I still think there is room for one more story with our Bhaalspawn player character, even with the epilogues and ending choices of ToB. Personally I would enjoy one last full game with our Bhaalspawn and companion characters.
Though if BG3 has to have a new protagonist but set in the same world then the last thing I want is it be either Jaheira or Viconia's baby etc. I'd rather any new protagonist be entirely separate from the Bhaalspawn character.
I'd love to see returning characters and maybe even story points that reflect what happened in the previous games, but I don't want to see a story revolving around you being the child or relation to the previous games protagonist.
I think Skeletor from He-Man comes into the plot. He turns you mortal once again, or threatens to shoot your puppy if you don't do what he says! And the game remembers the things you did in the previous installment!
But also.. There is a war breaking loose between vampires and werewolves, but then Drows come in and kills both them and say: "Oh hell nah! Dis ain't twi-light, mhm! We got clericz!" And the Paladins just stare at them for a while, but then they realize the clerics are drows and they go: "Oyh! You be drow! >:O" And the Drow goes: "Oh, and here we go..." "Dey tuk our jerb!" "Err durka durrrr!" and then they clash against each other, but little do they know, that Sauron, from Lord of the Rings is upset, and he enters the fray now! So now, the unicorn bros, the drows, the paladins must make a stand together, but not before the Paladins have to go on a quest to find all the fallens Paladins and tell them it's alright. They're forgiven if they're willing to stand with REAL paladins. But then the fallens paladins think the REAL paladins are snobs for calling themselves REAL Paladins... And I'm sure there was a Bhaal-spawn in here somewhere, but oh well.. It'll be fun for sure!
Anything other than an Infinity Engine (or a newer, more polished iteration)-driven, Forgotten Realms setting with AD&D rules is less than an already well defined standard. Maybe I could settle for 3d edition D&D. But that's as far as I'm willing to go.
A plot loosely tied to the original is a tried, almost cliche way to bring the nostalgia element into play but it is also the safest and one that leaves the original stuff essentially untouched.
I don't know, so many years and so many playthroughs later I'm still at a loss about this.
"Whatever happens, all I want is to discover minor references to all the NPCs that ever lived. For example, Nalia's final resting place amongst her family and the Council of the Six, reading of Keldorn's ascension during his final battle, hearing of a reformed drow protecting the great elven city of Suldanessellar, finding the red robes of a once forgotten (and notoriously bitter) female mage called Edwina, the wide spread songs of the great Eldoth and Skie (no doubt spread by Eldoth himself), discovering a long established tribe of Amazonian women who refer one by the name of Shar-Teel, encountering a mad old (yet well preserved) wizard musing to his dead bird (and dear friend) Monty, visiting a travelling circus named in honour of one humble gnome named Quayle etc etc "
They'd all be subtle references, like Nalia's for example, you'd only find it by clicking on tombstones or crypts in a graveyard, or Keldorn's ascension could only be found in a unique tome in a particular Temple of Helm, a bard in a tavern could sing a song when requested about Eldoth and Skie, you encounter a tribe of Amazonian women and when charming one she reveals their history and refers to Shar-Teel etc
There's a few factors that Philip Daigle said would affect BG3, if there is one.
First, Philip has advised that WotC will likely insist that for BG3 the setting be in sync with their related products on the shelves at the time of release. BG2:EE is scheduled for a target release sometime next year. Then for BG3 they will be building a new game from the ground up. (It will not use the Infinity engine.) That takes time. So we're talking about at least a couple of years from now.
Second, the current 4th edition FRCS is set over a century after ToB took place. I'm not sure if BG3 will have to follow canon for the BG series. But per canon Gorion's ward chose mortality.
A third factor is that "Ed Greenwood Presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms" will be released in just a month. This is the Realms according to its creator, and presumably will be the authoritative FRCS. The Amazon description states "The book is aimed at all Forgotten Realms enthusiasts, including players of every edition of the DUNGEONS & DRAGONS game." So it will be interesting to see how Ed handles what was done to the Realms in 4th edition. Ed has always said that he wants the Realms to be customizable by DMs. So perhaps his FRCS doesn't box gamers in to any particular era/time. There seems to be a move afoot in Edition Next to simply provide a framework for players to design their own rules, versus telling them what the rules are. So perhaps this will be mirrored in Ed's FRCS.
