I remember seeing some speculation about it being due to the popularity of the race that halfling is one of the races that all romances are available to. I dunno, sounded weird to me... and also makes me disbelieve that some great planning and artistic integrity would have been put into deciding that the LIs don't go for the races they don't go for :-/ Well, except for Viconia not liking elves, that's clearly written in.
Wouldn't it then make more sense for a halfling romance option if they're so popular? :P Well the whole romance thing is something that hadn't really been done before, both in the role play genre and gaming in general. I thought the restrictions were a way of making the characters seem more realistic and to give incentives to play certain races over others.
There aren't any romances in BG1 at all really, at best some of the characters flirt with Charname occasionally from what I recall or did I miss something totally obvious in BG1?
Are the new npc's full on romances like you get in BG2 and various mods or are they just flirtatious in BG1 with a full romance in BG2, (whenever the BG2EE is planned for release)?
No, they will be romance beginnings, leading to full romance in BG2. I can't remember where I read this but it was from the devs.
@Moira I was mostly meaning that they will be romance dialogue paths similar to BG2 not so much about how much development the relationship or romance will have. Though now that you mention it I have trouble picturing them not going anywhere significant until BG2. That to me would make for a very short romance path. I know they've said they will continue in BG2, but I've not read everything they've said. Are you sure they said "no full romances" and not simply that they continue into BG2?
Still, it doesn't necessarily mean they won't be interesting or substantial.
Yeah, I think it might actually be a good thing that the main focus (likely) is in getting to know the new characters. Hopefully it bodes well written character development, romance included, in BG2.
I read your post with your list and remembered something. Have you tried the Romantic Encounters mod? (At SHS I think.) It allows for various encounters with NPCs, mostly non-joinable. The vanilla romances are all coded to respond, and some mod NPCs as well. Highly entertaining. Most of the encounters are one-time affairs. My favorite was a squire with whom you meet 2 or 3 times...the last in ToB, well, overall, very sweet. Some of the encounters are even alternate routes to do something. (Note that this is a mature/adult mod.)
I haven't used that mod. Mostly what I want is a neat and interesting reason to make your stronghold a base of operations. I know after I get my stronghold and finish all the junk... I rarely visit again... sometimes I go for the potions at the sphere... but not often at all.. If there was a character you liked there that had content unlocked at a time delay I'd go back and say hi and stuff... but that might just be me
So much of the space in your stronghold tends to be wasted! DX The Planar Sphere is the worst offender, because you have all those little hallways, rooms and compartments that you could rent out to strange visitors from other realms. I doubt only the cowled wizards would be interested in its potential. Its for that reason that I wanted Watchers Keep to be strongholdable, because thats 5 levels of fun you never have a reason to go back to again. Which is a shame cause 4 of those 5 have great characters in them.
The Planar Sphere is the worst offender, because you have all those little hallways, rooms and compartments that you could rent out to strange visitors from other realms.
And you get rid of the only guests that are there in the first place... It's a lonely giant magical deathsphere... At least your potion student guy stays... but that's all he does... use your stuff to make potions...
No offense, but homos talk a lot about respect and all that. But the fact is that there is a lot of BS done in the name of that. Wanting a "gay monk" is one of these things. It is disgusting and plain wrong independently of your sexuality.
If you want a same sex rom. At lest do it differently.
If you mean no offense... maybe you could choose collective nouns that are not inherently offensive.
Monks in D&D are not christian monks, nor are they the equivalent of any earthly monk. Their set of morals and rules are completely unlike any found in the real world. Perhaps you would like to bring up the first-party sourcebook that you are reading that there are no homosexual monks from?
It's funny that you're ok with the Illithid method of intercourse, and not an alternate human method...
@scypher1: Setting aside the obvious bigotry in your tone, there's a rather simple solution to your "problem" - don't take Rasaad with you. There are twenty-seven other NPCs in BG:EE, I'm sure you can find one who's more to your liking. What other players do with him is none of your concern.
We could solve both problems mentioned by filling the Planar Sphere full of gay people but also making sure none of them are monks. Anyone? Gay Planar Sphere?
