I can empathise with you. It's just that some people feel that their grievances have not been adequately or sincerely addressed, which is why some arguments keep on repeating to other arguments. I made the criticism thread as a pressure release valve so people who feel that way can voice their opinions without being belligerent or demeaning to others, and without being called out in return, as long as such behaviour is within the limits of the forum rules. I hope that is understandable.
While personal attacks are not cool, a debate in an echo chamber makes for a very short and not-at-all-productive debate.
Sorry, but you don't get to tell everyone else what they can post where. I am happy to check out your threads, but they don't in any way foreclose my being able to post what I want in other threads. In this thread for example, if someone posts a comment that there was some new aspect of the game discussed in the latest "Update" newsletter and that they liked/agreed with/are excited about it, why shouldn't someone else post that they did not like/agree with that new revelation?
Sorry, but you don't get to tell everyone else what they can post where.
I hope you understand the difference between an order and a suggestion. In this case, it was my suggestion. You are totally free to disagree with that.
I just tried to negotiate between the opposing camps, hoping everyone could come to a middle ground. Seems that attempt was futile. I don't regret having tried though.
I'll see myself out now. Have a good day everyone.
I just tried to negotiate between the opposing camps, hoping everyone could come to a middle ground. Seems that attempt was futile. I don't regret having tried though.
It seems to me that your "middle ground" is identical to the wishes of those who wants to stop people from posting their differing opinions in this thread.
Sure, let´s continue discussing why BG3 shouldn´t be called that, why it´s equal to Dos3 and why it´s not RTwP , just to celebrate the anniversary of the start of the discussion that goes nowhere (yes, the discussion already lasts for a whole year, with no new arguments in neither side in months). Don´t let us keep you distracted from it. It´s not like there are more topics about the game that could be discussed and, who does not love to be trapped forever in the infinite time loop of the "Groundhog Day"?
In other order of things, it´s confirmed that there´ll be no local split-screen in the EA. I hope you could have it in the final installment of the game.
There are RPG videogames like DA2 or Drakensang: TROT where you can only save one of your party members (your siblings in DA2 and the mage or the HE ranger in drakensang) and you have to play several times the game to see the full content. I hope it´s the case in Bg3.
There's a difference between NOT being able to save ONE, and ONLY being able to save THREE.
Or four and only one is left behind. Just remember you can be an origin character (I.E. One of your companions) so only one or two characters would be left behind.
Personal tastes aside, that is the same already done in many games, the two already mentioned, the first POE where Calisca dies in the prelude, the two Grey warden recruit companions that die in DaO and daO: Awakening, Thrask the soldier that cannot escape the Endar Spire in Kotor with you, etc etc etc.
The difference is that in those games you cannot go back and play with the ones that you left behind, it seems in this game you could go back and play with a different party in the next run, if it is made the same way it´s done in Drakensang:TROT If (and only if) it´s made that way I´m ok with it. Gives me something new to watch the next time I replay the game with another character.
That said, it´s merely speculation, we would not know for sure until later. Maybe even after the final release of the game, because it´s already announced that the EA would only last for Ch1 and with only 5 companions.
In other order of things, it´s confirmed that there´ll be no local split-screen in the EA. I hope you could have it in the final installment of the game.
There are RPG videogames like DA2 or Drakensang: TROT where you can only save one of your party members (your siblings in DA2 and the mage or the HE ranger in drakensang) and you have to play several times the game to see the full content. I hope it´s the case in Bg3.
There's a difference between NOT being able to save ONE, and ONLY being able to save THREE.
Or four and only one is left behind. Just remember you can be an origin character (I.E. One of your companions) so only one or two characters would be left behind.
Personal tastes aside, that is the same already done in many games, the two already mentioned, the first POE where Calisca dies in the prelude, the two Grey warden recruit companions that die in DaO and daO: Awakening, Thrask the soldier that cannot escape the Endar Spire in Kotor with you, etc etc etc.
The difference is that in those games you cannot go back and play with the ones that you left behind, it seems in this game you could go back and play with a different party in the next run, if it is made the same way it´s done in Drakensang:TROT
That said, it´s merely speculation, we would not know for sure until later. Maybe even after the final release of the game, because it´s already announced that the EA would only last for Ch1 and with only 5 companions.
This completely ignores what us critics are even saying and just makes up stuff.
First, the "companions" that get killed off in the prelude of PoE are not real companions. Every single companion in that games is met later on and is fully available throughout the game. Same thing with the DA games. All the real companions of those games are met later and are fully available throughout the game. So you're claims here are completely false.
Second, the complaint is NOT about not being able to play with those companions who are lost. So how does playing with a different party next time in any way address the complaint? You are (deliberately?) mischaracterizing what people are complaining about.
There are RPG videogames like DA2 or Drakensang: TROT where you can only save one of your party members (your siblings in DA2 and the mage or the HE ranger in drakensang) and you have to play several times the game to see the full content. I hope it´s the case in Bg3.
There's a difference between NOT being able to save ONE, and ONLY being able to save THREE.
Or four and only one is left behind. Just remember you can be an origin character (I.E. One of your companions) so only one or two characters would be left behind.
