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  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455

    State Rep. Dan Johnson of Kentucky, who was under investigation for molesting a teenage girl, has apparently shot and killed himself on a bridge. Which is definitely not the way to prove your innocence (and probably not all that uncommon an outcome for people who know they are guilty of such a heinous act). His suicide note (posted on Facebook) certainly captures a deranged and guilty mind in it's final throes:


    Killing yourself seems an odd response to "fake news". The real tragedy here is that I'm already seeing people saying it is the GIRL'S fault for coming forward.
    I think it sets a fine precedent. Roy Moore, you know what to do.

    Also, a suicide note on Facebook? Come on.

    @Stormvessel You seem to harbour an unhealthy amount of hate for the middle classes. Chill.
  • joluvjoluv Member Posts: 2,137
    edited December 2017
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  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    edited December 2017
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  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,044
    edited December 2017

    I'd like the rich to pay a bit more in taxes, not end up in a gulag.

    On the one hand, why? You don't think government programs will go bankrupt if they don't receive tax revenue, do you? Taxation at the Federal level hasn't worked like that in a long time.

    On the second hand, how much more? To date, no one has ever answered the question "exactly how much should 'the rich' pay in taxes?" with a concrete number in the form of a flat amount or a percentage. I have my suspicions as to why no one has ever answered that question but I am curious to hear your response.

    On the third hand, it is true that someone making a lot of money in the United States can afford to chip in a little more than the rest of us--think of it as a small price to pay for the ability to live a life of luxury which would make even Louis XIV, the Sun King himself, jealous for the lavish comforts 21st Century wealth can provide. The 1% still worry about taxes--"I made $1 million last year but I could deduct and/or shelter only $400,000 so I had to pay 35% on the rest"--while the 1% of the 1% make so much money that taxes are not a consideration for them at all.

    *************

    Meanwhile, over in Congess, Rep. Marcy Kaptur (D - OH), engaged in a little victim-blaming and shaming, leaving her fellow Members of Congress speechless. In her defense, she did subsequently try to walk back her initial comments...but still, that sounded like how people thought back in the 1970s.
    (CNN)At a closed-door meeting of House Democrats to discuss reforming how Congress handles sexual harassment allegations, one senior congresswoman stunned lawmakers when she suggested female lawmakers were inviting unwanted advances because of the way they dressed.

    Ohio Democratic Rep. Marcy Kaptur stood up and told her colleagues Wednesday that "too many members dress inappropriately" and it's "an invitation" to be harassed, according to three Democratic sources familiar with the discussion.

    Kaptur said female staffers and reporters were also guilty of wearing outfits that she believed were too revealing.

    Those in the room were "totally in shock" and their "mouths were agape" at the statement from Kaptur, according to these sources. Politico first reported Kaptur's comments Wednesday.

    Kaptur told CNN in a written statement that she was not suggesting that victims were responsible.
    "When I was first elected to Congress my office and I became a refuge for female staffers who had been mistreated by their bosses. Some of them in tears many days. It is something I carry with me to this day and something I brought up during our Caucus meeting. Under no circumstances is it the victim's fault if they are harassed in any way. I shared the stories from my time here in the context of the 'Me Too' legislation and how we can elevate the decorum and the dress code to protect women from what is a pervasive problem here and in society at large."
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    The fact is there are women who do not understand what is or is not appropriate for the office. Is this an excuse for harassment? Of course not. Should these women be more aware of proper dress? Certainly.
  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 7,811

    The fact is there are women who do not understand what is or is not appropriate for the office. Is this an excuse for harassment? Of course not. Should these women be more aware of proper dress? Certainly.

    I'm sorry, I didn't realize the way a person dressed effected the work that they do.

    The only time it might is if you directly deal with clients/customers or maybe seen by them, or is a safety hazard during your job.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    deltago said:

    The fact is there are women who do not understand what is or is not appropriate for the office. Is this an excuse for harassment? Of course not. Should these women be more aware of proper dress? Certainly.

