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COVID-19

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  • shabadooshabadoo Member Posts: 254
    Sorry Julius, that's is the point I was actually going for. Badly, it seems.

    JuliusBorisovGrond0
  • DragonKingDragonKing Member Posts: 1,774
    Phily D did a interview with Dr. Fauci Director of NIAID

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 8,362
    The expoential growth is now starting to completely overwhelm the US. We are at a 100,000 cases. We will likely see a minimum of 25k more tomorrow. We need a national lockdown. We've needed one for two weeks.

    ProontsmeagolheartGrond0ThacoBell
  • ArdanisArdanis Member Posts: 1,729
    Two days ago in Russia a board brought back few hundreds of tourists from Thailand, who've been put into quarantine camp. Apparently, they didn't like less than perfect housing conditions and trying to escape en masse, police trying to force them back in.

    So. You think your country's and WHO's recommendations are not for you and and decide to spend your vacation in warm South - that's fine, you're free citizen and can do what you like.
    Then you fly back and get put into quarantine, because who knows if you contracted covid down there. That's fine too, half the world had closed borders and enforced quarantine because panic - whether it's justified or not is another matter, what matters now is that everyone's in the same shit, so it's not just evil Putin stomping down on your civil freedoms.
    But no, apparently the quarantine is also not for you, so instead of waiting out two weeks like a law abiding citizen who knew what they'd been getting into, you start a mutiny and try to escape and fight police along the way.

    Jesus, I hope they all get a criminal record.

    ProontGrond0MaleficentOne
  • DragonKingDragonKing Member Posts: 1,774
    Can people STFU with the whole, "it's only old people who die from it," yet?

    Remember, when the Spanish flu happen, it hit the old people first and then hurt the younger people.

    https://www.msn.com/en-ae/news/coronavirus/schoolgirl-16-with-no-underlying-medical-conditions-becomes-frances-youngest-coronavirus-victim-after-developing-a-slight-cough/ar-BB11Obfg?li=BBqrVLO

    Everyone is getting hit


    https://heavy.com/news/2020/03/ireland-tate-coronavirus/

    smeagolheartThacoBell
  • ArdanisArdanis Member Posts: 1,729
    DragonKing wrote: »
    Can people STFU with the whole, "it's only old people who die from it," yet?

    Remember, when the Spanish flu happen, it hit the old people first and then hurt the younger people.
    Maybe. Me, I'll consider thinking about starting to worry for my own self only if the death numbers cross a million. Wouldn't be the first time I had pneumonia :neutral:

  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 7,302
    edited March 28
    DragonKing wrote: »
    Can people STFU with the whole, "it's only old people who die from it," yet?

    Remember, when the Spanish flu happen, it hit the old people first and then hurt the younger people.

    https://www.msn.com/en-ae/news/coronavirus/schoolgirl-16-with-no-underlying-medical-conditions-becomes-frances-youngest-coronavirus-victim-after-developing-a-slight-cough/ar-BB11Obfg?li=BBqrVLO

    Everyone is getting hit


    https://heavy.com/news/2020/03/ireland-tate-coronavirus/

    except Spanish flu effected the young more because older people had better immune system to it because of the 1889-90 flu pandemic.[url="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1889–1890_flu_pandemic"]1889-90 flu pandemic.[/url]1889-90 flu pandemic.

    Proont
  • BallpointManBallpointMan Member Posts: 1,034
    deltago wrote: »
    DragonKing wrote: »
    Can people STFU with the whole, "it's only old people who die from it," yet?

    Remember, when the Spanish flu happen, it hit the old people first and then hurt the younger people.

    https://www.msn.com/en-ae/news/coronavirus/schoolgirl-16-with-no-underlying-medical-conditions-becomes-frances-youngest-coronavirus-victim-after-developing-a-slight-cough/ar-BB11Obfg?li=BBqrVLO

    Everyone is getting hit


    https://heavy.com/news/2020/03/ireland-tate-coronavirus/

    except Spanish flu effected the young more because older people had better immune system to it because of the 1889-90 flu pandemic.[url="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1889–1890_flu_pandemic"]1889-90 flu pandemic.[/url]1889-90 flu pandemic.

