@semiticgod I've had many issues with SCS anti magic (SCS v30, BG2ee v2), in particular in my install the SCS component attacks penetrate invisibility seems to prevent secret word, ruby way etc magic from dispelling spell deflection, spell trap etc. I had to uninstall the component eventually.
True. You can actually determine the magic number of enemies simply by looking at their pre-buffs--bearing in mind that many SCS enemies in BG2 and ToB will use a Spell Deflection+Spell Shield+Protection from Magical Weapons Spell Trigger that will boost their magic number as much as 3 points.
Yes. The Magic Number is the number of uncountered spell equivalent actions. The deployment of counters can increase the number of actions required.
But if you have multiple mages in the party, bear in mind that you can take down enemy defenses much faster.
Yes. The number of uncountered spell equivalent actions required to remove defenses won't necessarily equal the number of rounds required. If an actor can deploy more than one SEA per round, then the rounds required can be much less that the Magic Number.
Likewise, if the enemy has multiple mages in it, it becomes much, much harder to maintain your own defenses
Right. That risk can be mitigated by using redundant protections (Ex- Spell Deflection + Spell Turning + Spell Trap- it's not as wasteful as it seems), and keeping extra protections in reserve to be deployed as counters. I also keep a Spell Shield + Spell Deflection + ProMW Trigger in reserve, in addition to keeping excess blues in the book. In SCS Ascension, I've yet to encounter a battle where I could not maintain my buffs, save against Mordenkain's Disjunction and Wish with the new, imperfect version of Spell Shield.
With the Fixpack and SCS v21 or higher, the yuan-ti's in particular can typically be thwarted by GoI + Spell Shield, since they're scripted to take down Spell Shields with Spell Thrust and that strategy does not work in the presence of GoI in v21+ with the Fixpack V10. They'll waste their Spell Thrusts and then run out.
@semiticgod I've had many issues with SCS anti magic (SCS v30, BG2ee v2), in particular in my install the SCS component attacks penetrate invisibility seems to prevent secret word, ruby way etc magic from dispelling spell deflection, spell trap etc. I had to uninstall the component eventually.
Noted. I'd be interested in seeing some controlled experiments demonstrating this.
I did not encounter this problem in my SCS v30, Fixpack v10 classic run, but, of course, that doesn't imply that it isn't an issue in the general case.
I said I would test the issues around no-school weapon saves a bit further.
1) Wild mages do benefit from the bonus / penalty as I remembered. 2) A dualled fighter mage does not get any benefit (as would be expected), but a dualled berserker mage does. I deliberately started the contest off at a point where the berserker mage had not regained his fighting abilities in case that made a difference, but the benefit was gained even at that point.
Sorry I keep asking so many questions. I am thinking of running a dwarven fighter/thief on my next go around. I was thinking of taking axes/throwing axes and darts as my starting profiecies. My question is how to most people handle large mobs without the use of wands?
For a solo melee character, the sleep wand is quite helpful at low levels. Once you get full plate, large shield +1, and some HP, even large number of mobs aren't too bad, as long as there aren't any enemies with hold such as ghasts or ghouls. But even then, you just keep your distance from those types.
For any wand you need 9 INT - sleep wand is not an arcane wand, but a general purpose wand (like the magic missile wand). You can't use arcane wands like frost or fire, or divine wand like wand of heavens, but sleep is a general purpose wand.
Some kits can use them too. In my current Gallant (Might & Guile) playthrough I'm effectively playing as a fighter with lower hp / no weapon mastery who can use wands & scrolls.
Onto the tactical challenges. Let's talk about SoA first.
I'm fond off all of them, really, however, there are a few options that I'd caution against:
1) Improved De'Arnise with the Tactics Spirit Trolls (use the regular Spirit Troll option) 2) Original Tactics Improved Bodhi (use the SCS version) 3) Tactics Battle with Irenicus in Hell (use the battle with SCS demons and SCS scripts)
(The Tactics mod was ground breaking, brilliant in it's time. It does seem dated now, however. Given my knowledge of your playing style, the pure Tactics components are best skipped. I use none of them, personally. Tactics was fun back in the day, but the community has moved on for good reasons.)