    I'm sorry, I didn't realize the way a person dressed effected the work that they do.

    The only time it might is if you directly deal with clients/customers or maybe seen by them, or is a safety hazard during your job.
    I'm sorry, I didn't realize someone said it affects the work they do. I certainly didn't.
  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 7,811
    Then what is 'proper dress?'
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    @deltago Try google:

    https://www.moneycrashers.com/what-wear-work-tips-office-dress-code/

    [Casual] For Women:

    Nicely fitted tops and blouses, although shirts should never be tight or revealing.
    Slacks or skirts in more casual fabrics, such as cotton. If denim is permitted, dark-wash only. Avoid overly casual denim cuts, like cutoffs or flare jeans.
    Skirts should remain at knee-length.
    Open-toed shoes are permitted. Avoid casual shoes such as sneakers or flip-flops.
    Casual accessories, such as scarves. Larger rings, bracelets, earrings, and necklaces are fine, and may be of any quality.
    More leeway with hair length, style, and color. More adventurous styles and colors are typically fine.
    Nails can be painted in brighter colors, or with any type of pattern. Avoid novelty characters or designs, or limit “louder” designs to one nail only.
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,371

    @deltago Try google:

    https://www.moneycrashers.com/what-wear-work-tips-office-dress-code/

    [Casual] For Women:

    Nicely fitted tops and blouses, although shirts should never be tight or revealing.
    Slacks or skirts in more casual fabrics, such as cotton. If denim is permitted, dark-wash only. Avoid overly casual denim cuts, like cutoffs or flare jeans.
    Skirts should remain at knee-length.
    Open-toed shoes are permitted. Avoid casual shoes such as sneakers or flip-flops.
    Casual accessories, such as scarves. Larger rings, bracelets, earrings, and necklaces are fine, and may be of any quality.
    More leeway with hair length, style, and color. More adventurous styles and colors are typically fine.
    Nails can be painted in brighter colors, or with any type of pattern. Avoid novelty characters or designs, or limit “louder” designs to one nail only.
    In other words, avoid dressing like Daisy Duke...
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    Balrog99 said:

    @deltago Try google:

    https://www.moneycrashers.com/what-wear-work-tips-office-dress-code/

    [Casual] For Women:

    Nicely fitted tops and blouses, although shirts should never be tight or revealing.
    Slacks or skirts in more casual fabrics, such as cotton. If denim is permitted, dark-wash only. Avoid overly casual denim cuts, like cutoffs or flare jeans.
    Skirts should remain at knee-length.
    Open-toed shoes are permitted. Avoid casual shoes such as sneakers or flip-flops.
    Casual accessories, such as scarves. Larger rings, bracelets, earrings, and necklaces are fine, and may be of any quality.
    More leeway with hair length, style, and color. More adventurous styles and colors are typically fine.
    Nails can be painted in brighter colors, or with any type of pattern. Avoid novelty characters or designs, or limit “louder” designs to one nail only.
    In other words, avoid dressing like Daisy Duke...
    Yes, that's a reasonable starting point :D
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2017

    I'd like the rich to pay a bit more in taxes, not end up in a gulag.

    On the one hand, why? You don't think government programs will go bankrupt if they don't receive tax revenue, do you? Taxation at the Federal level hasn't worked like that in a long time.

    On the second hand, how much more? To date, no one has ever answered the question "exactly how much should 'the rich' pay in taxes?" with a concrete number in the form of a flat amount or a percentage. I have my suspicions as to why no one has ever answered that question but I am curious to hear your response.

    On the third hand, it is true that someone making a lot of money in the United States can afford to chip in a little more than the rest of us--think of it as a small price to pay for the ability to live a life of luxury which would make even Louis XIV, the Sun King himself, jealous for the lavish comforts 21st Century wealth can provide. The 1% still worry about taxes--"I made $1 million last year but I could deduct and/or shelter only $400,000 so I had to pay 35% on the rest"--while the 1% of the 1% make so much money that taxes are not a consideration for them at all.