    Well, I think it's more complicated than that. The Spanish Flu was devastating to people with a better immune system because it caused a "Cytokine Storm". I dont pretend to know a lot about medical conditions, but my basic understanding is that the immune system goes haywire, and ends up hurting the body. So the stronger your immune system, the worse it would be. This essentially means that younger people were particularly susceptible to it.

    I suspect there was a "sweet zone" for the Spanish Flu - those with super hardy immune systems suffered significantly, and those with weakened immune systems would also probably have been hurt. It's the ones inbetween that were fine.

    Grond0smeagolheartThacoBellAerakar
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,637
    I've heard this as well. The people dying from Spanish flu were the young and healthy because their own immune system response overreacted to the virus and killed them.

    This is why we need to test thoroughly any Coronavirus vaccine.

    We can't half ass it and rush out something to win an election or because a big shopping holiday is coming up or whatever. If we give a untested vaccine shot that sets off a Cytokine Storm it will kill people.

    KamigoroshiThacoBellProont
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 5,988
    Looks like Russia is reaching the point where they can't lie about their 'success' any more. I believe I called this a few pages ago...

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/03/26/europe/coronavirus-russia-kremlin-intl/index.html

    smeagolheartProontMaleficentOne
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 5,988
    Wow, another authoritarian government possibly lying about the coronavirus. Who would've thought?

    https://time.com/5811222/wuhan-coronavirus-death-toll/

    smeagolheartProontMaleficentOne
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 5,988
    Another country fucking up its' coronavirus response. I see a pattern here...

    https://www.scmp.com/news/asia/east-asia/article/3077082/coronavirus-japan-braced-wider-outbreak-no-state-emergency-now

    Governments don't seem to be saving a whole of people. They do seem to be lying a lot about saving people though...

    smeagolheartMaleficentOne
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 6,087
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Wow, another authoritarian government possibly lying about the coronavirus. Who would've thought?

    https://time.com/5811222/wuhan-coronavirus-death-toll/

    Or, just possibly, another sensationalist article blaming the Chinese as an easy way to sell a story. :p

    To put this into context Wuhan is a city of 11m people. I can't be bothered to do a proper demographic analysis, but the standard annual mortality rate in China for the population as a whole is a bit over 7 per 1,000. That means that expected mortality for a period of over 2 months in lockdown would be about 14,000, i.e. the 2,500 deaths declared from Covid-19 represents only a relatively small addition. Clearly then there will be far more funeral urns around at the end of lockdown than those affected by Covid-19.

    The local Chinese authorities certainly tried to hide what was happening in the early stages. However, while what counts as a Covid-19 death is a grey area and could account for some massaging of figures, I would be surprised if there had been an attempt to hide significant numbers of fatalities since the central government got involved. Apart from anything else there have been numerous scientific studies shared with Western scientists and keeping a false narrative going in those circumstances would be difficult.

    ProontJuliusBorisov
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,594
    China continuously falsifies its numbers of infected and fatalities caused by the virus up to this day. Nothing new about that. Part of the reason is because official numbers cannot exceed a certain daily amount. Anything above the local authorities quota gets reclassified for a different cause of death. Same with the "zero new infected" lie. The gist of things is China's simply not counting mild or relapsed COVID-19 patients anymore in their statistics. Orders from the CCP. Anyone who reports the factual correct numbers faces fines and jail time. And that goes even more so for whistleblowers posting real stories in the non-Chinese internet. To control this flow of information, the CCP even invented an smartphone app which every citizen had to download. "Official" reason was it protects from identidy theft. Which makes the truth so much more ironic...

    Balrog99ProontMaleficentOne
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 8,362
    Out DELIBERATE lack of testing in February is no different than lying about the numbers. It was purposeful negligence. There is still no way for us to get a remotely accurate read on this. You can't win a 4x400 meter relay when you start two laps behind the other teams.

    ThacoBellProontBelleSorciereJuliusBorisov
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,637
    China continuously falsifies its numbers of infected and fatalities caused by the virus up to this day. Nothing new about that. Part of the reason is because official numbers cannot exceed a certain daily amount. Anything above the local authorities quota gets reclassified for a different cause of death. Same with the "zero new infected" lie. The gist of things is China's simply not counting mild or relapsed COVID-19 patients anymore in their statistics. Orders from the CCP. Anyone who reports the factual correct numbers faces fines and jail time. And that goes even more so for whistleblowers posting real stories in the non-Chinese internet. To control this flow of information, the CCP even invented an smartphone app which every citizen had to download. "Official" reason was it protects from identidy theft. Which makes the truth so much more ironic...

