It actually doesn’t count? It’s not in the paladin class, it doesn’t have to abide by a paladin’s behavioral code, it’s a halfling kit, and halflings can’t be paladins and Mazzy’s not a paladin.
But she thinks like one, and acts like one.
I don’t see how the fighter class has anything to do with that story.
A paladin without divine power is basically a fighter. Mazzy is as close as possible to being a paladin without actually being one. Barring that though, what in Mazzy's character, banters, or arc would indicate in any way that she is a ranger?
Random question. You mentioned folding single class cleric kits into multiclass options. How would you feel about doing that for Druid kits? Some really cool stuff like the Hivetender or the lost druid makes the fighter druid feel kind of generic.
I'd rather have a mod with fewer kits but compatible with quite everything and that I can easily edit, which is the case here (and the fnp spheres spells are perhaps not the most canon ones but I like the feeling of those, it's a pragmatic choice), than a bunch of kits but actually less "choice".
Why can't you install this, using the kits, without the sphere system? Are they intrical to the kits or could the kits be played without? Or can you install the whole thing, and then uninstall the sphere system? I don't want to risk it without being pretty certain - been working on this install all day.
There's a ton of great kits but I'm too old fashioned to want to change up how spells are arranged. I thought I'd used this before without the ss.
Only because there’s a bug in the version you are trying to install.
The version I’m working on right now is much more user-friendly in installation, and supports more options, and supports those options more successfully.
I might be able to upload a preliminary version of it soon-ish.
EDIT - As always, I also advise installing some kits from Divine Remix v8 before this one. They work with our sphere system, and now they work with the automatic multiclass generation as well. Fighter/cleric of Corellon Larethian with mastery in long swords and longbows? Check.
EDIT2 - The multiclass kits component notes that it should be installed after all other kit mods. Heed this. Keep FnP in the same place in your install order, but when you get to that component, press [ Q ] to quit the install. Install whatever other kits you want, and then, before CDTweaks, run FnP again. [ S ]kip everything you've already installed and [ A ]sk about components you have not yet installed. Then, and only then, install the multiclass kits.
(Of course, if your install order does not have any more kits after FnP, then of course you should just install the whole thing in one go.)
While this improves the mods itself, you cannot possibly count that people will read this lonely post and remember this every time when they install multiple mods.
3)
Now the mod very intentionally does that thing that players hate, which is tell you to install different components at different places in your overall install order. I always strive to avoid that, but here it is necessary. Does this seem tolerable? I've been toying with the idea of making the multiclass kits component into a separate, full-fledged mod, with a different .tp2 and different name ("FnP Multiclass Kits?"). That way it would be easier to remember - "install FnP here, and then install FnP Multiclass there."
I'm curious to hear how people feel about that. I've advocated to other people (*ahem*SCS) that they should yank components out of their mods and make them separate smaller mods, based on install order concerns. Should I apply that criticism here?
So you finally face the install order hell which players face all the time. Welcome aboard. This is great way to enable the ability to set install order via instructions/list/mod managers. GO FOR IT!
Did you alos advocate spliting SCS IWD spells part into separate tp2? Whatever your suggestion to split SCS into smaller mods with different tp2 names was, I fully agree.
@subtledoctor How does the install order work with Tome and Blood or Might and Guile? They all have multiclass kits too. Does Faiths need to be the last kit mod now?
@ALIEN fair enough to all that. Don't mistake - I've been dealing with these kinds of install order issues for longer than most. And to be fair to modders, nobody designs their mod to be split up on purpose. (Well, this might be the closest to that.) They have a cohesive vision, and they make a mod to realize that vision, and then they butt up against technical limitations.
Fair enough. I'm aware of technical limitations mostly because I wanted to remove them since forever. Right now, simplest and easiest way to avoid them is to split components into separate tp2 files.
Don't know if you want to have PI using this version quite yet...
@subtledoctor That's entirely up to players. PI always use locally downloaded and extracted mod.
Ah, interesting. What about the component # changes, though? In changing the DESIGNATED numbers for install components, does this update break PI's logic the way it would back in BWS? I guess I have BWS mechanisms stuck in my head. (Also technically I didn't change the DESIGNATED numbers... I added new ones for the new install options, and I disabled the old ones. )
It's no longer the case for PI. Nothing to fear about.
@subtledoctor How does the install order work with Tome and Blood or Might and Guile? They all have multiclass kits too. Does Faiths need to be the last kit mod now?
Among other mods, it should look like:
- TnB
- FnP (if v78+, do not install last component)
- MnG
- FnP v78 last component
TBH honest this is not strictly necessary. Depends on each particular player's overall install. It's just best practice. In the future it's going to be the new normal, so might as well start getting used to it.