The only reason so few are eventually left behind in DOS2 is that there already are very few companions to begin with. I think about as many as BG3 has now? On that note I very much hope those extra neutral and good party members sufficiently round out the roster.
Personal tastes aside, that is the same already done in many games, the two already mentioned, the first POE where Calisca dies in the prelude, the two Grey warden recruit companions that die in DaO and daO: Awakening, Thrask the soldier that cannot escape the Endar Spire in Kotor with you, etc etc etc.
The difference is that in those games you cannot go back and play with the ones that you left behind, it seems in this game you could go back and play with a different party in the next run, if it is made the same way it´s done in Drakensang:TROT
I don't feel those are comparable. Haven't played PoE (yet), but the word prelude says it already: Calisca was never meant (read: fleshed out enough) to survive, at least not longer is needed for an introduction to the party-based mechanics. Same goes for the Warden recruits in DAO: exxtremely early in the game, intro to party mechanics, and their death is also meant as a stark reminder that becoming a Grey Warden is not without dangers or cost.
You also meet a well-rounded cast of other potential party members after, some of whom can die, but can also be saved, depending on the player's choice.
I would not be surprised though if some of those not-yet-announced party members for BG3 (or even all) can only be recruited after you're locked in with the current confirmed ones. Which would feel like kind of a cop-out, severely limiting our options, but that is just my opinion and speculation on my part.
... and the expectation of a polite discussion in good faith goes out of the window. I do not really know what part of my post would have triggered you so much but I will try to clear out the air.
Yeah, I know those are not meant to be full-fledged companions in Kotor, POE, etc, (Well there´s a trick to play with Calisca in POE and Shandra Jerro in NWN2 but they do not have dialogue after their deaths) that´s why I said that in those games you cannot go back and play the entire game with them but In BG3 it seems you can. I do not know what part misrepresents anything and what I´ve made up but man (ED: This reply is for the post of kanisatha and only for his, just to be clear)
There are RPG videogames like DA2 or Drakensang: TROT where you can only save one of your party members (your siblings in DA2 and the mage or the HE ranger in drakensang) and you have to play several times the game to see the full content. I hope it´s the case in Bg3.
There's a difference between NOT being able to save ONE, and ONLY being able to save THREE.
Or four and only one is left behind. Just remember you can be an origin character (I.E. One of your companions) so only one or two characters would be left behind.
The only reason so few are eventually left behind in DOS2 is that there already are very few companions to begin with. I think about as many as BG3 has now? On that note I very much hope those extra neutral and good party members sufficiently round out the roster.
Personal tastes aside, that is the same already done in many games, the two already mentioned, the first POE where Calisca dies in the prelude, the two Grey warden recruit companions that die in DaO and daO: Awakening, Thrask the soldier that cannot escape the Endar Spire in Kotor with you, etc etc etc.
The difference is that in those games you cannot go back and play with the ones that you left behind, it seems in this game you could go back and play with a different party in the next run, if it is made the same way it´s done in Drakensang:TROT
I don't feel those are comparable. Haven't played PoE (yet), but the word prelude says it already: Calisca was never meant (read: fleshed out enough) to survive, at least not longer is needed for an introduction to the party-based mechanics. Same goes for the Warden recruits in DAO: exxtremely early in the game, intro to party mechanics, and their death is also meant as a stark reminder that becoming a Grey Warden is not without dangers or cost.
You also meet a well-rounded cast of other potential party members after, some of whom can die, but can also be saved, depending on the player's choice.
I would not be surprised though if some of those not-yet-announced party members for BG3 (or even all) can only be recruited after you're locked in with the current confirmed ones. Which would feel like kind of a cop-out, severely limiting our options, but that is just my opinion and speculation on my part.
Also happens in Grandia2 with Lion, with Shandra Jerro in NWN2,... and in those games you do not get to decide or save them. I prefer if you can.
If it is made like in the first Mass Effect game, where you can decide to save Ashley or Kaiden (and you get to play them the rest of the game and even in ME3) I would be ok with it. That would spice up my next playthrough. I do not particularly care about games where you get to see almost 100% of the game in one playthrough.
There´s simply a matter of perspective. You are assuming that you must have a full roster of companions. I am assuming that in the game someone is going to die or is left behind because that´s what they told us. If that´s the case I prefer if you can hire the companions you lost before when you replay the game.
There are only 5 companions in the EA`s Ch1. If you have to left behind one (or two if you are not playing an origin character) but you can recruit him/her the next time you replay the game, I´m fine with it. Seems like a good excuse to reroll another character.
That said, I am not trying to convince anyone, I just expressing my preferences.
When you're in an argument, take your feelings out of the fight. Cease to fight. Do not throw any bombs. Let others have their opinion and don't try to win them over. Don't try to win the argument.
It is confirmed by Larian´s CEO Sven Vincke in the interview and gameplay with the youtubers that there are more companions besides the ones that will be in the EA.
Also happens in Grandia2 with Lion, with Shandra Jerro in NWN2,... and in those games you do not get to decide or save them. I prefer if you can.
If it is made like in the first Mass Effect game, where you can decide to save Ashley or Kaiden (and you get to play them the rest of the game and even in ME3) I would be ok with it. That would spice up my next playthrough. I do not particularly care about games where you get to see almost 100% of the game in one playthrough.