People please, no more the "don't like don't take" this will finsh by convicing a NPC tarrasque to be created (and if you don't like, don't take it). Just saying it in general, not to the above post only as this "don't like don't take" is becoming a virus on this forum
It's really a self-evident fact, but sometimes it bears saying. Remember that your game experience is what you make of it. I don't play Evil Characters and don't do evil quests (normally). Just because that option is there doesn't mean I have to be offended that it's there.
In short: It would be nice if we DIDN'T HAVE to say it.
Hmm... I guess I agree that things shouldn't be put in to patronize a certain group. Everything should be done in the spirit of increasing the player's agency so that overdone tropes and stereotypes aren't employed.
Just make a different type of char.. it's not like you'd wanna play the same char on every single playthrough anyway.. right?
It's ironic that you say this because straight guys can be themselves or an idealistic projection of themselves in almost every game, and it's the rest of us who usually have to play a different type of char.
Quartz she's referring to the ABILITY to choose, not saying that Straight guys always want to play golden versions of themselves.
It's about demographic appeal. Being a 400 pound space marine tearing the guts out of psychic space Orks simply appeals to straight men more often than to other groups. Being a Clever Grizzled ex-cop with a severe grumpiness problem and a licence to kill generally appeals to straight men more. Managing a sports team and being able to jump in the action taking over key players generally appeals to straight men more. Playing an adventurous woman with an enormous bosom, yet the inexplicable ability to do high precision acrobatics generally appeals to straight men more, as eye-candy.
It's a generalization but if you take her meaning, she's not wrong. The other groups just want the same courtesy afforded to the straight male demographic. Since this title has a severe emphasis on character development, it would be nice to develop your character the way you want in this aspect, just like it would be nice to have... hmm... evil major story arcs that I've heard you complain about the lack of.
Why does any group HAVE to play a certain way? They should be allowed to play as they like. Romance is part of your play-through, even if you choose to be an asexual killing machine, you get to choose to be that. Lesbians currently DO NOT HAVE THE OPTION to play idealized versions of themselves without extensive immersion breaking.
The option is what we request.
Furthermore at least try to stay on the same page as the conversation if you're going to make minor comments and then flee. You're disrupting the conversation with random derision, rather than adding to it in an intellectual and constructive manner.
Thank you for explaining, but you really could've done without those last two sentences. I've known plenty of people who would see all the valid points you made, then see those two last sentences and go off on you, ignoring everything you just said. Just pointing it out.
I think that you, and Jalily are right. I am just tired of feeling like she is making blatantly rude comments along the path of a legitimate argument.
It's not appropriate at all that I feel constantly targeted by her presence. You can tell me "well that's a personal problem" but seriously every once in a while she just takes a shot at straight males, literally JUST FOR BEING STRAIGHT MALES and it's obscenely obnoxious. (Is it my fault that games are the way they are? No!)
The road to tolerance/respect is a two way street. Thank you.
I understand your point. And I apologize for my confrontational tone, I'm just used to having to jump in as Captain Babyfeelings and show up with the big understanding stick. Honestly, you're one of people who I generally respect on the other side of this argument, and I was dismayed at the statement you made due to it's context and severity.
The main problem with these kind of requests is that they attract controversy, and that controversy leads to both extreme ends of the argument to polarize the participants, into "People that agree with me" and "people that are jerks." So we all get a little defensive about the points we're trying to make. People that are in the middle that are just trying to state their opinions are targeted and shuttled off to the extremist camp in people's minds, and thus argued with as such. I dropped the ball on that one and I must apologize.
The road is indeed two way, but unless someone extends their hand as a reasonable human being, we'll all just stay in our trenches firing blind shots at each other.
Care to join our conversation? Perhaps you have a romance related request for the Devs?
Edit: Thank you for being reasonable in your rebuttal, you called my attention to my haste.
@Quartz I empathize with what you're saying about feeling targeted, but I don't think Jalily meant it that way. I know from personal experience that I have a habit of using words that can come across as aggressive without meaning to. It's an emotionally charged issue and I know I get riled up about it. Also you are right about those last 2 sentences of TenYaiba's last post, and I want to applaud the fact that you have remained so civil and calm. It's really nice to have an honest civil discussion.
