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Suggestions Thread: Game Mechanics (scripts, spells, feats, combat)

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  • RumRum Member Posts: 10

    Rum said:

    The game is broken balance wise. It is at least broken for epic levels. The best classes are fighting classes with devastating critical, by far. Magic does not scale past 20. It's far too weak. The 'epic' spells for wizards are fairly pathetic. Hellball, that beam thing, the summoning spells, they are largely useless. Only the epic defensive spells have any merit. I've been playing crpgs since 2001 and BG in particular. One of the biggest flaws is lack of scaling. The DnD ruleset has barely been improved after 3.0 (and 3.0 is imo the very worst version). Both damage and penetration of level 1-9 spells have to scale up in effectiveness if NWN EE is going to be more than a smattering of melee builds being effective in pvp. the min-maxing stuff is really absurd and ruins the fun.

    But all of this, can be fixed with scripting and modding, I'm sure you can find some of that fixes in the vault.
    May be (I'm not sure) "Community Patch Project" do it. https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwn1/other/patch/community-patch-project

    It's very easy to do, a damage script based on the high level.


    If you want 3.5 ruleset, can install this: https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwn1/hakpak/35-edition-balance-changes-bug-fixes-ai-improvements-and-more
    BD says they are working together with several modders and former employees of the original game, among these are the guys from NWValut ... one thing I wonder, for years the CEP and NWNX are the basis for playing NWN in multy and molty PW, why then does not BD implement them? would not it make more sense? instead of having to download all the files every time?
    In my opinion, modding it is part of this game, some modders don't play, only make mods or haks for other people play it.

    But there are two principal reasons:

    1- CEP (comunity expansion content) is a dynamic set, it has periodical actualitzations from the comunity of players, and modders. You may include it now, but tomorrow will has a new compilation again with new content.

    2- NWNX is for multiplayer only, if you want to play solo, don't need it. And has the posibility to add plugins from the comunity.

    In other words, all of them are optional content, and can be modified from the comunity.


    I prefer BD make other things, that modders cannot do, like improve the graphic engine.


  • MalclaveMalclave Member Posts: 47
    ildaron said:

    (No THAC0 because I am not that tolerant). ;)

    THAC0 and BAB are mathematically equivalent. :)

  • mangamusclemangamuscle Member Posts: 30
    ildaron said:

    (No THAC0 because I am not that tolerant). ;)

    IMO the NWN:EE rule engine should be completely open so if somebody wants to us the BEMCI, AD&D 0 (pre-advanced/original), 1, 1.5 (unearthed arcana), 2.0 or 2.5 (black books+player's/DM options) rules they should be able to implement them. For some people 3.0 is not retro enough ;)

  • ildaronildaron Member Posts: 52

    ildaron said:

    (No THAC0 because I am not that tolerant). ;)

    IMO the NWN:EE rule engine should be completely open so if somebody wants to us the BEMCI, AD&D 0 (pre-advanced/original), 1, 1.5 (unearthed arcana), 2.0 or 2.5 (black books+player's/DM options) rules they should be able to implement them. For some people 3.0 is not retro enough ;)

    I will admit as an adult that you and @Malclave are both correct. In my truest of opinions I think that is the best solution. However I am being tongue in cheek and this being the internet I am going to rail against Thac0 as if it personally stole my bacon for no other reason because internet. :*
  • 1varangian1varangian Member Posts: 367

    ildaron said:

    (No THAC0 because I am not that tolerant). ;)

    IMO the NWN:EE rule engine should be completely open so if somebody wants to us the BEMCI, AD&D 0 (pre-advanced/original), 1, 1.5 (unearthed arcana), 2.0 or 2.5 (black books+player's/DM options) rules they should be able to implement them. For some people 3.0 is not retro enough ;)

    I'd like to jump forward and implement 5e rules.

    The bounded accuracy and limited magical gear concepts are great. And finally Wizards are sensibly flexible in 5e.