    And here in America unless you have major symptoms, or are rich, you can't get tested. This is by design to keep the numbers low. Even in this rigged game then the US response has been abysmal and we've reached the most cases in the world.

    It turns out pitting 50 governors against each other (and against the federal government) for a couple of companies producing medical supplies is a disastrous way to respond to a global pandemic.
    The failure by Trump administration to provide a national response to the national disaster affecting has been a big reason why so many are getting sick.

    Our for-profit healthcare system is also one of the worst suited in the world to respond to this pandemic. People are hesitant to go to the hospital because they can't afford it. If they do go and have no insurance they get turned away. 30 million Americans have no insurance.

    Finally, there are far too many knuckle heads here who refuse to follow guidance. It's the American way, "you're not going to tell me whut to do! Muh liberty is more important than anything!". So we get people infecting others like libertarian Republican Senator Rand Paul running around after a positive diagnosis refusing to self quarantine who will kill people. And we have other fools who attend churches and go to the beaches and ignore health and safety warnings because "no one tells me what to do!" There's been at least five different times people thought they would intentionally cough on food as a 'joke'. Oh and right wing media downplaying the virus as "the flu" and "mass hysteria" along with the lying President calling it a hoax certainly has not helped.

    These criminals who ignore health and safety warnings should be prosecuted. They are putting not only their own lives at risk but other innocent people will die because "muh liberty!"

    ThacoBellProontArdanis
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 5,988
    Stop acting like being a moron is some kind of 'American' trait. It took me literally 30 seconds to find this article.

    https://www.sltrib.com/news/2020/03/22/coronavirus-rebels-france/

    I could probably find hundreds more articles about people being jackasses in literally every country on the globe. Maybe not China since they have tight controls on 'news' there...

    Adam_en_tiumLudwig_IIMaleficentOne
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 10,558
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Stop acting like being a moron is some kind of 'American' trait. It took me literally 30 seconds to find this article.

    https://www.sltrib.com/news/2020/03/22/coronavirus-rebels-france/

    I could probably find hundreds more articles about people being jackasses in literally every country on the globe. Maybe not China since they have tight controls on 'news' there...

    Rebellion is literally part of our historical identity. Our country was founded on it. Yes it happens everywhere, but we've turned it into an art form.

    Proontshabadoo
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 5,988
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Stop acting like being a moron is some kind of 'American' trait. It took me literally 30 seconds to find this article.

    https://www.sltrib.com/news/2020/03/22/coronavirus-rebels-france/

    I could probably find hundreds more articles about people being jackasses in literally every country on the globe. Maybe not China since they have tight controls on 'news' there...

    Rebellion is literally part of our historical identity. Our country was founded on it. Yes it happens everywhere, but we've turned it into an art form.

    Mexico and most of Latin America share those same feelings. In fact, anywhere where revolution overthrew oppression pretty much will have some level of those feelings. That now includes many African countries as well as Russia and China. It is 'not' a unique trait to the United States anymore...

    ProontshabadooMaleficentOne
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 10,558
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Stop acting like being a moron is some kind of 'American' trait. It took me literally 30 seconds to find this article.

    https://www.sltrib.com/news/2020/03/22/coronavirus-rebels-france/

    I could probably find hundreds more articles about people being jackasses in literally every country on the globe. Maybe not China since they have tight controls on 'news' there...

    Rebellion is literally part of our historical identity. Our country was founded on it. Yes it happens everywhere, but we've turned it into an art form.

    What America considers "rebelling" at this point is mostly just acting like an asshole. Robespierre was a rebel. Jimmy from Saginaw getting in his pick-up and going out and doing everything he normally does to "prove a point" is not. Going out to a buffet this afternoon and refusing to stay away from other people doesn't make you a rebel, it makes you an idiot, and a bit of a sociopathic one at that.

    Oh, absolutely.

