A little disappointed
DragonKing
Member Posts: 1,979
So I finally beat BG trilogy yesterday and I wonder was I thinking only person a little disappointed with the way some stuff was handled? So the biggest disappointment was Viconia's epilogue if you choose to not become a god and you romanced her.
First I need to know, is Drzzt also huntrd by Lolth handmaidens? If not, why not? I remember reading a little about the character, and basically someone hr befriended helped him turn away from the Spider queen. Yet Vi is hunted until the very end, in which she dies and protag just disappears. I mean seriously, that really isn't a fulfilling ending to a romance that required you to be really understanding or have the patience of Buddha. Depending on what race PC is, I can the tragic irony in PC outliving the lover that naturally would outlive him. But still, after everything was said and done I felt that mpty with how it ended. But that's not the biggest let down,the biggest let down were in the npc themselves.
For example, I put Jaheira and Viconia on the same team because I knew that they would always come to conflict with each other. But, what I also hoped to see were how the characters would react to dome characters change and growth. When Vi started to change and become more aware of her emotions instead of sealing them up, I expected Jaheira to eventually make some type of comment or remark even if it was mocking Vi about her change. Nothing, that's what we get. Not even some ttype of "we fought along side each other for some months-years now and you've gained some batylfied respect from me" type of deal. I mean I remember what year the game was originally released, but I would hope the EE actually would build on this.
With that said, I do feel that the delivery of the story was damn near perfect, despite how some people preferred 1 or 2.
Baldur Gate 1 was this open world, that you god tossed into to, despite how the world felt empty, which it should if you ask me. Bandits were attacking the travels, and the iron shortage was hurting the economy from my perspective. You wouldn't see to many people in all those areas for that type of reason. Charname had to grow and learn to stand on his/her own two feet, he/she no longer had Gorion sheltering him/her or Imeon, so he/she needed to explore the world to learn how it works before anything else.
Baldur Gate 2- the world is more closed off, but much more focus driven now. Charname oa no longer a little welp, but an adult with his/her on thoughts and ideas with real world experience to back up his/her actions. The choices made now has a stronger reflection of the character Charname is then any in BG1.
Throne of Bhaal- a linear story, which it had to be. The world was being torn apart so charname doesn't really have the time to go exploring that empty forest on the otherside of the map close to the borders, you are literally racing against time itself. Everything charname ever done up to now should reflect on the type of man/woman charname grew to be, the type of people charname attracted to his/her side. This is end game and its all about Charname.
If the npc were a little more then just ragdolls half the time I would call BG perfect. Literally, is Jan the only npc who has a comment for majority of the situation? I played with him for the first time and he just had comment after comment, and the one time I expected him to have a crazy story... The one time I needed him to speak... He said nothing! Jan, say something! Tell this idiot pirate King one of your stupid stories so we can get into spellhold. I mean shoot, boo opens his mouth even against yoshimo's wishes and we are there in a matter of seconds..
Jan is literally the one who seemed the most alive, and that is because he made his presence more known throughout the game. Hexxat, and Vi I would expect to be mostly silent since they don't want attention drawn to themselves, but Minsc and Nalia I would expect t to have just as many comments as Jan, maybe more in Minsc.
First I need to know, is Drzzt also huntrd by Lolth handmaidens? If not, why not? I remember reading a little about the character, and basically someone hr befriended helped him turn away from the Spider queen. Yet Vi is hunted until the very end, in which she dies and protag just disappears. I mean seriously, that really isn't a fulfilling ending to a romance that required you to be really understanding or have the patience of Buddha. Depending on what race PC is, I can the tragic irony in PC outliving the lover that naturally would outlive him. But still, after everything was said and done I felt that mpty with how it ended. But that's not the biggest let down,the biggest let down were in the npc themselves.
For example, I put Jaheira and Viconia on the same team because I knew that they would always come to conflict with each other. But, what I also hoped to see were how the characters would react to dome characters change and growth. When Vi started to change and become more aware of her emotions instead of sealing them up, I expected Jaheira to eventually make some type of comment or remark even if it was mocking Vi about her change. Nothing, that's what we get. Not even some ttype of "we fought along side each other for some months-years now and you've gained some batylfied respect from me" type of deal. I mean I remember what year the game was originally released, but I would hope the EE actually would build on this.
With that said, I do feel that the delivery of the story was damn near perfect, despite how some people preferred 1 or 2.
Baldur Gate 1 was this open world, that you god tossed into to, despite how the world felt empty, which it should if you ask me. Bandits were attacking the travels, and the iron shortage was hurting the economy from my perspective. You wouldn't see to many people in all those areas for that type of reason. Charname had to grow and learn to stand on his/her own two feet, he/she no longer had Gorion sheltering him/her or Imeon, so he/she needed to explore the world to learn how it works before anything else.
Baldur Gate 2- the world is more closed off, but much more focus driven now. Charname oa no longer a little welp, but an adult with his/her on thoughts and ideas with real world experience to back up his/her actions. The choices made now has a stronger reflection of the character Charname is then any in BG1.
Throne of Bhaal- a linear story, which it had to be. The world was being torn apart so charname doesn't really have the time to go exploring that empty forest on the otherside of the map close to the borders, you are literally racing against time itself. Everything charname ever done up to now should reflect on the type of man/woman charname grew to be, the type of people charname attracted to his/her side. This is end game and its all about Charname.
If the npc were a little more then just ragdolls half the time I would call BG perfect. Literally, is Jan the only npc who has a comment for majority of the situation? I played with him for the first time and he just had comment after comment, and the one time I expected him to have a crazy story... The one time I needed him to speak... He said nothing! Jan, say something! Tell this idiot pirate King one of your stupid stories so we can get into spellhold. I mean shoot, boo opens his mouth even against yoshimo's wishes and we are there in a matter of seconds..
