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Any new info on Icewind Dale II?

2

Comments

  • Dev6Dev6 Member Posts: 719

    Question: I still have 2 copies of the Icewind Dale 2 retail disk (Boxed Editions) from when they released ... would that count as source code or not?

    No, it would not.

    semiticgodThacoBell
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 3,414
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 14,096
    Compiled code is compressed code that's functionally unreadable by humans. Source code is the original code as it was written using a programming language. If you were going to change a program, you'd need the source code because it would be the only way to manipulate it and still know what you were doing.

    Dev6
  • MalicronMalicron Member Posts: 629
    Possibly another dumb question, but why can't the source code be back-engineered from the compiled code? All the information is there, it's just in a different format. And since mods and editors exist, that code can clearly be read and altered.

    Aedan
  • tbone1tbone1 Member Posts: 1,995
    Just for the record, source code can be decompiled, or rather back-engineered, but if you don’t have source code, writing from scratch is cheaper, quicker, and less prone to error. Also, the IE games are, I believe, written in C/C++, which is harder to back-engineer than more modern languages.

    And this, BTW, is a good thing when your code contains intellectual property.

    semiticgodStummvonBordwehr
  • MusaabMusaab Member Posts: 86
    So the dream of an Icewind Dale 2: Enhanced Edition is dead, I assume.

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 10,294
    Unless the source code is ever found, basically.

  • If they can't get the original source code for Icewind Dale II to make an Enhanced Edition, they could consider the idea of performing a "complete reverse engineering" on said game.

    I'm not certain if this would be something BeamDog would be willing to consider but if performed just right, they would be able to reconstruct the original source code from scratch according to Modern Vintage Gamer back on YouTube.

  • scriverscriver Member Posts: 1,855
    Sure, but that would mean investing more money than they had to invest in the other games before development could even be started, and this time in the least profiting IE game.

    It doesn't make financial sense.

    Balrog99
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 5,810

    Icewind Dale '3' instead? Hint, hint...

    (Take my money now Beamdog!)

    scriverStummvonBordwehrGrammarsalad
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 5,810

    Icewind Dale '3' instead? Hint, hint...

    (Take my money now Beamdog!)

    scriver
  • InsultionInsultion Member Posts: 179
    If they can't get the original source code for Icewind Dale II to make an Enhanced Edition, they could consider the idea of performing a "complete reverse engineering" on said game.

    I'm not certain if this would be something BeamDog would be willing to consider but if performed just right, they would be able to reconstruct the original source code from scratch according to Modern Vintage Gamer back on YouTube.

    This IS possible, but not necessarily legal. They need explicit permission (or for the game to be shareware, essentially) to do so. At least, as far as I understand.

  • shabadooshabadoo Member Posts: 228
    Insultion wrote: »
    If they can't get the original source code for Icewind Dale II to make an Enhanced Edition, they could consider the idea of performing a "complete reverse engineering" on said game.

    I'm not certain if this would be something BeamDog would be willing to consider but if performed just right, they would be able to reconstruct the original source code from scratch according to Modern Vintage Gamer back on YouTube.

    This IS possible, but not necessarily legal. They need explicit permission (or for the game to be shareware, essentially) to do so. At least, as far as I understand.

    I believe this only applies if they use the name "Icewind Dale" as it is copyrighted. Calling it something like "IWD" might fit into a loophole somewhere. I'm likely very wrong as there will probably be a legal technicality I'm not considering.

  • John_BarleycornJohn_Barleycorn Member Posts: 17
    If they can't get the original source code for Icewind Dale II to make an Enhanced Edition, they could consider the idea of performing a "complete reverse engineering" on said game.

    I'm not certain if this would be something BeamDog would be willing to consider but if performed just right, they would be able to reconstruct the original source code from scratch according to Modern Vintage Gamer back on YouTube.

    Why i wonder, waste SO MUCH time trying to make another version of a game who had an already SHITTY mechanic. I mean, the only *really* good thing of icewind dale II was the fact that *finally* was in 3.5.
    But everything else? Seriously?

    Beamdog: just get your average bgII enhanced engine with the proper adapting and let's get this over with.

  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,000
    I mean, the only *really* good thing of icewind dale II was the fact that *finally* was in 3.5.

    3.0 not 3.5

    OlvynChuruDJKajuru
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 8,100
    I'd love to see this as much as anyone, but it isn't happening without the source code. GOG has patched their version to the best possible state it can be in for modern systems, which they attempt to do for everything they sell. It'll have to suffice.

    themazingnessThacoBell
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,511
    Closest we'll probably ever get to IwD2:EE is via a NwN2 custom module from the makers of Baldur's Gate Reloaded and the Icewind Dale module. But who knows how many years it will take them? It's been five years since BGR was last updated and even seven years in the case of the IwD module. At this point I am honestly not even sure whenever those teams still work on the sequels or not. *shrug*

    Bottom line: we either see it as a mod or not at all. Clearly not from Beamdog, of that I am sure.