Anyways, I won't lie I have as a heterosexual woman sometimes been frustrated by roleplaying games. This frustration is most apparent in ME3 where the statistics for how many options male vs female Shepard have are thus;
Male Shepard: 3 Human Women, 1 Alien Woman, 1 Human Man
Female Shepard: 1 Human Woman, 1 Alien Man
Both: 2 Human Women, I Human Man, I Alien 'Female'
Now let me sum that up in just Male vs Female
Male Shepard: 7 Women, 2 Men
Female Shepard: 2 Men, 4 Women
Furthermore, 2 romances aimed at girls from the previous game were sabotaged and effectively ended in ME3. One of these two men dies, with almost no content in the game, the other cheats on you, and gets his new girlfriend pregnant, and in the same conversation talks about how his new girl wants to name the baby after you. Every single romance a male character could have had in any previous game was continued and not sabotaged.
So in summary, none of this is the fault of the men who play. However game companies usually cater to Straight Male Players more than anyone else. I was lucky when I played ME3, as I had just happened to pick the male npc in the second game who received the most and best developed content in ME3. If I hadn't picked him, since my other male option was dead (due to choices I made in the first game) I would have been left with having my love die, being cheated on, or choosing to romance a woman. Since my Shepard was not bisexual, I would have basically been screwed.
Anyways that really got away from me and I want to make it clear I'm not trying to attack anyone. I hope this contributes to the conversation in some meaningful way. (I probably just got everyone really off-track or something.) -_-
Not that you got everyone off track @EpitomyofShyness , but the topic just lends itself to derailment.
Furthermore, the ME series is an offender on multiple instances, but that, in my mind is because of the game's nature. Extremely limited party size and choice compared to things like BG. Furthermore, it's a game where you can, and are encouraged to imprint yourself in the situation, so those that want immersion lose the ability to do one of the romances, that are. to be perfectly honest, nothing compared to the writing and quality we're talking about in this game. Giving the Bisexual option the Foul Taste of catering to heterosexual males instead of being tailored to the audience they should be intended for.
The Derailments are sometimes helpful, bringing otherwise un-thought-of issues and features that we want discussed or implemented. Many times however they just make me go to the Meme Thread and try not to make an ass of myself like I just did.
Comments
Oh yes!
We definitely need more orbital lasers to every romance!
Are the new npc's full on romances like you get in BG2 and various mods or are they just flirtatious in BG1 with a full romance in BG2, (whenever the BG2EE is planned for release)?
I found the reference, it was in the AMAA:
DaveGross: "The new NPCs each have a full quest and a little banter, along with "starter romances" that can blossom into full-scale romances in BG2."
Though that does sound a little disappointing. Still, it doesn't necessarily mean they won't be interesting or substantial.
@TenYaiba
I read your post with your list and remembered something. Have you tried the Romantic Encounters mod? (At SHS I think.) It allows for various encounters with NPCs, mostly non-joinable. The vanilla romances are all coded to respond, and some mod NPCs as well. Highly entertaining. Most of the encounters are one-time affairs. My favorite was a squire with whom you meet 2 or 3 times...the last in ToB, well, overall, very sweet. Some of the encounters are even alternate routes to do something. (Note that this is a mature/adult mod.)
And I want more content... always.
Lonely lonely lonely Deathsphere...
If you want a same sex rom. At lest do it differently.
Monks in D&D are not christian monks, nor are they the equivalent of any earthly monk. Their set of morals and rules are completely unlike any found in the real world. Perhaps you would like to bring up the first-party sourcebook that you are reading that there are no homosexual monks from?
It's funny that you're ok with the Illithid method of intercourse, and not an alternate human method...
In short: It would be nice if we DIDN'T HAVE to say it.
It's about demographic appeal. Being a 400 pound space marine tearing the guts out of psychic space Orks simply appeals to straight men more often than to other groups. Being a Clever Grizzled ex-cop with a severe grumpiness problem and a licence to kill generally appeals to straight men more. Managing a sports team and being able to jump in the action taking over key players generally appeals to straight men more. Playing an adventurous woman with an enormous bosom, yet the inexplicable ability to do high precision acrobatics generally appeals to straight men more, as eye-candy.