    *************

    Meanwhile, over in Congess, Rep. Marcy Kaptur (D - OH), engaged in a little victim-blaming and shaming, leaving her fellow Members of Congress speechless. In her defense, she did subsequently try to walk back her initial comments...but still, that sounded like how people thought back in the 1970s.
    (CNN)At a closed-door meeting of House Democrats to discuss reforming how Congress handles sexual harassment allegations, one senior congresswoman stunned lawmakers when she suggested female lawmakers were inviting unwanted advances because of the way they dressed.

    Ohio Democratic Rep. Marcy Kaptur stood up and told her colleagues Wednesday that "too many members dress inappropriately" and it's "an invitation" to be harassed, according to three Democratic sources familiar with the discussion.

    Kaptur said female staffers and reporters were also guilty of wearing outfits that she believed were too revealing.

    Those in the room were "totally in shock" and their "mouths were agape" at the statement from Kaptur, according to these sources. Politico first reported Kaptur's comments Wednesday.

    Kaptur told CNN in a written statement that she was not suggesting that victims were responsible.
    "When I was first elected to Congress my office and I became a refuge for female staffers who had been mistreated by their bosses. Some of them in tears many days. It is something I carry with me to this day and something I brought up during our Caucus meeting. Under no circumstances is it the victim's fault if they are harassed in any way. I shared the stories from my time here in the context of the 'Me Too' legislation and how we can elevate the decorum and the dress code to protect women from what is a pervasive problem here and in society at large."
    I meant more in regards to what they will pay after the tax cut. The top marginal rate before the Bush cuts and after they expired was 39.6%. I'm fine with that.
  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 7,811

    @deltago Try google:

    https://www.moneycrashers.com/what-wear-work-tips-office-dress-code/

    [Casual] For Women:

    Nicely fitted tops and blouses, although shirts should never be tight or revealing.
    Slacks or skirts in more casual fabrics, such as cotton. If denim is permitted, dark-wash only. Avoid overly casual denim cuts, like cutoffs or flare jeans.
    Skirts should remain at knee-length.
    Open-toed shoes are permitted. Avoid casual shoes such as sneakers or flip-flops.
    Casual accessories, such as scarves. Larger rings, bracelets, earrings, and necklaces are fine, and may be of any quality.
    More leeway with hair length, style, and color. More adventurous styles and colors are typically fine.
    Nails can be painted in brighter colors, or with any type of pattern. Avoid novelty characters or designs, or limit “louder” designs to one nail only.
    And these rules are according to who... besides google, and what gives them the right to dictate these standards?

    I am a firm believer in no one has a right to tell women (or men for that matter), what to wear and not to wear. That goes from the spectrum of Burka's to Daisy Duke shorts.

    Now each company may have a standard dress code to reflect brand, but once again, if its not in the public eye, why does it matter?
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,964
    The latest deal worked out, in the panic after Moore lost, has the corporate tax rate go to 21% and top tax rate drop to 37%. Donors were howling at that increase from 20 to 21% oh boy. As far as anyone knows they are leaving all the loopholes (maybe even adding a few more) that let corporations pay about 18% on average less than the top corporate tax rate. So basically after this tax bill a lot more companies will pay nothing in tax. This will effectively shift the tax burden to the middle class because the rich are also getting huge personal tax considerations along with the corporate tax cuts such as the elimination of the alternative minimum tax and the estate tax.

