves, ask questions, seek advice, and prepare for their adventure. Think of this thread as an orientation and cocktail lounge all wrapped up into one. It's a place to learn and a place to schmooze. A place to prepare: A place to begin.

This thread will also serve as a technical support supplement to the No Reload Challenge. Do you need install guidance before you start? Has your active character encountered a bug? This is the place to ask for help. This is the place to get help.

This is the place.

Good hunting everyone!

Best,

A.

YgramulNeverusedPokotaWise_GrimwaldEnuhalArctodusSerg_BlackStriderBlackravenAerakarJuliusBorisovMantis37BorcoMirandelAndreaColomboBelgarathMTHloliensemiticgod
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Comments

  • Serg_BlackStriderSerg_BlackStrider Member Posts: 127
    Ygramul said:


    [reposting this from the Modding forum, in case on of the experts here can help]

    gibberlings3 site seems to be down.

    I am about to start a new BG2EE run, considering IR+SR+SCS.

    Could someone post links to the latest stable IR, SR, SCS [modified for SR] packages please?
    (Maybe you could upload your own installation files somewhere.)

    (P.S. I live on a Mac.)

    @Serg_BlackStrider thank you for posting your install order earlier; I hope I got the suggested combination here correct.

    ** Bonus question:
    Which of the Tweaks or Fixes should I use with these mods? (Since EE implemented some Fixes but not all.)
    Could you point me to a link for that as well.

    Thanks in advance.

    @Ygramul : You could always check the proper install order from my BWS WeiDU I post in each Grim Tales update. The IR, SR, SCS [modified for SR] packages I'm using are here. I also put BiG-World-Fixpack-master there. Check readme for using it. If you need/want other mods from my WeiDU now unavailable due to G3 down just let me know and I'll post the links to them.

  • Corey_RussellCorey_Russell Member Posts: 391
    Very interesting Grond0!

    BTW @Alesia_BH I tried the planar sphere thingy where I change the slider, using vanilla BG 2, and oddly enough, the enemies were always the same regardless of the slider. But maybe I need to change the slider before entering the sphere, I am not sure. Regardless, the enemies with the Gauntlets of Ogre Power were always there, even when I changed the difficulty to novice. But if I actually had a new game of novice and made it to this point, I think they wouldn't, but guess would be easy enough to prove - just have to get out of the dungeon on novice level, should be able to do that...

  • Corey_RussellCorey_Russell Member Posts: 391
    I'll try to replicate the Aestica/Bestica findings tonight.

  • Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348

    Very interesting Grond0!

    But maybe I need to change the slider before entering the sphere, I am not sure.

    Yes. You should change the slider before entering the sphere.

    The console code for the Planar Sphere is AR0411. Entering CLUAConsole:MoveToArea("AR0411" ) will get you there.

    Best,

    A.

    Gate70
  • YgramulYgramul Member Posts: 1,018

    Ygramul said:


    [reposting this from the Modding forum, in case on of the experts here can help]

    gibberlings3 site seems to be down.

    I am about to start a new BG2EE run, considering IR+SR+SCS.

    Could someone post links to the latest stable IR, SR, SCS [modified for SR] packages please?
    (Maybe you could upload your own installation files somewhere.)

    (P.S. I live on a Mac.)

    @Serg_BlackStrider thank you for posting your install order earlier; I hope I got the suggested combination here correct.

    ** Bonus question:
    Which of the Tweaks or Fixes should I use with these mods? (Since EE implemented some Fixes but not all.)
    Could you point me to a link for that as well.

    Thanks in advance.

    @Ygramul : You could always check the proper install order from my BWS WeiDU I post in each Grim Tales update. The IR, SR, SCS [modified for SR] packages I'm using are here. I also put BiG-World-Fixpack-master there. Check readme for using it. If you need/want other mods from my WeiDU now unavailable due to G3 down just let me know and I'll post the links to them.

    Thank you! This is immensely helpful.