Anyway, I would be happy with either of the following:
1) A descendant of Gorion's ward is drawn into a tale that flows from the legacy of Bhaal's plot to resurrect himself. Bhaal's essence is stored safely in the plane of Mount Celestia. Or perhaps not as safely stored as was believed.
2) A prequel set in the Time of troubles (14 years prior to BG1) whereby we learn more of Gorion/the Harpers and other power groups as Bhaal plotted his resurrection by "sowing his mortal progeny."
If it is (1) then I do think that the story should at least begin in the city of Baldur's Gate. And to some extent have some follow-up on what happened to NPCs (and perhaps feature a few of their descendants).
There's a few factors that Philip Daigle said would affect BG3, if there is one.
First, Philip has advised that WotC will likely insist that for BG3 the setting be in sync with their related products on the shelves at the time of release. BG2:EE is scheduled for a target release sometime next year. Then for BG3 they will be building a new game from the ground up. (It will not use the Infinity engine.) That takes time. So we're talking about at least a couple of years from now.
Second, the current 4th edition FRCS is set over a century after ToB took place. I'm not sure if BG3 will have to follow canon for the BG series. But per canon Gorion's ward chose mortality.
A third factor is that "Ed Greenwood Presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms" will be released in just a month. This is the Realms according to its creator, and presumably will be the authoritative FRCS. The Amazon description states "The book is aimed at all Forgotten Realms enthusiasts, including players of every edition of the DUNGEONS & DRAGONS game." So it will be interesting to see how Ed handles what was done to the Realms in 4th edition. Ed has always said that he wants the Realms to be customizable by DMs. So perhaps his FRCS doesn't box gamers in to any particular era/time. There seems to be a move afoot in Edition Next to simply provide a framework for players to design their own rules, versus telling them what the rules are. So perhaps this will be mirrored in Ed's FRCS.
Anyway, I would be happy with either of the following:
1) A descendant of Gorion's ward is drawn into a tale that flows from the legacy of Bhaal's plot to resurrect himself. Bhaal's essence is stored safely in the plane of Mount Celestia. Or perhaps not as safely stored as was believed.
2) A prequel set in the Time of troubles (14 years prior to BG1) whereby we learn more of Gorion/the Harpers and other power groups as Bhaal plotted his resurrection by "sowing his mortal progeny."
If it is (1) then I do think that the story should at least begin in the city of Baldur's Gate. And to some extent have some follow-up on what happened to NPCs (and perhaps feature a few of their descendants).
What the hell?!?! I went through all that trouble with her just to have her killed at the end?! She was my favorite romance! No, it must be retconned somehow!
The only way I see BG3 happening with WotC revolves around 2 things in particular
1. BG3 is released no sooner than 2014, thus it should fall squarely into D&D Next (Aka 5e)
2. It relies on the rumor that in 5e, all the long lost forgotten realms dieties will be returning again. I remember reading about this possibility on a thread here on the forums I believe. If this is true, then hey Bhaal is back. And since our good buddy bhaal is the god of murder, maybe he'll go on a murder spree in Candlekeep since his scion from their didn't return him to godhood like he was supposed to.
That said the continuation I'd like to see if they used psuedo related characters would be your new character growing up as the Ward of Imoen in Waterdeep. Let's see what 5e brings to the Realms first though.
Does anyone remember NWN2 - Storm of Zehir? While it was crappy there was one feature I did like: the overland map, and setting up a business
The feature I liked best about SOZ was being able to create your own four member party from scratch. If its going to be called Baldur's Gate 3 then the setting is obvious. Another feature I would want to see is the inclusion of a toolset and the ability to create PWs etc that NWN1 and NWN2 had.
The idea of a Bhaal grandchild would be the best. But, as it was said before, the ToB ending can change if you took a PNJ or another to end the saga. However, there is a possible way. At the creation of your character, the alignment that you choose will affect your story (and eventually, you may choose if the Bhaalspawn was your father or your mother). Then, according to BG2 and ToB, if the Bhaalspawn was your father, your mother would be Aerie If you choose a loyal character, Jaheira for a neutral and Viconia for an evil one. If you choose that the Bhaalspawn was your mother, then no choice, your father would be Anomen. But if you choose a loyal character, in your story, Anomen would have turn a Knight. If you prefer an evil one, your father would have automatically kill Saerk. If you choose to be neutral, it may be something such as he tried to find the explaination and finally, he didn't kill Saerk.