In ToB, you may want to consider whether the Sendai and Abazigal enclaves are right for you. I use them with some characters, but not all. They can be a bit much for some playthroughs. The final battle with Sendai, in which the statues animate once per round whether or not the previous one is dead, and the yellow dragon encounter in Abazigal's lair are particular causes for concern.
Onto the tactical challenges. Let's talk about SoA first.
I'm fond off all of them, really, however, there are a few options that I'd caution against:
1) Improved De'Arnise with the Tactics Spirit Trolls (use the regular Spirit Troll option) 2) Original Tactics Improved Bodhi (use the SCS version) 3) Tactics Battle with Irenicus in Hell (use the battle with SCS demons and SCS scripts)
(The Tactics mod was ground breaking, brilliant in it's time. It does seem dated now, however. Given my knowledge of your playing style, the tactics components are best skipped. I use none of them, personally. Tactics was fun back in the day, but the community has moved on for good reasons.)
In ToB, you may want to consider whether the Sendai and Abazigal enclaves are right for you. I use them with some characters, but not all. They can be a bit much for some playthroughs. The final battle with Sendai, in which the statues animate once per round whether or not the previous one is dead. And the yellow dragon encounter in Abazigal's lair are particular causes for concern.
Anyhoo, let me know if you have any questions!
Best,
A
Thank you for the insights.
I am particularly curious how you handle the "Fiends" install options: The SCS readme on "at will" abilities are.... frightful.
Similarly, components like "Improved Irenicus" look just ghastly.
You can compare the Atweaks / Spell Revisions fiends as well to regular BG, as well as the SoD ones. The list of abilities looks scary but it only really matters in a prolonged engagement when fiends have increased hp or numbers. I'm not too unhappy if a Balor fireballs rather than attacking in melee with a vorpal sword for example, particularly when it interrupts Irenicus' timestop cast... Forewarned is forearmed in any case!
I use all the enhanced creatures, with improved staying power, including the fiends.
My beholders can not burn through protection. My illithid have enhanced resistances, but can not see through invisibility. Golems do not create cursed wounds.
I really like the SCS fiends. They're challenging, but not overpowered.
In party play, their abilities could be problematic. In my insane party playthrough, they were no trouble, however, I was running a four person all arcane squad. It would probably be difficult to protect 6 non-arcane characters from, say, symbol stun at will and vorpal hits at -4. That said, with a full party, you could probably kill them very fast. I'll defer to others on that latter point: I've never tried it, so I'm not sure how the balancing would play out in practice.
(If I were playing a cavalier, I'd absolutely want enhanced fiends!)
(I should probably compose a proper, detail post on SCS install options for this thread semi-soon.)
Some comments on A-Tweaks. I love ATweaks, but, sadly, I find very nearly all the components unusable in their packaged state:
PnP Fiends
-Briliant translation of PnP content to the BG world, though not without problems
-Read the documentation thoroughly or you will probably die
-Some creature abilities are exceedingly dangerous in no reload play, such as the balor vorpal (no save allowed)
-If the PnP stats are used (options 1 without SCS Improved Fiends, or option 2 with SCS Improved Fiends), your fiends will lack the statistical heft to stand and fight
-The SCS/ATweaks hybrid fiends (SCS Improved Fiends plus, subsequently, ATweaks PnP Fiends option 3) are probably the most suitably balanced, although you'll encounter some oddities
-Be wary of enabling Fiendish Gating: it can be fun, but deadly- especially if the SCS/ATweaks hybrid fiends are used
-There is some great content here, but I can't unreservedly recommend this component. Balancing is an issue on most settings: with some being underpowered (ex- PnP stats, no fiendish gating) and others being over powered (ex- SCS stats with Fiendish Gating
-Until further notice, you should consider me to be in the SCS fiends camp (ie- I prefer SCS fiends). I may come around to ATweaks fiends after further testing
PnP Elemental
-Gives elementals a much needed spruce up. There is a lot to like here.