  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 2,137
    problem is that won't have support for npc project for iwd 2 so that would be a no go for me.

  • Mantis37Mantis37 Member Posts: 1,059
    edited December 2019
    The EET people are working on integrating IWD 1 & 2 content into the BG series.

    https://www.gibberlings3.net/forums/forum/197-iwd-in-eet/

    DJKajurusemiticgodGrammarsalad
  • John_BarleycornJohn_Barleycorn Member Posts: 17
    edited December 2019
    elminster wrote: »
    I mean, the only *really* good thing of icewind dale II was the fact that *finally* was in 3.5.

    3.0 not 3.5

    Well, not that huge difference, and to be honest, it would be more appropriate to say "some sort" since most of the feats that should be also in 3.0 aren't in the game in the end.

  • WarChiefZekeWarChiefZeke Member Posts: 1,921
    Hot take: The best way to enhance Icewind Dale 2 would be to re-make it, completely from scratch. Anything else is just dressing up garbage.

    sarevok57John_Barleycorn
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 10,294
    Hot take: The best way to enhance Icewind Dale 2 would be to re-make it, completely from scratch. Anything else is just dressing up garbage.

    Its better than IWD1 :P

    megamike15kanisathaBelleSorciereCvijeta
  • John_BarleycornJohn_Barleycorn Member Posts: 17
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Hot take: The best way to enhance Icewind Dale 2 would be to re-make it, completely from scratch. Anything else is just dressing up garbage.

    Its better than IWD1 :P

    Becouse BG1,2 and IWD1 are advanced D&D 2.0, which had some sort of 'improved' ruleset from chainmail (if i recall correctly) and those rules were... Well, they need lot to work on it. The 3rd edition had at least a 'fairly decent' ruleset. (i still don't find those either so perfect, but always better than 2.0 lol)
    But yeah, i agree with warchiefzeke, at this point better remake a beamdog version and that about does it.

  • themazingnessthemazingness Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 618
    edited January 4
    Honestly, I like 2nd edition better than 3.0 or 3.5 (I'm speaking only of PC gaming). In 2nd edition I always knew how to build my character(s). In 3rd it seems like it is too easy to make an OP build or a terrible build. Nevermind the fact that after WotC took over all the settings started to disappear (well, except we got Eberron).

    sarevok57ThacoBell
  • ZaxaresZaxares Member Posts: 885
    I think that the early days of 3.5 were probably the best in terms of overall balance. As power creep crept in via new supplements (new feats, new spells, new prestige classes), the bloat got bad enough that it was fairly easy to create absurdly overpowered combinations.

    BallpointMansarevok57scriver
  • kanisathakanisatha Member Posts: 759
    The counterpoint to 3.5e eventually becoming bloated and over-powerful is that 2e was under-powerful and empty and boring. Many level-ups involved nothing for the player to do, and some level-ups resulted only in the character gaining 1 hp and that's it!

    I'll take over-powered 3.5e over boring 2e any day. At least with an over-powered and bloated system you can fix that simply by not using a lot of stuff in your game. Problem solved. With 2e there's nothing you can do to make it better. You're just stuck with what you have, which is an empty and boring system.

    semiticgodStummvonBordwehrscriver
  • themazingnessthemazingness Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 618
    edited January 6
    kanisatha wrote: »
    The counterpoint to 3.5e eventually becoming bloated and over-powerful is that 2e was under-powerful and empty and boring. Many level-ups involved nothing for the player to do, and some level-ups resulted only in the character gaining 1 hp and that's it!

    I'll take over-powered 3.5e over boring 2e any day. At least with an over-powered and bloated system you can fix that simply by not using a lot of stuff in your game. Problem solved. With 2e there's nothing you can do to make it better. You're just stuck with what you have, which is an empty and boring system.

    And I feel like that made gear more meaningful. You gain more hp, more spells if you are a caster, but otherwise what sets you apart is the loot you find. Finding an ioun stone or that awesome weapon is a big deal. In 3rd edition I feel like for a piece of gear to be meaningful it had to be OP, which again doesn't help balance. A +2 weapon with 1d6 fire damage would be a much bigger deal for me to find in a game like Baldur's Gate or Planescape: Torment than in Neverwinter Nights.

    ThacoBellsarevok57jjstraka34spacejaws
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