Like I don't use the spells component of SCS for this very reason. Its a pain to split up mod installs. I don't use IR. I'm not gonna make a concrete claim, but if this is standard, I MIGHT just stick to earlier versions of FnP. Maybe.
Like I don't use the spells component of SCS for this very reason. Its a pain to split up mod installs. I don't use IR. I'm not gonna make a concrete claim, but if this is standard, I MIGHT just stick to earlier versions of FnP. Maybe.
I agree that its kind of annoying to have to keep track of all this. I didn’t even know that the iwdification was required until I saw it mentioned in passing on this thread. It would be nice to have the description updated somewhere where it can be more easily seen.
Edit: that being said I’ll give it a shot sometime and see if I run into any problems
@subtledoctor I've already had a working example ready. Probably the one significant difference is that I've put 'extra tp2' inside its related folder:
P.S. Notice that 'extra' tp2 has its own 'weidu backup path' in order to not collide with the main tp2. The 'weidu backup path' for extra tp2 files needs to be the same as the main tp2 'weidu backup path'. Otherwise, any kind of mod manager won't able to detect which 'mod resource folder' needs to be copied into the game folder.
While It's possible to put (setup-)fnp_multiclass.tp2 inside "faiths_and_fowers" folder, you would have to provide extra .command files and .bat files for Windows users in order to allow install/uninstall of components from such an extra tp2 file. Or switch installing mods entirely to mod manager.
@subtledoctor How does the install order work with Tome and Blood or Might and Guile? They all have multiclass kits too. Does Faiths need to be the last kit mod now?
Among other mods, it should look like:
- TnB
- FnP (if v78+, do not install last component)
- MnG
- FnP v78 last component
TBH honest this is not strictly necessary. Depends on each particular player's overall install. It's just best practice. In the future it's going to be the new normal, so might as well start getting used to it.
Eh, that seems kind of annoying.
Well, it's annoying because of the way how you install mods. Using a mod manager will save you
Comments
"I am sick of all the predjudice and wish I would be recognized as worthy to be a holy warrior just like any human."
"Aren't you literally a Truesword of Avoreen?"
"Ssh, that doesn't count."
A paladin without divine power is basically a fighter. Mazzy is as close as possible to being a paladin without actually being one. Barring that though, what in Mazzy's character, banters, or arc would indicate in any way that she is a ranger?
But of course some more do not hurt
Why can't you install this, using the kits, without the sphere system? Are they intrical to the kits or could the kits be played without? Or can you install the whole thing, and then uninstall the sphere system? I don't want to risk it without being pretty certain - been working on this install all day.
There's a ton of great kits but I'm too old fashioned to want to change up how spells are arranged. I thought I'd used this before without the ss.
While this improves the mods itself, you cannot possibly count that people will read this lonely post and remember this every time when they install multiple mods.
So you finally face the install order hell which players face all the time. Welcome aboard. This is great way to enable the ability to set install order via instructions/list/mod managers. GO FOR IT!
And if you will be annoyed by filling "SUPPORT keyword" several times, my proposal here: http://forums.pocketplane.net/index.php/topic,29857.msg339963.html#msg339963
Did you alos advocate spliting SCS IWD spells part into separate tp2? Whatever your suggestion to split SCS into smaller mods with different tp2 names was, I fully agree.
@subtledoctor That's entirely up to players. PI always use locally downloaded and extracted mod.
It's no longer the case for PI. Nothing to fear about.
Eh, that seems kind of annoying.
I agree that its kind of annoying to have to keep track of all this. I didn’t even know that the iwdification was required until I saw it mentioned in passing on this thread. It would be nice to have the description updated somewhere where it can be more easily seen.
Edit: that being said I’ll give it a shot sometime and see if I run into any problems
https://github.com/ALIENQuake/MultiTp2Example
P.S. Notice that 'extra' tp2 has its own 'weidu backup path' in order to not collide with the main tp2. The 'weidu backup path' for extra tp2 files needs to be the same as the main tp2 'weidu backup path'. Otherwise, any kind of mod manager won't able to detect which 'mod resource folder' needs to be copied into the game folder.
While It's possible to put (setup-)fnp_multiclass.tp2 inside "faiths_and_fowers" folder, you would have to provide extra .command files and .bat files for Windows users in order to allow install/uninstall of components from such an extra tp2 file. Or switch installing mods entirely to mod manager.
Well, it's annoying because of the way how you install mods. Using a mod manager will save you