-Great scripting
-Interesting abilities
-Summons may be overpowered, disturbing balance
-There is some great content here, but I can't unreservedly recommend this component at this time. I'm concerned that ATweaks may overpower elemental summons, including aerial servants. Additionally, ATweaks dramatically weakens the opponent elemental princes (ex-Ogremoch) relative to their SCS counterparts
PnP Mephits
-Makes mephits far more interesting and far more dangerous
-Very well executed
-I really like this component, but not everyone will. Polytope once said that "In the end, it's a mod that makes mephits even more annoying." Some may sympathize with his view
PnP Undead
-Interesting, but arguably the least interesting of the ATweaks creature components
-Be wary of spell like abilities from ATweaks Undead
-Read the documentation or you will probably die
PnP Fey
-Interesting. Well executed, but problematic
-Fey are inserted in new, occasionally odd places
-Summoned fey are poorly balanced and overpowered
I'll likely try an install with the following options in a future playthrough:
-ATweaks Fiends WITH SCS stats
-ATweak Elementals with a mod to retain the SCS opponent princes
Similarly, components like "Improved Irenicus" look just ghastly.
Yeah. The Improved Irenicus component was taken from Tactics. David integrated it into the installer by request, but he personally does not use it or recommend using it.
To modern eyes, the Tactics battles tend to be puzzle like, unsubtle and immersion breaking.
David did a nice job of modernizing some of the Tactics content though. For example, I think he did a great job with Bodhi. The SCS/Tactics hybrid Bodhi is a win.
Anyone know which mod introduces the hideously fatal "mummy rot" ability for mummies? It kills you within a day or so if it is not cured, offers no saving throw, and bypasses magic resistance and spell protections.
Anyone know which mod introduces the hideously fatal "mummy rot" ability for mummies? It kills you within a day or so if it is not cured, offers no saving throw, and bypasses magic resistance and spell protections.
Anyone know which mod introduces the hideously fatal "mummy rot" ability for mummies? It kills you within a day or so if it is not cured, offers no saving throw, and bypasses magic resistance and spell protections.
$5 says that's A-Tweaks Undead. Not sure though.
True. It's indeed aTweaks:
Disease, Mummy The scabrous touch of a Mummy infects the victim with a rotting disease which is fatal in 6 days. As the disease progresses it causes the victim to lose 2 points of Charisma per day. Cure Wounds spells have no effect on a person infected with mummy rot. Any person killed by mummy rot cannot be raised from the dead.
Disease, Greater Mummy Anyone struck by the Greater Mummy's attack becomes infected with a horrible rotting disease that is even more sinister than that of normal mummies, for it manifests itself in a matter of hours instead of days and is fatal in a single day. For every four hours the disease goes untreated, the victim loses 2 points of Charisma and 1 point each of Strength and Constitution. The disease causes the person to die within a short time unless the proper medical care can be obtained. No normal healing is possible while the disease is spreading through the body and the shakings and convulsions that accompany it make spell casting impossible.
Ok, so: I've run into a problem in Aestica's game. I installed SCS -with the smarter ToB components- over (after) BP Ascension, but the BP Ascension scripts control. This is unacceptable. I can't play this way, even if it would't lead to game breaking bugs later (it probably will).
Here's my question: What's the current best practice protocol for installing Ascension with the SCS scripts on an EE v1.3 (NW: Note not v2.X) install? I'm on OS X, if that matters.
The solution I'm learning towards is reverting to Classic. I'd prefer to stay on EE in the interest of supporting the Beamdog community, though.
@Alesia_BH - would you happen to have a youtube channel where you post your playthroughs?
Thank you for your interest!
But, god no: That sounds awful. A video of me playing would be, like:
-40%: Me organizing my potions case -30%: Me fiddling with weapons that I never use -20%: Me running around with a sling in my hand trying to decide what to do -8%: Me getting distracted by old Love Boat episodes and the squirrels outside my window -1.9%: Me actually playing -0.1%: Me dropping General Tso's tofu on my computer keyboard and crying
It would be the worst thing ever. Really.
I have made little music videos before. I don't really have time to do that now, though- seeing as how I'm leaving for India in a couple weeks. Someday, maybe.