In my opinion, the only way the game should be named Baldur's Gate 3 is if it is the same characters and party from the previous games. Since it would be boring to start at level 35 and the fact that TOB finished out the story compleatly it would be next to impossible.
I would say the only way to make a Baldrur's Gate 3 would be to remake TOB and add 150 hours of aditional content to the expansion in order to make it Baldur's Gate 3 without changing the ending of TOB or destroying what the original team did. They would have to force the original XP cap for Baldur's Gate 2 and then rebalance the XP rewards for enemies in TOB and the added content to keep the player constantly gaining levels all the way up to 40 or possibly even 50.
Basically, instead of TOB being an expansion pack they would turn it into an official BG 3. This would allow the same main character and the party from BG2 to import directly into the game without altering the ending of TOB. They would need to expand the TOB map to include a ton of areas that must be compleated before reaching the TOB area's. You would leave the elves and get attacked just like the start of TOB but before you go to the city that is being ambushed you could do a whole ton of adventuring.
Sure, we would all know how it ends before we started playing but TOB could simply be one path of three possible endings. They could add all the TOB content without changing it but make two new endings that are each the same size as TOB with all new content. The three 25 hour ending paths would branch off of the Baldur's Gate 3 main map. Kind of like a choose your own adventure book. I would buy that in an instant. Especially if they built a new engine and did a true remake of TOB content while making a whole new game that melds perfectly with the old content. Of course I would be willing to deal with the same old Infinity engine and 2nd edition rules if they could not get the "go ahead" to remake TOB in a new engine.
Well, thats the best idea I can come up with. They would need to release BG2EE by itself without TOB and then release TOB content with BG3 if they were to do this though. Just me dreaming through. I know it is not going to happen.
The only other idea I can think of is continue the story as Imoen after the player character from the original BG series turns into a god. Of course this new adventure would stand no chance of being as epic as the original BG story so I don't know if it would be a good idea or not.
I am sure about one thing, the protagonist should be the same. No children, disciples or followers. That would totally ruin the game. I hope I am not the only one thinking that a story about the child of the child of Bhaal would be gross...
I can imagine several possible solutions for BG3, some of them were already mentioned, so I will add other ideas.
1) The cheap way At the end of ToB the main character is finally free to live his own life (either as a mortal or as a god). Although he ranks among the most powerful mortals (if he stayed mortal) in Faerun, there are still some beings, which are even more powerful than him. So he could get into some conflict with one of such being (or with another god if he choosed to be a god) and be defeated at the beginning of BG3. He would barely survived, possibly be capured (I said it is a cheap way :-) ) and one of the consequences of his defeat would be that he would loose much of his former power thus starting at lower level (could be irreversibely level drained or something?). The bg3 story starts ...
2) The KotOR1 to KotOR2 way Start with a new character, but keep the story connected to some degree to the original character (as in KotOR1 - Revan, KotOR2 - Exile).
3) Completely rework/expand ToB so it becomes BG3.
4) Tell the story from the perspective of different Bhaalspawn than Gorion's Ward, e.g. Balthasar (and of course allowing this Balthasar to be something else than human-monk (and giving him different stronghold than Amkethram in that case)). And at the end fight Mellisan together with Gorion's Ward.
Lol DragonLance sure won't happen can't connect in anyway to Baldur's Gate... And personally would sure not want that, that world revovelve way too much only around the Majere brothers and theyr companions... boring... Spelljammer is discontinued won't happen eighter
I don't want to be a party pooper, but there's two ways of talking about the possible BG sequal: rational deduction (ie it propably won't be about Tiax's and Imoen's lovechild because of X and Y) or fan fiction. It would also be for the best to keep these two approaches separate from each other.
Everything @Jaxsbudgie said in his original post is what I believe. As many avid attendants here on the forum may also know, however, that in tandem with thinking these things, I see no reason for 'Baldur's Gate 3' to be called 'Baldur's Gate 3'. I feel Overhaul should create a whole new Infinity Engine series, rather than leeching of a namesake that it might never be able to live up to.