There´s simply a matter of perspective. You are assuming that you must have a full roster of companions. I am assuming that in the game someone is going to die or is left behind because that´s what they told us. If that´s the case I prefer if you can hire the companions you lost before when you replay the game.
Again, that is only the one character you're not able to save.
In any case, I think you and I just have differing preferences when it comes to re-playability.
I prefer the choice to take perhaps a different group into one quest than I did the previous one, one that feels more appropriate at the time, instead of having that choice forcibly limited for me. I would still replay the game to take different companions into that quest and hear their take on it. My player characters can be fickle but calculated, so if the party is heading into a Goblin stronghold, and we know someone who just happens to be Goblin, sure let's take them along even though we don't do that too often. I hope that makes sense, no hard feelings either way.
... and the expectation of a polite discussion in good faith goes out of the window. I do not really know what part of my post would have triggered you so much but I will try to clear out the air.
Yeah, I know those are not meant to be full-fledged companions in Kotor, POE, etc, (Well there´s a trick to play with Calisca in POE and Shandra Jerro in NWN2 but they do not have dialogue after their deaths) that´s why I said that in those games you cannot go back and play the entire game with them but In BG3 it seems you can. I do not know what part misrepresents anything and what I´ve made up but man (ED: This reply is for the post of kanisatha and only for his, just to be clear)
Again, Calisca is NOT a companion. So your entire effort here to compare PoE with BG3 is false.
As for the rest, here's how I see it:
Me: I want to be able to change who's in my party all throughout my game. But BG3 won't allow this.
You: You can replay the game.
Me: Replaying the game is completely irrelevant because it has nothing to do with my concern.
You: You can replay the game.
Me: Replaying the game does NOT fix my problem!!
You: You can replay the game.
Me: extremely aggravated
Again, I was expressing my opinion based on my personal tastes, not trying to undermine yours. Having an opinion myself and posting it, even if it´s against yours it´s not diminishing your preferences nor attacking your values. I´m astonished to have to explain that.
You´re putting it like we were discussing it at length and it was only ONE post of mine replying to another forumite without saying anything about your preferences but about mine`s, and then you replying in triggered mode.
I said I like to have more options when I replay the game, namely being able to save party members that die in the previous run. The rest is in your head, and only in your head. I don´t particularly care what you like or not, so giving you criticism or advice was never intended.
What defines you? Is it who you are, or the journey you’re on? In Baldur’s Gate 3, it’s both. Creating a character in Baldur’s Gate 3 isn’t the moment the world decides how to treat you, but it’s the very beginning of the shaping of your story. BG3 is a world with great player agency, and the most important character in that world is you. We’ve created not only a character customization system that allows that player agency to shine, but also a world that constantly reacts to how your character develops.
In BG3 you can start your journey by choosing your race, subrace, background and class. In certain cases you also get to choose a subclass, as perhaps a deity. These choices will ripple out across the story, affecting how you roleplay throughout the game.
You’ll assign points to your 6 abilities(Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma). Then you’ll decide which of the various skills in the game you're proficient with (eg. Acrobatics, Deception, Stealth). Last but not least, you customise your appearance and how your character presents to the world.
Will you be a beast taming mage-breaking charlatan halfling ranger with a toxic frog as a familiar, or a noble githyanki eldritch knight who let herself be seduced by the Absolute, with the ability to psionically drag her enemies towards her. Or, will you go for a more traditional tiefling warlock who made a pact with the devil? The choices are endless!
PROCESS
Our character creation features photorealistic fantasy races, based on 3D scans of actors and models (blemishes and all), selected because their features roughly resembled the direction for each race in the game, as well of course for diversity and variety in the human-like races. Our team spent much of pre-production carefully selecting, scanning, and moulding these scans, to become the base heads for character creation. Launched into Early Access is a total of 150 heads to pick from, across the 16 races & subcraces.
Alena Dubrovina, our Lead Character Artist wanted to shine a light on this. “When cinematic dialogues were introduced for BG3, we realized we needed to make a huge quality leap in our character art. We wanted to make characters look their best and put the bar very high. We had to be very innovative to make such a large range of heads and hit the quality level we wanted.”
“We decided to use scanned faces in our production to create characters that were as realistic as possible. We scanned 40 people of different ages and ethnicity. While scouting for models we focused on features that would fit our fantasy races and we looked for faces that either had something unique about them or were very versatile to fit different characters.
Eventually, we transformed the scanned heads into approximately 150 unique heads of various races that you can see in-game now, and that number will keep growing. Some of the scanned heads kept their features, but others became a starting point for creating new faces. We also used scanned data as a learning resource because there is no better sculptor than nature.”
RACES
In Early Access, you’ll choose from 8 races, each with their own selection of subraces. More will be added later, but for now they are as follows:
Human
The most common face to see in Faerûn, humans are known for their tenacity, creativity, and endless capacity for growth. They live fully in the present - making them well suited to the adventuring life - but also plan for the future, striving to leave a lasting legacy.
Githyanki
Githyanki are peerless warriors from the Astral Plane, known for their legendary silver blades and red dragon mounts. They seek the total destruction of mind flayers, whose ancient empire enslaved the githyanki for millennia.