For this install, I decided to leave behind "Improved Fiends":
I usually play with a full party and I don't like changing the challenge level of my setup based on charname. Seems immersion breaking to me. I have no idea how I can reliably survive Remove Magic at will with all the other nasties otherwise.
Surprisingly, SoD demons were fantastic.
They were nail bitingly dangerous. But with late game resources (dozens of potions; high saves) and good micromanagement they were successfully handles.
--
Meanwhile, I am permitting improved versions of Dragons, Beholders, Illithids -- and some select improved encounters.
Comments
Best,
A.
I did not encounter this problem in my SCS v30, Fixpack v10 classic run, but, of course, that doesn't imply that it isn't an issue in the general case.
Best,
A.
1) Wild mages do benefit from the bonus / penalty as I remembered.
2) A dualled fighter mage does not get any benefit (as would be expected), but a dualled berserker mage does. I deliberately started the contest off at a point where the berserker mage had not regained his fighting abilities in case that made a difference, but the benefit was gained even at that point.
Many thanks to @chimaera, @Grond0 and @semiticgod for their work on the save anomaly issue. Well done!
Best,
A.
Prior to install, open Stratagems.ini. Look for this line:
no_cursed_golem_wounds 0
Change the "0" to a "1"
I'm fond off all of them, really, however, there are a few options that I'd caution against:
1) Improved De'Arnise with the Tactics Spirit Trolls (use the regular Spirit Troll option)
2) Original Tactics Improved Bodhi (use the SCS version)
3) Tactics Battle with Irenicus in Hell (use the battle with SCS demons and SCS scripts)
(The Tactics mod was ground breaking, brilliant in it's time. It does seem dated now, however. Given my knowledge of your playing style, the pure Tactics components are best skipped. I use none of them, personally. Tactics was fun back in the day, but the community has moved on for good reasons.)
In ToB, you may want to consider whether the Sendai and Abazigal enclaves are right for you. I use them with some characters, but not all. They can be a bit much for some playthroughs. The final battle with Sendai, in which the statues animate once per round whether or not the previous one is dead, and the yellow dragon encounter in Abazigal's lair are particular causes for concern.
Anyhoo, let me know if you have any questions!
Best,
A
I am particularly curious how you handle the "Fiends" install options:
The SCS readme on "at will" abilities are.... frightful.
Similarly, components like "Improved Irenicus" look just ghastly.
G3 is down. I am, after many tries, unable to install any mods other than SCS (v30) on my Mac/Steam install.
I remain curious if the SoD demons were vanilla OR enhanced version via mod.
My beholders can not burn through protection. My illithid have enhanced resistances, but can not see through invisibility. Golems do not create cursed wounds.
I really like the SCS fiends. They're challenging, but not overpowered.
In party play, their abilities could be problematic. In my insane party playthrough, they were no trouble, however, I was running a four person all arcane squad. It would probably be difficult to protect 6 non-arcane characters from, say, symbol stun at will and vorpal hits at -4. That said, with a full party, you could probably kill them very fast. I'll defer to others on that latter point: I've never tried it, so I'm not sure how the balancing would play out in practice.
(If I were playing a cavalier, I'd absolutely want enhanced fiends!)
(I should probably compose a proper, detail post on SCS install options for this thread semi-soon.)
Best,
A.
PnP Fiends
-Briliant translation of PnP content to the BG world, though not without problems
-Read the documentation thoroughly or you will probably die
-Some creature abilities are exceedingly dangerous in no reload play, such as the balor vorpal (no save allowed)
-If the PnP stats are used (options 1 without SCS Improved Fiends, or option 2 with SCS Improved Fiends), your fiends will lack the statistical heft to stand and fight
-The SCS/ATweaks hybrid fiends (SCS Improved Fiends plus, subsequently, ATweaks PnP Fiends option 3) are probably the most suitably balanced, although you'll encounter some oddities
-Be wary of enabling Fiendish Gating: it can be fun, but deadly- especially if the SCS/ATweaks hybrid fiends are used
-There is some great content here, but I can't unreservedly recommend this component. Balancing is an issue on most settings: with some being underpowered (ex- PnP stats, no fiendish gating) and others being over powered (ex- SCS stats with Fiendish Gating
-Until further notice, you should consider me to be in the SCS fiends camp (ie- I prefer SCS fiends). I may come around to ATweaks fiends after further testing
PnP Elemental
-Gives elementals a much needed spruce up. There is a lot to like here.