  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 5,988
    edited March 28
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Stop acting like being a moron is some kind of 'American' trait. It took me literally 30 seconds to find this article.

    https://www.sltrib.com/news/2020/03/22/coronavirus-rebels-france/

    I could probably find hundreds more articles about people being jackasses in literally every country on the globe. Maybe not China since they have tight controls on 'news' there...

    Rebellion is literally part of our historical identity. Our country was founded on it. Yes it happens everywhere, but we've turned it into an art form.

    What America considers "rebelling" at this point is mostly just acting like an asshole. Robespierre was a rebel. Jimmy from Saginaw getting in his pick-up and going out and doing everything he normally does to "prove a point" is not. Going out to a buffet this afternoon and refusing to stay away from other people doesn't make you a rebel, it makes you an idiot, and a bit of a sociopathic one at that.

    I can almost believe you've been to Saginaw after reading that! ;)

    Edit: Just googled Saginaw and found this. I know I can't think of anything I'd rather do than get a tattoo during an epidemic...

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mlive.com/coronavirus/2020/03/saginaw-woman-reaches-quarterfinals-in-inked-magazine-cover-contest.html?outputType=amp

    You can't make this shit up!

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 8,362
    edited March 28
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Stop acting like being a moron is some kind of 'American' trait. It took me literally 30 seconds to find this article.

    https://www.sltrib.com/news/2020/03/22/coronavirus-rebels-france/

    I could probably find hundreds more articles about people being jackasses in literally every country on the globe. Maybe not China since they have tight controls on 'news' there...

    Rebellion is literally part of our historical identity. Our country was founded on it. Yes it happens everywhere, but we've turned it into an art form.

    What America considers "rebelling" at this point is mostly just acting like an asshole. Robespierre was a rebel. Jimmy from Saginaw getting in his pick-up and going out and doing everything he normally does to "prove a point" is not. Going out to a buffet this afternoon and refusing to stay away from other people doesn't make you a rebel, it makes you an idiot, and a bit of a sociopathic one at that.

    I can almost believe you've been to Saginaw after reading that! ;)

    I only chose it because of the Lefty Frizzell song.

    Balrog99Proont
  • BallpointManBallpointMan Member Posts: 1,034
    Grond0 wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Wow, another authoritarian government possibly lying about the coronavirus. Who would've thought?

    https://time.com/5811222/wuhan-coronavirus-death-toll/

    Or, just possibly, another sensationalist article blaming the Chinese as an easy way to sell a story. :p

    To put this into context Wuhan is a city of 11m people. I can't be bothered to do a proper demographic analysis, but the standard annual mortality rate in China for the population as a whole is a bit over 7 per 1,000. That means that expected mortality for a period of over 2 months in lockdown would be about 14,000, i.e. the 2,500 deaths declared from Covid-19 represents only a relatively small addition. Clearly then there will be far more funeral urns around at the end of lockdown than those affected by Covid-19.

    The local Chinese authorities certainly tried to hide what was happening in the early stages. However, while what counts as a Covid-19 death is a grey area and could account for some massaging of figures, I would be surprised if there had been an attempt to hide significant numbers of fatalities since the central government got involved. Apart from anything else there have been numerous scientific studies shared with Western scientists and keeping a false narrative going in those circumstances would be difficult.

    While I definitely do not doubt that some western media sources are biased and presenting false or misleading evidence to support a general narrative that makes China look bad. The US government is kind of in on this, as you've alluded to. That said - I *dont* think we should take China's word on this issue at all either. They've already once tried to silence/suppress information on this topic, and I dont see why their recent track record of... anything would lead us to believe they're being forthright and honest in any capacity regarding Covid 19.

    Unfortunately, between their lack of credibility on the subject, and the biases that we have as a society on the issue... it's extremely challenging to tell exactly what happened there.

    Grond0Balrog99ProontThacoBell
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,637
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Stop acting like being a moron is some kind of 'American' trait. It took me literally 30 seconds to find this article.

    https://www.sltrib.com/news/2020/03/22/coronavirus-rebels-france/

    I could probably find hundreds more articles about people being jackasses in literally every country on the globe. Maybe not China since they have tight controls on 'news' there...

    It's not unique to America to be sure. But there's a strong stubborn streak here. Of all the traits of being American, it's a big one.

    ProontThacoBell
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