Elf
High Elf
Heirs of the mystical Feywild, high elves value magic in all its forms, and even those who do not study spellcraft can manipulate the Weave.
Wood Elf
Wood elves spend their reclusive lives in Faerûn’s forests. Decades of training in archery and camouflage are enhanced by an otherworldly swiftness.
Drow
Seldarine Drow
Drow are the result of an ancient schism between the elven deities Corellon Larethian and Lolth. The latters’ treachery drove the drow into the Underdark, where they splintered into warring factions. Seldarine drow can be found seeking allies from all over Faerûn, aiming to settle their conflict with Lolth - and each other - by any means necessary.
Lolth-Sworn Drow
Raised by Lolth’s cult in the city of Menzoberranzan, these drow extol the virtues of their corrupt and merciless goddess. Lolth marks her followers with bright red eyes so the Underdark will learn to fear drow on sight.
Half-Elf
High Half-Elf
A touch of the Feywild remains in half-elves with this bloodline, and even those untrained in magic possess a hint of wild power.
Wood Half-Elf
Like their wood elf parent, these half-elves have a quickened stride and eye for stealth. Yet many break away from isolation in Faerûn’s forests to explore the rest of the Realms.
Drow Half-Elf
Most half-drow result from liaisons between Seldarine drow and surfacers. While half-drow inherit a few magical gifts, they aren’t usually raised in the Underdark.
Dwarf
Gold
Gold dwarves are known for their confidence and keen intuition. The culture of their Deep Kingdom values family, ritual, and fine craftsmanship.
Shield
Shield dwarves survived a long fall from grace, surrendering many of their ancient kingdoms in wars with goblins and orcs. These losses have lead to a cynical mindset, yet shield dwarves will endure anything to restore their ancestral homelands.
Hafling
Lightfoot Halfling
Lightfoot halflings are stealthy but social, travelling all over Faeûn to make names for themselves.
Strongheart Halfling
Legends say dwarven blood gave stronghearts their hardiness. Resistant to poison and wellsprings of endurance, these halflings easily hold their own.
Tiefling
Asmodeus Tiefling
Bound to Nessus, the deepest layer of the Hells, these tieflings inherit the ability to wield fire and darkness from the archdevil Asmodeus’ infernal bloodline.
Mephistopheles Tiefling
Descended from the archdevil Mephistopheles, these tieflings are gifted with a particular affinity for arcane magic.
Zariel Tiefling
Tieflings from Zariel’s bloodline are empowered with martial strength, and can channel searing flame to punish their enemies.
Baldur’s Gate is a vast cultural hub on the Sword Coast, attracting adventurers of extremely varied races and cultures, all of whom are looking to make a name for themselves in the city. In BG3, the NPCs of this world will react to who and what you are - giving you unique opportunities for roleplay based on your selected options in character creation.
For example, prior to the events in BG3, the city of Elturel has just descended into the Nine Hells. So many innocent people, cast without warning into the fire, never to return. The common folk speak of this hideous event with bitterness, with grievance, and with ill-tempered suspicion. So you can imagine that as a Tiefling (a being with an infernal bloodline and fiendish devil-like features) thanks to these world events you may find yourself the subject of mistrust and fear - at least more than the normal amount of suspicion your bloodline instills.
CLASS
In EA you’ll have 6 Classes to choose from - Cleric, Fighter, Ranger, Rogue, Warlock and Wizard - each with at least two subclasses to choose from. If you’re unfamiliar with D&D, some classes unlock their subclass early at Level 1 - like the Cleric - while others gain their subclass choice by Level 3.
If you choose a class with access to magic, you’ll be able to select from a number of Cantrips - simple arcane skills you can use to dazzle and destroy your opponents again and again - and Spells - more powerful abilities that you’ll have limited uses of between rests.
Just like your background and race, your class will also give you options in the world with roleplay. NPC’s might recognise the skillset you live your life by, and in turn you’ll gain options in dialogue and unique opportunities your other companions will not have.
Classes evolve as you level up and each class presents plenty of opportunities for customisation. Once you hit level 4 for instance, you’ll get to select from a wide range of feats. Feats represent talents or an area of expertise that give characters special capabilities. They embody training, experience, and abilities beyond what your base class provides.
APPEARANCE
Within the Appearance tab, you’ll customise the finer details of your character. You can choose from different voice options, alter facial features, hairstyles, colours, and beards. Hair and Eye colour will have multiple “canon” options, but these options can also be ignored and you can just pick whatever you want from all colours available. Finally you can add the finishing touches with a variety of Tattoo and Makeup options. You’ll notice that many subraces have different appearances to each other, which add another layer of variety to the roleplay in your party.
EARLY ACCESS AND BEYOND
Oh boy, do we have SURPRISES for you when you finally start the game. But we’re not going to spoil those. We’ll be expanding Early Access content throughout the campaign and have quite a few extra things up our sleeves, but since this update is about Early Access, we’ll cover those later.
That’s enough about Character Creation for now. We really want you to discover it. We know many of you are very curious about future races that may be added but with 16 races + subraces to pick from we feel like there’s enough content to get you started.