    I hope the devs will keep easy rules conversions in mind when unhardcoding things.
  • GM_ODAGM_ODA Member Posts: 177
    Add a new script commands :smile:
    GetDoorTarget(object door_tag) - returns the tag of the target specified by the door.
    SetDoorTarget(object door_tag) - sets the tag of the target specified by the door.
  • ShadooowShadooow Member Posts: 402
    GM_ODA said:

    Add a new script commands :smile:
    GetDoorTarget(object door_tag) - returns the tag of the target specified by the door.
    SetDoorTarget(object door_tag) - sets the tag of the target specified by the door.

    already done - Set/GetTransitionTarget
  • VWoodVWood Member Posts: 15
    1. Please make all epic feats available based on character level not class level, even if it means that a
    character above 20 can take 1 level in mage to get Hellball.

    2. Please roll hit die behind the scenes for all character levels at character creation in order to prevent
    save scumming for hitpoints.
    This will give gameplay closer to the true rules while still making it seem like hit die are rolled for each
    level up.

    3. Please give mode toggles, e.g power attack and parry etc., a clear 'on' or 'off'.

    The way it is now you often click the buttons, but then have to wait several seconds for the character's
    round to finish in order to see floating text above the character's head. But what often happens is that
    the mode does not engage and you have to try again.

    Modes also switch off when you give your character another command.
  • ShadooowShadooow Member Posts: 402
    VWood said:

    mage to get Hellball.

    2. Please roll hit die behind the scenes for all character levels at character creation in order to prevent
    save scumming for hitpoints.
    This will give gameplay closer to the true rules while still making it seem like hit die are rolled for each
    level up.

    3. Please give mode toggles, e.g power attack and parry etc., a clear 'on' or 'off'.

    The way it is now you often click the buttons, but then have to wait several seconds for the character's
    round to finish in order to see floating text above the character's head. But what often happens is that
    the mode does not engage and you have to try again.

    Modes also switch off when you give your character another command.

    2) If someone wants "scum" the hitpoints he will do so no matter if you hide them. There is also a hak packs that allows to do this - but some experienced scummers might know how to edit the hak pack and see it again. Anyway, 99% worlds uses maximum hitpoints ini setting added in 1.69 - each character gets the maximum roll each level automatically so nobody is forced to scumming the system by redoing the levelup or losing xp after level up.

    3) already done, should be in release notes
  • OmnipsiOmnipsi Member Posts: 31
    edited December 2017
    Shadooow said:

    1) Customizable spontaneous spellcasting (meaning cleric's cure spells)

    2) Possessable animal companions (animal companions are quite weak, if we were able to possess them it would improve their usefulness)

    6) Enable put counterspell ability into quickslot.

    7) Casting spells in polymorph (aka Natural Spell feat)

    Unhardcoding spellcasting and the animal companions/familiars systems, to whatever extent is feasible for BD, would be brilliant. When I can implement a comparably genuine-feeling Psionics system I'll be one happy camper.
  • GM_ODAGM_ODA Member Posts: 177
    Shadooow said:

    GM_ODA said:

    Add a new script commands :smile:
    GetDoorTarget(object door_tag) - returns the tag of the target specified by the door.
    SetDoorTarget(object door_tag) - sets the tag of the target specified by the door.

    already done - Set/GetTransitionTarget
    Already done in the new NWN or in some other tool?
  • shadguyshadguy Member Posts: 154
    GM_ODA said:

    Shadooow said:

    GM_ODA said:

    Add a new script commands :smile:
    GetDoorTarget(object door_tag) - returns the tag of the target specified by the door.
    SetDoorTarget(object door_tag) - sets the tag of the target specified by the door.

    already done - Set/GetTransitionTarget
    Already done in the new NWN or in some other tool?
    Already done and built into the base game.

    Dave
  • PL1PL1 Member Posts: 31
    edited December 2017
    - Full party control. The lack of it has always been an albatross around NWN1's neck, and it's a significant hindrance to module development. Module creators could make much more interesting and complex encounters if they knew the player had full control. In addition to controlling them in combat, I'd also like to control how my companions level up, what spells they have, and so on. Basically, just do what NWN2 did. I'd stop short of being able to choose their class, because class is often an essential part of a character's identity, but that shouldn't be hardcoded. It should be something module creators can decide on a case-by-case basis. If Beamdog don't want to implement this themselves, they could at least un-hardcode whatever is preventing modders from implementing it, so that the community can have this feature. A lot of people want full party control, and I personally think that NWNEE would be worth it for that feature alone.