-Great scripting
-Interesting abilities
-Summons may be overpowered, disturbing balance
-There is some great content here, but I can't unreservedly recommend this component at this time. I'm concerned that ATweaks may overpower elemental summons, including aerial servants. Additionally, ATweaks dramatically weakens the opponent elemental princes (ex-Ogremoch) relative to their SCS counterparts
PnP Mephits
-Makes mephits far more interesting and far more dangerous
-Very well executed
-I really like this component, but not everyone will. Polytope once said that "In the end, it's a mod that makes mephits even more annoying." Some may sympathize with his view
PnP Undead
-Interesting, but arguably the least interesting of the ATweaks creature components
-Be wary of spell like abilities from ATweaks Undead
-Read the documentation or you will probably die
PnP Fey
-Interesting. Well executed, but problematic
-Fey are inserted in new, occasionally odd places
-Summoned fey are poorly balanced and overpowered
I'll likely try an install with the following options in a future playthrough:
-ATweaks Fiends WITH SCS stats
-ATweak Elementals with a mod to retain the SCS opponent princes
-ATweaks Mephits
Best,
A.
To modern eyes, the Tactics battles tend to be puzzle like, unsubtle and immersion breaking.
David did a nice job of modernizing some of the Tactics content though. For example, I think he did a great job with Bodhi. The SCS/Tactics hybrid Bodhi is a win.
Best,
A.
Best,
A.
Disease, Mummy
The scabrous touch of a Mummy infects the victim with a rotting disease which is fatal in 6 days. As the disease progresses it causes the victim to lose 2 points of Charisma per day. Cure Wounds spells have no effect on a person infected with mummy rot. Any person killed by mummy rot cannot be raised from the dead.
Disease, Greater Mummy
Anyone struck by the Greater Mummy's attack becomes infected with a horrible rotting disease that is even more sinister than that of normal mummies, for it manifests itself in a matter of hours instead of days and is fatal in a single day. For every four hours the disease goes untreated, the victim loses 2 points of Charisma and 1 point each of Strength and Constitution. The disease causes the person to die within a short time unless the proper medical care can be obtained. No normal healing is possible while the disease is spreading through the body and the shakings and convulsions that accompany it make spell casting impossible.
Here's my question: What's the current best practice protocol for installing Ascension with the SCS scripts on an EE v1.3 (NW: Note not v2.X) install? I'm on OS X, if that matters.
The solution I'm learning towards is reverting to Classic. I'd prefer to stay on EE in the interest of supporting the Beamdog community, though.
Thanks!
Best,
A.
But, god no: That sounds awful. A video of me playing would be, like:
-40%: Me organizing my potions case
-30%: Me fiddling with weapons that I never use
-20%: Me running around with a sling in my hand trying to decide what to do
-8%: Me getting distracted by old Love Boat episodes and the squirrels outside my window
-1.9%: Me actually playing
-0.1%: Me dropping General Tso's tofu on my computer keyboard and crying
It would be the worst thing ever. Really.
I have made little music videos before. I don't really have time to do that now, though- seeing as how I'm leaving for India in a couple weeks. Someday, maybe.
For this install, I decided to leave behind "Improved Fiends":
I usually play with a full party and I don't like changing the challenge level of my setup based on charname. Seems immersion breaking to me. I have no idea how I can reliably survive Remove Magic at will with all the other nasties otherwise.
Surprisingly, SoD demons were fantastic.
They were nail bitingly dangerous. But with late game resources (dozens of potions; high saves) and good micromanagement they were successfully handles.
--
Meanwhile, I am permitting improved versions of Dragons, Beholders, Illithids -- and some select improved encounters.