Our early access date is approaching rapidly so you’ll be able to check all of this out yourself very soon!
Q & A
Will Stadia have m&k support and will PC have controller support?
Stadia features a ‘beta’ version of Controller Support, but we suggest playing with a mouse & keyboard if you can for now, while we fine tune the controller for the future. Controller support
will also be coming to PC.
Will the respec option be a one time thing or will it follow us through the game? Can we respec classes and races?
We’re still trying out different ways of introducing respec so you’ll need to have a bit of patience before we’ll answer that question.
Will it be possible to play without romance whatsoever (like companions trying to romance you or each other)?
Who you romance is up to you. It’s completely your choice. You don’t even need to be friends with anyone, and you can reject any advances from characters in the game.
Will the Origin characters have fixed class, or we'll be able to choose one like in DOS2?
Same answer as for the respeccing. We want to make some form of respec available but are still working out what the best way will be.
Will crafting be in the game? If so, to what extent? Will my bag get full of crafting supplies or can I drop them off at camp?
There will be some form of crafting but it will be limited.
When we equip new armor, boots, amulets, rings, capes, do they show on our characters?
Yes as you equip items they will show on characters and appear in game and during dialogues. Rings and Amulets do not appear.
Can I pet the dog (and owlbear)?
Yes you can pet the dog! We highly advise AGAINST petting the owlbear though. As for the owlbear cub? We’ll leave that one a mystery for you to find out...
No Pallys or Sorcerers either. =(
We know they will add the 12 classes of the PHB in the final instalment of the game, but we do not have confirmation of all the subclasses or the races included besides the ones in the PHB.
I hope for some spells, subclasses and features of the usual official extended rulebooks like Volo´s, Xanathar´s or Tasha´s , even this one is too new and adds some complicated mechanic changes that I do not expect to see in BG3.
No Pallys or Sorcerers either. =(
We know they will add the 12 classes of the PHB in the final instalment of the game, but we do not have confirmation of all the subclasses or the races included besides the ones in the PHB.
I hope for some spells, subclasses and features of the usual official extended rulebooks like Volo´s, Xanathar´s or Tasha´s , even this one is too new and adds some complicated mechanic changes that I do not expect to see in BG3.
Yeah. I think they've commented on this in the AMAs or during the livestreams that they plan to have the base classes in the game for launch. Archetypes are the big question in my mind.
If they dont include all the classes, I will be bitterly, bitterly disappointed.
I believe they have commented on including other races (like Gnomes) which arent in the EA.
The respec thing is going to be interesting. I *dont* want a respec feature like DOS:2, where I can change everyone completely anytime I want to. Ialso *dont* want each NPC be totally changable like in DOS2. I dont think that'll be the case, because their classes seem baked into their story (Wyll wouldnt make much sense if he wasnt a Warlock, for example).
I'd prefer to be able to fully control the leveling process for each character, but I can live with them having most of the control over that (Maybe I cant make Wyll multiclass into X class, but I bet I'll be able to choose his spells and feats and such).
There's a lot of important information coming out here. A lot of it is clearly up in the air. So much so that I dont think even EA will be a great indicator (at least, immediately. Towards the end of EA, I expect they'll have more answers).
I was unaware of those Tiefling sub-"races", and while I find the concept interesting I'm dissapointed all of them are Devil bloodlines, and high-profile ones at that.
Also unsure why the split between Drow was necessary.
But good to see that line-up! Looking forward to seeing more down the line.
I think the Drow subdivisions are not a mechanical/rule ones, but a backstory/origin ones. They allow you to differentiate between Underdark Lolth-worshipping classic drows and "surface" drows because there´s no specific background for that.
I think the Drow subdivisions are not a mechanical/rule ones, but a backstory/origin ones. They allow you to differentiate between Underdark Lolth-worshipping classic drows and "surface" drows because there´s no specific background for that.
Yeah I get that. I just assumed if it's mentioned, it'll matter at least at some point in the game, likely when meeting a drow faction. But at that point I'm thinking how would they know if you're one or the other, but through your own roleplay?
Comments
While personal attacks are not cool, a debate in an echo chamber makes for a very short and not-at-all-productive debate.
Which is exactly why I made a separate thread for a civil debate ( https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/80569/bg3-worth-it-or-not-debate-thread/ ), besides the criticism thread ( https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/80568/the-problem-with-bg3-criticism-thread/ ), so that we can leave this announcements thread for announcements and news only. I hope you have noticed them both.
I hope you understand the difference between an order and a suggestion. In this case, it was my suggestion. You are totally free to disagree with that.
I just tried to negotiate between the opposing camps, hoping everyone could come to a middle ground. Seems that attempt was futile. I don't regret having tried though.
I'll see myself out now. Have a good day everyone.
Thanks for your effort @Rik_Kirtaniya
This isn't a "announcements and news only" thread, and it never was.
It seems to me that your "middle ground" is identical to the wishes of those who wants to stop people from posting their differing opinions in this thread.
Personal tastes aside, that is the same already done in many games, the two already mentioned, the first POE where Calisca dies in the prelude, the two Grey warden recruit companions that die in DaO and daO: Awakening, Thrask the soldier that cannot escape the Endar Spire in Kotor with you, etc etc etc.