    - The ability to alt-tab freely. I don't know if anyone else has this problem, but alt-tabbing always crashes NWN1 for me.

    - Make the dialogue box customizable. Let us change its size, position, and so forth.

    - A quickcast menu that's just like the one from NWN2. There are a lot of things I dislike about NWN2, but the quickcast menu was ingenious. Far more elegant and convenient than having to drag all your spells onto the bottom quickbar, especially if you change spells frequently.

    - The ability to use more than one tileset in a single area.

    - In general, un-hardcode as much of the game as possible. Open up everything you can to modders. That way, if NWNEE is lacking a feature the community wants, they can add it themselves. You can't go wrong with making the game more moddable.
  • DragontraDragontra Member Posts: 14
    Balanor said:

    I think I've listed a number of these in other locations, but to make sure that I have my the most important requests/suggestions provided that I've thought of (so far), I'm posting them here. It's really great to see that Beamdog is soliciting feedback about what we'd like to see added, so thank you very much for that.

    New/Updated Functions

    1. AddFeat
    2. DeletePC - //To give multiplayer players the ability to delete the .bic files of old/unwanted PCs in their servervault
    3. GetArmorCheckPenalty
    4. GetBaseAC
    5. GetFirstArea
    6. GetNextArea
    7. GetSoundsetID
    8. GetWizardSpecialization
    9. RemoveFeat
    10. ResetNWServer - //To allow players (DMs/Admins) of a PW the *in-game* ability to restart NWServer. Would be nice to include a flag in this function to specify what module to load on restart (or simply just use the currently running module on restart)
    11. SetAbilityScore
    12. SetBaseAC
    13. SetConversation
    14. SetGender
    15. SetGold - //Use to silently set the amount of gold in a PC's inventory. Useful for custom Pick Pocket systems, for example
    16. SetItemValue
    17. SetCasterLevel
    18. SetCurrentHitPoints
    19. SetMaxHitPoints
    20. SetRace
    21. SetSavingThrowBonus
    22. SetSkill
    23. SetSoundsetID

    New/Updated Events
    1. OnPoisoned - To allow the ability to override default behavior when a character is poisoned
    2. OnDiseased - To allow the ability to override default behavior when a character is diseased
    3. OnPlayerChat - Enhance this to get tells sent by GetPCChatSpeaker, and the PC target of the tell. This is needed for quick non-item use to target other players for voice commands. Additionally, have text sent by SpeakString and ActionSpeakString trigger this event as it does not currently do so
    4. OnUseItem - To allow the prevention of item animation use. Or to allow builders to stop all items from functioning for someone who is polymorphed to a creature appearance that doesn't have hands (for example)
    5. OnUseFeat - To hook into feat use, such as Smite Evil by Champions of Torm, so that their implementation can be modified
    6. OnToggleMode - To hook into mode use. I am specifically thinking this would be a way to prevent Hide in Plain Sight (stealth), from being spammed multiple times per combat round
    7. OnExamined - Allow for an object's description to be modified based on any number of factors affecting the individual who is examining it
    Just noticed this and wow, the things we could do with these. Obviously there would be a lot of considerations, but this seemed like a very well thought through list so i'd just like to voice my agreement with it.

    As a sidenote the IsPersistent column from the nwn2 feat.2da was extremely useful and, depending on what other enhancements end up going in, could be very useful if added to nwn1. Ultimately It should make life easier for PW admins trying to merge passive custom feats into their modules.
  • ProlericProleric Member Posts: 1,316
    GetFirst/NextArea is already in EE.
  • BalanorBalanor Member Posts: 176
    Yup, they added that shortly after I created this list. Mark two things off, at least.
  • narcissuslairnarcissuslair Member Posts: 12
    Expose player character events

    Add extension/custom properties to player objects which can be used for persistence or other data

    Improve the performance of the built-in database features

    Softcode all feats, skills, abilities, spells, etc.
  • JohnnyOnslaughtJohnnyOnslaught Member Posts: 3
    Alright, this is going to be a wild one and probably impossible to implement but:

    Lore being necessary to identify NPCs, creatures, and monsters. Instead of creatures instantly showing what they are ("Rakshasa", for example), a placeholder like "Humanoid" that is only removed and replaced with Rakshasa after a successful lore check.
  • ShadowMShadowM Member Posts: 573

    Alright, this is going to be a wild one and probably impossible to implement but:

    Lore being necessary to identify NPCs, creatures, and monsters. Instead of creatures instantly showing what they are ("Rakshasa", for example), a placeholder like "Humanoid" that is only removed and replaced with Rakshasa after a successful lore check.