    I will consider replicating your install as it seems close to what I want to run with.

  • Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348
    edited September 2017
    Grond0 said:


    I can confirm @Alesia_BH's findings:

    Anyway, I conducted my own tests on EET. Confirmed.

    Noted. Thanks!
    Grond0 said:

    I think the reason that seems odd is mainly because it contradicts an earlier hypothesis about the source of the anomaly.

    That and the fact that it is nonsensical from a game play perspective. This is clearly a bug to my eye.

    I'd suggest that this is probably less surprising to those of us who were aware that there were anomalies at play, than to those entirely unfamiliar with the issue.


    Most kits are already stronger than the unkitted class. This save bonus and save penalty compounds the advantage.

    I do think we should refer this to the EE team, as well as ToBex. At the very least, this is worthy of their consideration.

    Best,

    A.

    EnuhalAndreaColombololien
  • Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348
    edited September 2017
    And to be clear, our results to date suggest that the penalty applies when:

    1) kitted warriors use weapons with schoolless on hit effects
    2) unkitted monsters use schoolless special abilities (According to Grim Jim, replication?)
    3) kitted mages cast spells within their specialty school

    The save bonus applies when:

    1) kitted warriors face schoolless weapons
    2) kitted warriors face schoolless special abilities (According to Grim Jim, replication?)
    3) kitted mages face spells from their specialty school

    NW: This is not necessarily a comprehensive list: It only covers the cases adequately documented as of time of writing

    It's something other than intuitive. I suspect we agree that bonuses and penalties should only apply when:

    A ) kitted mages cast spells within their specialty school

    B ) kitted mages face spells from their specialty school


    Best,

    A.


    NW: Reviewing the old thread, Grim Jim had observed what we've confirmed in relation to specialist warriors and schoolless weapons. He just never got around to revisiting the case of Koshi and Celestial Fury in particular and explicitly updating the model in the general case

    Post edited by Alesia_BH on
    Corey_RussellsemiticgodBorcoAndreaColombo
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 7,967
    @Grond0: My tests actually involved a dwarven mage who received a Kensai kit via EEKeeper, along with a multi-classed human fighter/Bounty Hunter. The specialist bonuses and penalties apply to non-fighters as well.

    lolien
  • Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348
    edited September 2017


    This, however, does not apply to effects applied by .eff files. This means that Power Attack is NOT affected by either the kit of the attacker or the defender.

    Can you replicate @semiticgod's finding in regards to Power Attack, @Grond0?

    In my SCS v30, EE v1.3 install, I appear to be observing an assymmety. Bestica appears to be enjoying a +2 bonus against Aestica's Power Attack. She's rolling between -1 and 18. Aestica, in contrast, rolls between -3 and 16 against Bestica's Power Attack.

    I've yet to see Bestica applying a penalty, though she seems to be enjoying a bonus.


    Best,

    A.


    EDIT: If I set both of their save v death to -1, Bestica will never fail against Aestica's Power Attack, whereas Aestica will fail against Bestica's Power Attack.

    Post edited by Alesia_BH on
    lolien
  • Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348
    edited September 2017

    My tests actually involved a dwarven mage who received a Kensai kit via EEKeeper, along with a multi-classed human fighter/Bounty Hunter. The specialist bonuses and penalties apply to non-fighters as well.

    Noted.

    I'd be more interested in seeing a mage with a proper mage kit with and against schoolless weapons. That would provide a more game relevant confirmation

    Post edited by Alesia_BH on
  • RVNSRVNS Member Posts: 101
    Quick question for anyone that has a moment. Before I tackle Silke in Beregost I was wondering if she had any nasty tricks seeing as she is a mage?

  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 7,967
    @RVNS: Don't know about the vanilla game, but in SCS, she has a level 10 Chromatic Orb that can petrify you and a 10d6 Lightning Bolt spell. I've also seen her go invisible and run around for ages while hasted.