The difference is that in those games you cannot go back and play with the ones that you left behind, it seems in this game you could go back and play with a different party in the next run, if it is made the same way it´s done in Drakensang:TROT If (and only if) it´s made that way I´m ok with it. Gives me something new to watch the next time I replay the game with another character.
That said, it´s merely speculation, we would not know for sure until later. Maybe even after the final release of the game, because it´s already announced that the EA would only last for Ch1 and with only 5 companions.
First, the "companions" that get killed off in the prelude of PoE are not real companions. Every single companion in that games is met later on and is fully available throughout the game. Same thing with the DA games. All the real companions of those games are met later and are fully available throughout the game. So you're claims here are completely false.
Second, the complaint is NOT about not being able to play with those companions who are lost. So how does playing with a different party next time in any way address the complaint? You are (deliberately?) mischaracterizing what people are complaining about.
The only reason so few are eventually left behind in DOS2 is that there already are very few companions to begin with. I think about as many as BG3 has now? On that note I very much hope those extra neutral and good party members sufficiently round out the roster.
I don't feel those are comparable. Haven't played PoE (yet), but the word prelude says it already: Calisca was never meant (read: fleshed out enough) to survive, at least not longer is needed for an introduction to the party-based mechanics. Same goes for the Warden recruits in DAO: exxtremely early in the game, intro to party mechanics, and their death is also meant as a stark reminder that becoming a Grey Warden is not without dangers or cost.
You also meet a well-rounded cast of other potential party members after, some of whom can die, but can also be saved, depending on the player's choice.
I would not be surprised though if some of those not-yet-announced party members for BG3 (or even all) can only be recruited after you're locked in with the current confirmed ones. Which would feel like kind of a cop-out, severely limiting our options, but that is just my opinion and speculation on my part.
Yeah, I know those are not meant to be full-fledged companions in Kotor, POE, etc, (Well there´s a trick to play with Calisca in POE and Shandra Jerro in NWN2 but they do not have dialogue after their deaths) that´s why I said that in those games you cannot go back and play the entire game with them but In BG3 it seems you can. I do not know what part misrepresents anything and what I´ve made up but man (ED: This reply is for the post of kanisatha and only for his, just to be clear)
Also happens in Grandia2 with Lion, with Shandra Jerro in NWN2,... and in those games you do not get to decide or save them. I prefer if you can.
If it is made like in the first Mass Effect game, where you can decide to save Ashley or Kaiden (and you get to play them the rest of the game and even in ME3) I would be ok with it. That would spice up my next playthrough. I do not particularly care about games where you get to see almost 100% of the game in one playthrough.
There´s simply a matter of perspective. You are assuming that you must have a full roster of companions. I am assuming that in the game someone is going to die or is left behind because that´s what they told us. If that´s the case I prefer if you can hire the companions you lost before when you replay the game.
There are only 5 companions in the EA`s Ch1. If you have to left behind one (or two if you are not playing an origin character) but you can recruit him/her the next time you replay the game, I´m fine with it. Seems like a good excuse to reroll another character.
That said, I am not trying to convince anyone, I just expressing my preferences.
When you're in an argument, take your feelings out of the fight. Cease to fight. Do not throw any bombs. Let others have their opinion and don't try to win them over. Don't try to win the argument.
*returns to bug testing WotR instead*
Again, that is only the one character you're not able to save.
In any case, I think you and I just have differing preferences when it comes to re-playability.
I prefer the choice to take perhaps a different group into one quest than I did the previous one, one that feels more appropriate at the time, instead of having that choice forcibly limited for me. I would still replay the game to take different companions into that quest and hear their take on it. My player characters can be fickle but calculated, so if the party is heading into a Goblin stronghold, and we know someone who just happens to be Goblin, sure let's take them along even though we don't do that too often. I hope that makes sense, no hard feelings either way.
I think there are tiers to companions:
There are the fleshed our Origin characters.
There are the less fleshed out mercenaries.
Then there are whatever US or whatever the name of the pet intellectual devourer was.
Who knows what the actual divide is.
Again, Calisca is NOT a companion. So your entire effort here to compare PoE with BG3 is false.
As for the rest, here's how I see it:
Me: I want to be able to change who's in my party all throughout my game. But BG3 won't allow this.
You: You can replay the game.
Me: Replaying the game is completely irrelevant because it has nothing to do with my concern.
You: You can replay the game.
Me: Replaying the game does NOT fix my problem!!
You: You can replay the game.
Me: extremely aggravated
You´re putting it like we were discussing it at length and it was only ONE post of mine replying to another forumite without saying anything about your preferences but about mine`s, and then you replying in triggered mode.
I said I like to have more options when I replay the game, namely being able to save party members that die in the previous run. The rest is in your head, and only in your head. I don´t particularly care what you like or not, so giving you criticism or advice was never intended.
In BG3 you can start your journey by choosing your race, subrace, background and class. In certain cases you also get to choose a subclass, as perhaps a deity. These choices will ripple out across the story, affecting how you roleplay throughout the game.