    This is part of the reason that some people are calling this the biggest tax hike in American history - overall it will add close to $2 trillion to the deficit but to get there it gives like an 8 trillion dollar cut to the rich and a 6 trillion dollar tax hike to the middle class.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    deltago said:

    @deltago Try google:

    https://www.moneycrashers.com/what-wear-work-tips-office-dress-code/

    [Casual] For Women:

    Nicely fitted tops and blouses, although shirts should never be tight or revealing.
    Slacks or skirts in more casual fabrics, such as cotton. If denim is permitted, dark-wash only. Avoid overly casual denim cuts, like cutoffs or flare jeans.
    Skirts should remain at knee-length.
    Open-toed shoes are permitted. Avoid casual shoes such as sneakers or flip-flops.
    Casual accessories, such as scarves. Larger rings, bracelets, earrings, and necklaces are fine, and may be of any quality.
    More leeway with hair length, style, and color. More adventurous styles and colors are typically fine.
    Nails can be painted in brighter colors, or with any type of pattern. Avoid novelty characters or designs, or limit “louder” designs to one nail only.
    And these rules are according to who... besides google, and what gives them the right to dictate these standards?

    I am a firm believer in no one has a right to tell women (or men for that matter), what to wear and not to wear. That goes from the spectrum of Burka's to Daisy Duke shorts.

    Now each company may have a standard dress code to reflect brand, but once again, if its not in the public eye, why does it matter?
    That's fine. I'm glad I don't share an office with you :)
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,371
    @deltago

    While it would be nice to see the women who LOOK like Daisy Duke to wear the Daisy Duke shorts, I'd rather not see the great majority of my female co-workers wearing them. Ditto for the beer bellied, middle-aged men wearing Speedos to work!
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2017
    Net Neutrality will be dead in a few hours. Mark my words, within 5 years, every person in this thread will begin to be extorted by telcom companies. It will start with companies like Netflix and Amazon, and then the shakedown will reach us. And anyone who believes companies like Comcast when they say nothing will change are out of their mind. They are about to become the Gambino Family of the internet. Brought to you 100% as a result of Republican governance.
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,964
    They want to hand over the rules making to Verizon and Comcast. What could go wrong? Surely Comcast has your best interests in mind.
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,371

    They want to hand over the rules making to Verizon and Comcast. What could go wrong? Surely Comcast has your best interests in mind.

    Don't call me Shirley!

    Sorry, couldn't resist... ;)
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,044
    edited December 2017


    On the second hand, how much more? To date, no one has ever answered the question "exactly how much should 'the rich' pay in taxes?" with a concrete number in the form of a flat amount or a percentage. I have my suspicions as to why no one has ever answered that question but I am curious to hear your response.

    I meant more in regards to what they will pay after the tax cut. The top marginal rate before the Bush cuts and after they expired was 39.6%. I'm fine with that.
    If I were making $500,000 I could probably deduct and/or shelter $200,000, so paying 39.6% on $300,000 is a tax bill of $118,000 (minus the amount I had already paid when I receive my monthly pay stubs). I could still live quite nicely on $381,200 and my CPA would thank me when I settle the bill. If I were making $50,000,000 I wouldn't worry about the taxes at all--I would just have my CPA show me the completed documents and e-sign them via the computer I have in my winter vacation house in Nice.

    Of course, I view things differently than many people do. If I am taking home over $350,000 after all my taxes are paid then I am clearly winning financially even if my tax rate goes *up*. I wouldn't waste time like my grandmother did worrying about the money I don't have any more, especially when the amount I have is considerably large. As things stand, I have to adjust my withholdings next year because we had to add two dependents onto our medical insurance--the U. S. Navy made a mistake and now the biological father doesn't have medical coverage for the kids. The extra pre-tax deduction means I need to increase the amount I have withheld so that my 2018 tax return isn't short, sticking me with a tax bill of several hundred dollars.

    *************

    The FCC is in session right now, most likely just going through the motions of having a hearing before they roll back the Net Neutrality regulations. All things considered, the Internet was not a place where corporations used and abused most users before neutrality and it won't be a place where most people are used and abused once the regulations are canceled. Yes, there were isolated incidents of shady practices but those still happen now so it isn't like NN solved all the problems. A future administration with a different FCC Director will just wind up putting the regulations back in place, anyway, so my advice to those who are actually worried about this minor change is "patience".