    I like to charm her with Algernon's Cloak, have her summon a Phase Spider, then Haste the spider and my party before I speak to Garrick. Then I turn the spider against her and poison her through her pre-cast Stoneskins.

    Sometimes I recruit Firebead Elvenhair and have him chip in a summoning spell, but he does have 90% resistance to Algernon's Cloak due to being an elf, so it can take lots of tries before you successfully charm him.

    JuliusBorisovAerakarAndreaColombololien
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 2,503
    Alesia_BH said:

    Can you replicate @semiticgod's finding in regards to Power Attack, @Grond0?

    In my SCS v30, EE v1.3 install, I appear to be observing an assymmety. Bestica appears to be enjoying a +2 bonus against Aestica's Power Attack. She's rolling between -1 and 18. Aestica, in contrast, rolls between -3 and 16 against Bestica's Power Attack.

    I get the same as you Alesia, i.e. a fighter has no bonus or penalty, but a berserker is getting a +2 bonus.

    Alesia_BHsemiticgodAndreaColombololien
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 2,503
    That sounds right @chimaera. I do have a vague memory that wild mages do benefit from this - I'll check on that and dual-classing after work tonight if no-one else has done so first.

  • Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348
    edited September 2017
    Grond0 said:


    I get the same as you Alesia, i.e. a fighter has no bonus or penalty, but a berserker is getting a +2 bonus.

    Noted. I wonder if @semiticgod can replicate in his install, or if there is a difference between our setups. This does conflict with his earlier findings in relation to Power Attack

    Best,

    A.

    Post edited by Alesia_BH on
  • Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348
    edited September 2017
    Grond0 said:


    What I was referring to was understanding the source of the problem.

    Got it. In the intro, I was referring to the phenomena as a whole, from the perspective of the uninitiated.


    Best,

    A.

    Post edited by Alesia_BH on
  • PokotaPokota Member Posts: 489
    @RVNS: Even in Vanilla, it's a tricky fight. Her first spell should be Mirror Image (or some other spell that can prevent interruption by damage, but I can say with certainty that if Gorion's Ward is level 1 it'll be MI), her second is Lightning Bolt. If you have a potion of absorption then that should protect from all of her tricks (her melee weapon is a quarterstaff). I do believe that she will also run away invisibly in an Unmodded game if given the opportunity, but because of how her AI works she won't actually flee, just reposition herself.

    semiticgodlolien
  • RVNSRVNS Member Posts: 101
    @Pokota @semiticgod Thanks for the advice. I should have stated I was playing on Core with SCS if that changes up anything.

    lolien
  • ArctodusArctodus Member Posts: 796
    @Alesia_BH A little while ago, you talked about your concept of "Magic Number". Would you care to elaborate about that ? Please, enlighten us. :)

    JuliusBorisov
  • Corey_RussellCorey_Russell Member Posts: 391
    I was pretty busy last night (got work too). Will try again tonight.

    Alesia_BHlolien
  • Alesia_BHAlesia_BH Member Posts: 348
    I'm glad to hear someone else has made use of is, YingusXiaous!

    And, yes: It is helpful for analyzing enemy defenses, as well as examining your own.

    Best,

    A.

  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 7,967
    I'd like to raise another issue. Due to the way SCS handles magic attacks, they can sometimes hit the wrong critter. Secret Word summons an invisible monster which then casts the actual Secret Word spell via a script at the nearest enemy. But if there are multiple enemies, or if the target is moving around, it's entirely possible for them to hit the wrong target, completely wasting the spell.

    Has anyone had trouble with landing magic attacks on the proper target? Because I've also noticed that sometimes enemies will waste a Khelben's Warding Whip, for example, on one of my fighters who has no spell protections active. And is there a good way to avoid this problem?

    It's especially sticky when mages like Irenicus or Tolgerias summon clones, who can soak up those magic attacks if you don't kill them first (and the Simulacrum clones can be very hard to kill quickly).

    Alesia_BHlolien
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