You’ll assign points to your 6 abilities(Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma). Then you’ll decide which of the various skills in the game you're proficient with (eg. Acrobatics, Deception, Stealth). Last but not least, you customise your appearance and how your character presents to the world.
Will you be a beast taming mage-breaking charlatan halfling ranger with a toxic frog as a familiar, or a noble githyanki eldritch knight who let herself be seduced by the Absolute, with the ability to psionically drag her enemies towards her. Or, will you go for a more traditional tiefling warlock who made a pact with the devil? The choices are endless!
PROCESS
Our character creation features photorealistic fantasy races, based on 3D scans of actors and models (blemishes and all), selected because their features roughly resembled the direction for each race in the game, as well of course for diversity and variety in the human-like races. Our team spent much of pre-production carefully selecting, scanning, and moulding these scans, to become the base heads for character creation. Launched into Early Access is a total of 150 heads to pick from, across the 16 races & subcraces.
Alena Dubrovina, our Lead Character Artist wanted to shine a light on this. “When cinematic dialogues were introduced for BG3, we realized we needed to make a huge quality leap in our character art. We wanted to make characters look their best and put the bar very high. We had to be very innovative to make such a large range of heads and hit the quality level we wanted.”
“We decided to use scanned faces in our production to create characters that were as realistic as possible. We scanned 40 people of different ages and ethnicity. While scouting for models we focused on features that would fit our fantasy races and we looked for faces that either had something unique about them or were very versatile to fit different characters.
Eventually, we transformed the scanned heads into approximately 150 unique heads of various races that you can see in-game now, and that number will keep growing. Some of the scanned heads kept their features, but others became a starting point for creating new faces. We also used scanned data as a learning resource because there is no better sculptor than nature.”
RACES
In Early Access, you’ll choose from 8 races, each with their own selection of subraces. More will be added later, but for now they are as follows:
Human
The most common face to see in Faerûn, humans are known for their tenacity, creativity, and endless capacity for growth. They live fully in the present - making them well suited to the adventuring life - but also plan for the future, striving to leave a lasting legacy.
Githyanki
Githyanki are peerless warriors from the Astral Plane, known for their legendary silver blades and red dragon mounts. They seek the total destruction of mind flayers, whose ancient empire enslaved the githyanki for millennia.
Elf
High Elf
Heirs of the mystical Feywild, high elves value magic in all its forms, and even those who do not study spellcraft can manipulate the Weave.
Wood Elf
Wood elves spend their reclusive lives in Faerûn’s forests. Decades of training in archery and camouflage are enhanced by an otherworldly swiftness.
Drow
Seldarine Drow
Drow are the result of an ancient schism between the elven deities Corellon Larethian and Lolth. The latters’ treachery drove the drow into the Underdark, where they splintered into warring factions. Seldarine drow can be found seeking allies from all over Faerûn, aiming to settle their conflict with Lolth - and each other - by any means necessary.
Lolth-Sworn Drow
Raised by Lolth’s cult in the city of Menzoberranzan, these drow extol the virtues of their corrupt and merciless goddess. Lolth marks her followers with bright red eyes so the Underdark will learn to fear drow on sight.
Half-Elf
High Half-Elf
A touch of the Feywild remains in half-elves with this bloodline, and even those untrained in magic possess a hint of wild power.
Wood Half-Elf
Like their wood elf parent, these half-elves have a quickened stride and eye for stealth. Yet many break away from isolation in Faerûn’s forests to explore the rest of the Realms.
Drow Half-Elf
Most half-drow result from liaisons between Seldarine drow and surfacers. While half-drow inherit a few magical gifts, they aren’t usually raised in the Underdark.
Dwarf
Gold
Gold dwarves are known for their confidence and keen intuition. The culture of their Deep Kingdom values family, ritual, and fine craftsmanship.
Shield
Shield dwarves survived a long fall from grace, surrendering many of their ancient kingdoms in wars with goblins and orcs. These losses have lead to a cynical mindset, yet shield dwarves will endure anything to restore their ancestral homelands.
Hafling
Lightfoot Halfling
Lightfoot halflings are stealthy but social, travelling all over Faeûn to make names for themselves.
Strongheart Halfling
Legends say dwarven blood gave stronghearts their hardiness. Resistant to poison and wellsprings of endurance, these halflings easily hold their own.
Tiefling
Asmodeus Tiefling
Bound to Nessus, the deepest layer of the Hells, these tieflings inherit the ability to wield fire and darkness from the archdevil Asmodeus’ infernal bloodline.
Mephistopheles Tiefling
Descended from the archdevil Mephistopheles, these tieflings are gifted with a particular affinity for arcane magic.
Zariel Tiefling
Tieflings from Zariel’s bloodline are empowered with martial strength, and can channel searing flame to punish their enemies.
Baldur’s Gate is a vast cultural hub on the Sword Coast, attracting adventurers of extremely varied races and cultures, all of whom are looking to make a name for themselves in the city. In BG3, the NPCs of this world will react to who and what you are - giving you unique opportunities for roleplay based on your selected options in character creation.