D&D Next (5e) will be all about Forgotten Realms, which i dig (Plus checking out the current play-test i think its coming to be a great system)
No, bg3 doesnt have ot be called "baldurs gate 3" I would love a "Waterdeep" or a "Dale lands" game SO much of the realms has yet to be explored in these type of games, why stick to just The sword coast and icewind dale?
Well, if we're talking about something entirely new, I'd love to see something set in the Shining South.
Halruaa Var the Golden Durpar The Shaar The Great Rift Dambrath Lurien Lapiliiya Ormpur
These are all wonderful subsettings, and for my taste many of them are some of the most imaginative in the Forgotten Realms. (Lurien and the Great Rift perhaps not as inventive, but still very rich.)
Comments
Though if BG3 has to have a new protagonist but set in the same world then the last thing I want is it be either Jaheira or Viconia's baby etc. I'd rather any new protagonist be entirely separate from the Bhaalspawn character.
I'd love to see returning characters and maybe even story points that reflect what happened in the previous games, but I don't want to see a story revolving around you being the child or relation to the previous games protagonist.
But also.. There is a war breaking loose between vampires and werewolves, but then Drows come in and kills both them and say: "Oh hell nah! Dis ain't twi-light, mhm! We got clericz!" And the Paladins just stare at them for a while, but then they realize the clerics are drows and they go: "Oyh! You be drow! >:O" And the Drow goes: "Oh, and here we go..." "Dey tuk our jerb!" "Err durka durrrr!" and then they clash against each other, but little do they know, that Sauron, from Lord of the Rings is upset, and he enters the fray now! So now, the unicorn bros, the drows, the paladins must make a stand together, but not before the Paladins have to go on a quest to find all the fallens Paladins and tell them it's alright. They're forgiven if they're willing to stand with REAL paladins. But then the fallens paladins think the REAL paladins are snobs for calling themselves REAL Paladins... And I'm sure there was a Bhaal-spawn in here somewhere, but oh well.. It'll be fun for sure!
... Though Jaheira is still mad at you..
A plot loosely tied to the original is a tried, almost cliche way to bring the nostalgia element into play but it is also the safest and one that leaves the original stuff essentially untouched.
I don't know, so many years and so many playthroughs later I'm still at a loss about this.
"Whatever happens, all I want is to discover minor references to all the NPCs that ever lived. For example, Nalia's final resting place amongst her family and the Council of the Six, reading of Keldorn's ascension during his final battle, hearing of a reformed drow protecting the great elven city of Suldanessellar, finding the red robes of a once forgotten (and notoriously bitter) female mage called Edwina, the wide spread songs of the great Eldoth and Skie (no doubt spread by Eldoth himself), discovering a long established tribe of Amazonian women who refer one by the name of Shar-Teel, encountering a mad old (yet well preserved) wizard musing to his dead bird (and dear friend) Monty, visiting a travelling circus named in honour of one humble gnome named Quayle etc etc "
They'd all be subtle references, like Nalia's for example, you'd only find it by clicking on tombstones or crypts in a graveyard, or Keldorn's ascension could only be found in a unique tome in a particular Temple of Helm, a bard in a tavern could sing a song when requested about Eldoth and Skie, you encounter a tribe of Amazonian women and when charming one she reveals their history and refers to Shar-Teel etc
Repost?
Ps all stats should be set to 25
1. BG3 is released no sooner than 2014, thus it should fall squarely into D&D Next (Aka 5e)
2. It relies on the rumor that in 5e, all the long lost forgotten realms dieties will be returning again. I remember reading about this possibility on a thread here on the forums I believe. If this is true, then hey Bhaal is back. And since our good buddy bhaal is the god of murder, maybe he'll go on a murder spree in Candlekeep since his scion from their didn't return him to godhood like he was supposed to.
That said the continuation I'd like to see if they used psuedo related characters would be your new character growing up as the Ward of Imoen in Waterdeep. Let's see what 5e brings to the Realms first though.
Ps all stats should be set to 25
If its going to be called Baldur's Gate 3 then the setting is obvious. Another feature I would want to see is the inclusion of a toolset and the ability to create PWs etc that NWN1 and NWN2 had.