It's a generalization but if you take her meaning, she's not wrong. The other groups just want the same courtesy afforded to the straight male demographic. Since this title has a severe emphasis on character development, it would be nice to develop your character the way you want in this aspect, just like it would be nice to have... hmm... evil major story arcs that I've heard you complain about the lack of.
Why does any group HAVE to play a certain way? They should be allowed to play as they like. Romance is part of your play-through, even if you choose to be an asexual killing machine, you get to choose to be that. Lesbians currently DO NOT HAVE THE OPTION to play idealized versions of themselves without extensive immersion breaking.
The option is what we request.
Furthermore at least try to stay on the same page as the conversation if you're going to make minor comments and then flee. You're disrupting the conversation with random derision, rather than adding to it in an intellectual and constructive manner.
I think that you, and Jalily are right. I am just tired of feeling like she is making blatantly rude comments along the path of a legitimate argument.
It's not appropriate at all that I feel constantly targeted by her presence. You can tell me "well that's a personal problem" but seriously every once in a while she just takes a shot at straight males, literally JUST FOR BEING STRAIGHT MALES and it's obscenely obnoxious. (Is it my fault that games are the way they are? No!)
The road to tolerance/respect is a two way street. Thank you.
The main problem with these kind of requests is that they attract controversy, and that controversy leads to both extreme ends of the argument to polarize the participants, into "People that agree with me" and "people that are jerks." So we all get a little defensive about the points we're trying to make. People that are in the middle that are just trying to state their opinions are targeted and shuttled off to the extremist camp in people's minds, and thus argued with as such. I dropped the ball on that one and I must apologize.
The road is indeed two way, but unless someone extends their hand as a reasonable human being, we'll all just stay in our trenches firing blind shots at each other.
Care to join our conversation? Perhaps you have a romance related request for the Devs?
Edit: Thank you for being reasonable in your rebuttal, you called my attention to my haste.
Anyways, I won't lie I have as a heterosexual woman sometimes been frustrated by roleplaying games. This frustration is most apparent in ME3 where the statistics for how many options male vs female Shepard have are thus;
Male Shepard: 3 Human Women, 1 Alien Woman, 1 Human Man
Female Shepard: 1 Human Woman, 1 Alien Man
Both: 2 Human Women, I Human Man, I Alien 'Female'
Now let me sum that up in just Male vs Female
Male Shepard: 7 Women, 2 Men
Female Shepard: 2 Men, 4 Women
Furthermore, 2 romances aimed at girls from the previous game were sabotaged and effectively ended in ME3. One of these two men dies, with almost no content in the game, the other cheats on you, and gets his new girlfriend pregnant, and in the same conversation talks about how his new girl wants to name the baby after you. Every single romance a male character could have had in any previous game was continued and not sabotaged.
So in summary, none of this is the fault of the men who play. However game companies usually cater to Straight Male Players more than anyone else. I was lucky when I played ME3, as I had just happened to pick the male npc in the second game who received the most and best developed content in ME3. If I hadn't picked him, since my other male option was dead (due to choices I made in the first game) I would have been left with having my love die, being cheated on, or choosing to romance a woman. Since my Shepard was not bisexual, I would have basically been screwed.
Anyways that really got away from me and I want to make it clear I'm not trying to attack anyone. I hope this contributes to the conversation in some meaningful way. (I probably just got everyone really off-track or something.) -_-
Furthermore, the ME series is an offender on multiple instances, but that, in my mind is because of the game's nature. Extremely limited party size and choice compared to things like BG. Furthermore, it's a game where you can, and are encouraged to imprint yourself in the situation, so those that want immersion lose the ability to do one of the romances, that are. to be perfectly honest, nothing compared to the writing and quality we're talking about in this game. Giving the Bisexual option the Foul Taste of catering to heterosexual males instead of being tailored to the audience they should be intended for.
The Derailments are sometimes helpful, bringing otherwise un-thought-of issues and features that we want discussed or implemented. Many times however they just make me go to the Meme Thread and try not to make an ass of myself like I just did.