    edit/update: clearly I disagree with @jjstraka34 here. I don't think things will be as bad as that. I spend most of my time online checking the current Standard and Modern metagame data for MtG, chuckling at "road rage" and "public freakout" video clips, news/current events (obviously), and songs I like. I was fine before the Internet so if it went away completely I wouldn't miss it too terribly.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    So Governor Jay Inslee of Washington state basically said that Washington will continue to enforce net neutrality.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    It's going to be a disaster, and it's going to hit everyone's pockets. It also allows telcom companies to restrict access to news and opinions that are in opposition to them. The last battlefield is now on it's way to being surrendered. And it's going to hit the right-wing as well. The only difference is they are walking lock-step right into it and causing it.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108

    The fact is there are women who do not understand what is or is not appropriate for the office. Is this an excuse for harassment? Of course not. Should these women be more aware of proper dress? Certainly.

    Odds are that nothing of the sort is going on and that Marcy Kaptur is simply blaming women for being targets of sexual harassment.

    Further, what a woman wears should not count as provocation for sexual harassment, sexual assault, or rape.

    There's simply no justification for it, whatever one might think "appropriate for the office" means.
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,964
    edited December 2017

    So Governor Jay Inslee of Washington state basically said that Washington will continue to enforce net neutrality.

    Corrupt Ajit Pai, along with telecomm lobbyists behind this attack on Americans, have already considered that. They saw that after withdrawing from climate agreements at the federal level, states said they would enforce it anyway. To prevent that Ajit Pai put in a provision that prevents states and cities from putting in their own net neutrality provisions. States will not be able regulate ISPs at all.

    So what can states or cities do? They can offer Internet service and have their internet service be neutral but they will be unable to affect rules on ISPs that service their area. Awful Republicans....
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    That doesn't seem constitutional. Congress can only regulate interstate commerce; intrastate commerce is governed by the states. An internet service provider would have to abide by Washington laws when providing services to Washington residents.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108

    So Governor Jay Inslee of Washington state basically said that Washington will continue to enforce net neutrality.

    Corrupt Ajit Pai, along with telecomm lobbyists behind this attack on Americans, have already considered that. They saw that after withdrawing from climate agreements at the federal level, states said they would enforce it anyway. To prevent that Ajit Pai put in a provision that prevents states and cities from putting in their own net neutrality provisions. States will not be able regulate ISPs at all.

    So what can states or cities do? They can offer Internet service and have their internet service be neutral but they will be unable to affect rules on ISPs that service their area. Awful Republicans....
    I think Inslee is aware of this and looking at what he can do despite restrictions.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2017

    That doesn't seem constitutional. Congress can only regulate interstate commerce; intrastate commerce is governed by the states. An internet service provider would have to abide by Washington laws when providing services to Washington residents.

    The city of Chattanooga, TN runs their own high-speed internet. It's been a wild success. Other cities should immediately start making similar plans. But that won't be possible if the Trump Administration gets it's way. And this is where the court-packing comes in.

    Beyond that, let's put this in lunch pale terms: Republicans just handed nearly unlimited power to.....your cable company. The people who make appointments by saying they'll arrive SOMETIME between 9 and 3pm on Monday or Friday. You'd be hard pressed to find 5 businesses people hate more than their cable company. The messaging on this should be visceral and emotional. Maybe most people can't grasp the nuance of Net Neutrality. But they will grasp power and money being handed to the company that threw half their work-week into flux just so they could get cable and internet installed.
    Post edited by jjstraka34 on
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    edited December 2017

    The fact is there are women who do not understand what is or is not appropriate for the office. Is this an excuse for harassment? Of course not. Should these women be more aware of proper dress? Certainly.

    Odds are that nothing of the sort is going on and that Marcy Kaptur is simply blaming women for being targets of sexual harassment.

    Further, what a woman wears should not count as provocation for sexual harassment, sexual assault, or rape.

    There's simply no justification for it, whatever one might think "appropriate for the office" means.
    @BelleSorciere I explicitly said it is not an excuse. Why are you telling me this?
This discussion has been closed.