For example, prior to the events in BG3, the city of Elturel has just descended into the Nine Hells. So many innocent people, cast without warning into the fire, never to return. The common folk speak of this hideous event with bitterness, with grievance, and with ill-tempered suspicion. So you can imagine that as a Tiefling (a being with an infernal bloodline and fiendish devil-like features) thanks to these world events you may find yourself the subject of mistrust and fear - at least more than the normal amount of suspicion your bloodline instills.
CLASS
In EA you’ll have 6 Classes to choose from - Cleric, Fighter, Ranger, Rogue, Warlock and Wizard - each with at least two subclasses to choose from. If you’re unfamiliar with D&D, some classes unlock their subclass early at Level 1 - like the Cleric - while others gain their subclass choice by Level 3.
If you choose a class with access to magic, you’ll be able to select from a number of Cantrips - simple arcane skills you can use to dazzle and destroy your opponents again and again - and Spells - more powerful abilities that you’ll have limited uses of between rests.
Just like your background and race, your class will also give you options in the world with roleplay. NPC’s might recognise the skillset you live your life by, and in turn you’ll gain options in dialogue and unique opportunities your other companions will not have.
Classes evolve as you level up and each class presents plenty of opportunities for customisation. Once you hit level 4 for instance, you’ll get to select from a wide range of feats. Feats represent talents or an area of expertise that give characters special capabilities. They embody training, experience, and abilities beyond what your base class provides.
APPEARANCE
Within the Appearance tab, you’ll customise the finer details of your character. You can choose from different voice options, alter facial features, hairstyles, colours, and beards. Hair and Eye colour will have multiple “canon” options, but these options can also be ignored and you can just pick whatever you want from all colours available. Finally you can add the finishing touches with a variety of Tattoo and Makeup options. You’ll notice that many subraces have different appearances to each other, which add another layer of variety to the roleplay in your party.
EARLY ACCESS AND BEYOND
Oh boy, do we have SURPRISES for you when you finally start the game. But we’re not going to spoil those. We’ll be expanding Early Access content throughout the campaign and have quite a few extra things up our sleeves, but since this update is about Early Access, we’ll cover those later.
That’s enough about Character Creation for now. We really want you to discover it. We know many of you are very curious about future races that may be added but with 16 races + subraces to pick from we feel like there’s enough content to get you started.
Our early access date is approaching rapidly so you’ll be able to check all of this out yourself very soon!
Q & A
Will Stadia have m&k support and will PC have controller support?
Stadia features a ‘beta’ version of Controller Support, but we suggest playing with a mouse & keyboard if you can for now, while we fine tune the controller for the future. Controller support
will also be coming to PC.
Will the respec option be a one time thing or will it follow us through the game? Can we respec classes and races?
We’re still trying out different ways of introducing respec so you’ll need to have a bit of patience before we’ll answer that question.
Will it be possible to play without romance whatsoever (like companions trying to romance you or each other)?
Who you romance is up to you. It’s completely your choice. You don’t even need to be friends with anyone, and you can reject any advances from characters in the game.
Will the Origin characters have fixed class, or we'll be able to choose one like in DOS2?
Same answer as for the respeccing. We want to make some form of respec available but are still working out what the best way will be.
Will crafting be in the game? If so, to what extent? Will my bag get full of crafting supplies or can I drop them off at camp?
There will be some form of crafting but it will be limited.
When we equip new armor, boots, amulets, rings, capes, do they show on our characters?
Yes as you equip items they will show on characters and appear in game and during dialogues. Rings and Amulets do not appear.
Can I pet the dog (and owlbear)?
Yes you can pet the dog! We highly advise AGAINST petting the owlbear though. As for the owlbear cub? We’ll leave that one a mystery for you to find out...
We know they will add the 12 classes of the PHB in the final instalment of the game, but we do not have confirmation of all the subclasses or the races included besides the ones in the PHB.
I hope for some spells, subclasses and features of the usual official extended rulebooks like Volo´s, Xanathar´s or Tasha´s , even this one is too new and adds some complicated mechanic changes that I do not expect to see in BG3.
Yeah. I think they've commented on this in the AMAs or during the livestreams that they plan to have the base classes in the game for launch. Archetypes are the big question in my mind.
If they dont include all the classes, I will be bitterly, bitterly disappointed.
I believe they have commented on including other races (like Gnomes) which arent in the EA.
The respec thing is going to be interesting. I *dont* want a respec feature like DOS:2, where I can change everyone completely anytime I want to. Ialso *dont* want each NPC be totally changable like in DOS2. I dont think that'll be the case, because their classes seem baked into their story (Wyll wouldnt make much sense if he wasnt a Warlock, for example).
I'd prefer to be able to fully control the leveling process for each character, but I can live with them having most of the control over that (Maybe I cant make Wyll multiclass into X class, but I bet I'll be able to choose his spells and feats and such).
There's a lot of important information coming out here. A lot of it is clearly up in the air. So much so that I dont think even EA will be a great indicator (at least, immediately. Towards the end of EA, I expect they'll have more answers).
Also unsure why the split between Drow was necessary.
But good to see that line-up! Looking forward to seeing more down the line.
Yeah I get that. I just assumed if it's mentioned, it'll matter at least at some point in the game, likely when meeting a drow faction. But at that point I'm thinking how would they know if you're one or the other, but through your own roleplay?