Then, according to BG2 and ToB, if the Bhaalspawn was your father, your mother would be Aerie If you choose a loyal character, Jaheira for a neutral and Viconia for an evil one. If you choose that the Bhaalspawn was your mother, then no choice, your father would be Anomen. But if you choose a loyal character, in your story, Anomen would have turn a Knight. If you prefer an evil one, your father would have automatically kill Saerk. If you choose to be neutral, it may be something such as he tried to find the explaination and finally, he didn't kill Saerk.
I would say the only way to make a Baldrur's Gate 3 would be to remake TOB and add 150 hours of aditional content to the expansion in order to make it Baldur's Gate 3 without changing the ending of TOB or destroying what the original team did. They would have to force the original XP cap for Baldur's Gate 2 and then rebalance the XP rewards for enemies in TOB and the added content to keep the player constantly gaining levels all the way up to 40 or possibly even 50.
Basically, instead of TOB being an expansion pack they would turn it into an official BG 3. This would allow the same main character and the party from BG2 to import directly into the game without altering the ending of TOB. They would need to expand the TOB map to include a ton of areas that must be compleated before reaching the TOB area's. You would leave the elves and get attacked just like the start of TOB but before you go to the city that is being ambushed you could do a whole ton of adventuring.
Sure, we would all know how it ends before we started playing but TOB could simply be one path of three possible endings. They could add all the TOB content without changing it but make two new endings that are each the same size as TOB with all new content. The three 25 hour ending paths would branch off of the Baldur's Gate 3 main map. Kind of like a choose your own adventure book. I would buy that in an instant. Especially if they built a new engine and did a true remake of TOB content while making a whole new game that melds perfectly with the old content. Of course I would be willing to deal with the same old Infinity engine and 2nd edition rules if they could not get the "go ahead" to remake TOB in a new engine.
Well, thats the best idea I can come up with. They would need to release BG2EE by itself without TOB and then release TOB content with BG3 if they were to do this though. Just me dreaming through. I know it is not going to happen.
The only other idea I can think of is continue the story as Imoen after the player character from the original BG series turns into a god. Of course this new adventure would stand no chance of being as epic as the original BG story so I don't know if it would be a good idea or not.
@colonel_burger, @the_sextein, @benighted_starlight it better be as you say or something like that. No new party. If the characters will be new, so must the game name be.
1) The cheap way
At the end of ToB the main character is finally free to live his own life (either as a mortal or as a god). Although he ranks among the most powerful mortals (if he stayed mortal) in Faerun, there are still some beings, which are even more powerful than him. So he could get into some conflict with one of such being (or with another god if he choosed to be a god) and be defeated at the beginning of BG3. He would barely survived, possibly be capured (I said it is a cheap way :-) ) and one of the consequences of his defeat would be that he would loose much of his former power thus starting at lower level (could be irreversibely level drained or something?). The bg3 story starts ...
2) The KotOR1 to KotOR2 way
Start with a new character, but keep the story connected to some degree to the original character (as in KotOR1 - Revan, KotOR2 - Exile).
3) Completely rework/expand ToB so it becomes BG3.
4) Tell the story from the perspective of different Bhaalspawn than Gorion's Ward, e.g. Balthasar (and of course allowing this Balthasar to be something else than human-monk (and giving him different stronghold than Amkethram in that case)). And at the end fight Mellisan together with Gorion's Ward.
I, personally, would love to meet the serious, down-to-earth, mentally stable son of Minsc...
Also BG2: ToB was the end of the story. If anything let's focus somewhere else in Faerun for awhile.
Spelljammer is discontinued won't happen eighter
As many avid attendants here on the forum may also know, however, that in tandem with thinking these things, I see no reason for 'Baldur's Gate 3' to be called 'Baldur's Gate 3'. I feel Overhaul should create a whole new Infinity Engine series, rather than leeching of a namesake that it might never be able to live up to.
No, bg3 doesnt have ot be called "baldurs gate 3" I would love a "Waterdeep" or a "Dale lands" game SO much of the realms has yet to be explored in these type of games, why stick to just The sword coast and icewind dale?
Halruaa
Var the Golden
Durpar
The Shaar
The Great Rift
Dambrath
Lurien
Lapiliiya
Ormpur
These are all wonderful subsettings, and for my taste many of them are some of the most imaginative in the Forgotten Realms. (Lurien and the Great Rift perhaps not as inventive, but still very rich.)