    I did this in my HR base with a custom examine system, they are shown as creature and you use a creature lore check(you could switch easily to lore). So it can be done.
  • OmnipsiOmnipsi Member Posts: 31
    ShadowM said:

    Alright, this is going to be a wild one and probably impossible to implement but:

    Lore being necessary to identify NPCs, creatures, and monsters. Instead of creatures instantly showing what they are ("Rakshasa", for example), a placeholder like "Humanoid" that is only removed and replaced with Rakshasa after a successful lore check.

    I did this in my HR base with a custom examine system, they are shown as creature and you use a creature lore check(you could switch easily to lore). So it can be done.
    I think the implementation he has in mind is probably client-specific; DM's could always see the real name, and PC's with different lores would see different names depending. Without requiring NWNX.
  • JustariusJustarius Member Posts: 43
    Allow a gameplay option to toggle off the XP penalty from pets, summons and familiars. It's annoying to have a disincentive against using some class abilities.

    Create true returning weapons, that would help make throwing style builds more viable and again, less annoying.
  • RumRum Member Posts: 10
    edited January 2018
    Justarius said:

    Allow a gameplay option to toggle off the XP penalty from pets, summons and familiars. It's annoying to have a disincentive against using some class abilities.

    Create true returning weapons, that would help make throwing style builds more viable and again, less annoying.

    This can already be done in v1.69, throught sript coding.


    This a example of tweaked xp:
    https://www.nwnlexicon.com/project/nwn1/script/boss-mob-experience-bonus

    And for returning weapons, i'm not sure if can find it on the vault, but is easy to make something slimilar to:
    When used
    Delay 1 second, destroy it.
    Delay 2 seconds, create a copy of it in the inventory.


    Nice year!
  • RumRum Member Posts: 10
    A module OnClick Event.

    object GetClicker();
    object GetTargetClicker();
    location GetTargetClickerLocation();

    With this, can do realtime things, like 3 shotgun fires to diferent targets in one round (one heartbeat).

    Do it please!

    Thanks!
  • AncarionAncarion Member Posts: 155

    Here's my running list:

    I agree with the majority of your list. Just a couple of questions/comments...

    What do you mean by an "unidentified" icon? If I find, let's say, a pair of boots, I'm going to know they're boots, even if I don't know their properties. What kind of icon would you suggest be used in place of their default one?

    I actually like the dance of death. One of the things I dislike about NWN2 is how boring combat looks when the characters just stand still taking turns swinging at each other. I think NWN simulates how an opponent can force you to move into possibly undesired positions as you counter his attack. And you can adjust your position without using a turn if you keep within a 5 foot step.

    Overall though, a great list, especially the added event triggers and the increment/decrement spell function and mana system.

  • ProlericProleric Member Posts: 1,316
    More events (or pseudo-events) would help e.g.
    Equip/unequip event for associates.
    On transition click event with the option to stop the transition and do something else instead (see for example the exit I made in nw_g0_transition in Travel Builder, but coded more elegantly of course).
    Journal entry change event (some more modern games like Dragon Age treat quests as objects, which is much less error prone once you get the hang of it).
    The more events we can intercept, the better.
  • ProlericProleric Member Posts: 1,316
    Enable state linkage between objects in the toolset.
    So, for example, lever A toggles door X open/closed or placeable Y activated/deactivated without scripting.
  • JFKJFK Member Posts: 214
    Maybe Merricksdad means an icon that doesn't say 'unidentified' or otherwise indicate it's magical at all. Just as in D&D, one might find an old pair of leather boots, and not realize they are magical.

    -JFK
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