Jan is literally the one who seemed the most alive, and that is because he made his presence more known throughout the game. Hexxat, and Vi I would expect to be mostly silent since they don't want attention drawn to themselves, but Minsc and Nalia I would expect t to have just as many comments as Jan, maybe more in Minsc.
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Comments
Viconia only opens up more towards you, the player. To everyone else, she's her usual unfriendly self. Real-life people can be like this too- you can't expect someone like Jaheira, who has no personal relations with Viconia, to suddenly pick up on the fact that she is occasionally showing more emotion to someone else.
Jan says a lot when he comments - that doesn't mean he comments the most. If you want my two-cents, his long-winded nonsense is just too much trouble to read and I usually skip it in the rare instances where I use him. Other NPCs comment plenty, it's just that they do it at different times, so every time you use a different party you'll get a comment where you won't expect it. Nowadays, RPGs like Dragon Age literally have all your companions comment at the exact same moment, so the difference can be jarring.
It was little things like that, that just made the companions and the world feel live. Now, Jaheira and Wynne are two different characters who don't necessarily play the same role and dao and BG are years apart when it come to productions so I don't have the same level of expectations. But there are some things here and there I was hoping, not expecting to see.
"Meanwhile, another High Magic ritual performed by Q'arlynd Melarn transformed those drow not tainted by Wendonai's blood and the followers of Eilistraee back into their original dark elven form, and Corellon Larethian thus permitted the souls of Eilistraee's faithful and the newly transformed dark elves to enter Arvandor.[31]"
But doesn't thay contradicted itself? If attempting to kill him is what was creating the chaos, then why would you favor him ultimately having your hand maidens stop hunting him, or hunting him less? That lessens the chaos not creates more. Add ontop of that he's obvious gained quite a bit of respect on the surface world which would lessen it even more since now everyone isn't trying to kill the random Drow that is on the surface. I'm not seeing how any of this is working in lolth's favor, or hell even just feeding her insatiable appetite at all.
Besides, Drizzt is a lowly male, Lolth's boytoy on the surface. And Lolth doesn't particularly enjoy chaos among her drow, but the chaos that they cause everywhere. Sometimes that is among themselves, sometimes it's to the other races.
As the last point, it really doesn't have to make sense. Two people can do the exact same thing, and get two totally different reactions from the same person. FR gods have a persona as well, they are not just mighty entities.
The only plus I can see from Drizzt being favored is the idea that some people now no longer believes he follows lolth, hell others see him as a hero. Now unless Lolth is tossing none Drow related problems at him left and right, while trying to cause a bigger storm to grow, I really don't see the point of him becoming favored. I might never see the point on that action, I may need to see the end game there.
If you're the favored of Helm, he's not going to tell you to go on a mass killing spree of the weak and innocent. If your the favored of Mystra, she won't tell you to seal away your magic and then go speed the rest of your life inside an antimagic field. If you're the favored of Talos, he isn't going to tell you to spend the rest of your life in peace and harmony.
Soi can't comprehend the logical choice of Drizzt. When he first came to the surface, yea I could see it then, no one knew him and all people would see is just another evil Drow. Even when he was making a name for himself, the struggle of gaining a lot of peoples trust. But, from.what I can tell now... That's just a, "yea that no longer makes any damn sense" choice.
In a way, Drizzt is constantly proving himself to be "the strongest of the brood", even if he hates the Spider Queen. That's exactly the kind of contradiction that Lolth loves.
Based on this very quite, avoiding and staying away from Drizzt would t be the biggest appeal to get or to the Drow. The biggest appeal would be overcoming his strength to prove they are the superior strength or getting torn apart trying too.
The bigger appeal would be a handmaiden being able to manipulate his movements into doing something hr thinks is for the greater good, but instead he is messing things up. Not avoiding or staying away from him. Maybe it's just me, but nothing about Lolth screams, " protect my strongest child."
You say he's the golden boy because of the cause he creates, but then you tell me Lolth told them to leave him be... Which ironically, creates none of the chaos that got him favored in the first place...
Are you seeing what I'm seeing here? Unless Lolth is trying to use Drizzt to show the rest of the world that the Drow aren't all bad, which would make no sense at all, there is no method to this madness.
And you can't just say, "he's a lowly male!" This lowly male is favored by their most powerful god so he can't be too much of just a lowly male since lolth favored him over the Elite females.
She favors Drizzt to some extent but she doesn't intend to sacrifice her precious priestesses or handmaidens in order to test him out. She's the queen of chaos, but that doesn't mean she would constantly feel the need to manipulate things in order to create chaos or throw her priestesses into pointless slaughter. She already knows how capable he is when pushed. He DID repel an army of drow, and killed many of her most powerful servants during that campaign.
One part of this is the matriarchality of the drow society. While Drizzt as a male has Lolth's favor, he is still lower in value than the lowest female, even if he could easily defeat them. The competition of the drow generally doesn't cross the gender barrier. Even amongst all the chaos, it's usually males that kill males, and females that kill females. For us here in the real world, the way drow society works may be hard for us to wrap our head around, with all the talk of equality and all that.
Besides, it's very rare that Lolth actually communicates with her followers, or tells them what to do. Even Baenre priestesses, that are in high favor of Lolth, rarely know exactly what she wants.
It's mostly the uncertainty of Lolth's reaction to Drizzt getting killed by drow hands, that holds the other drow at bay. Lolth's favor is fickle, and while it might bring great glory, it could also mean Lolth's disfavor, which is a death sentence. Or worse, being made into a drider. The reason she is called the Spider Queen isn't because she likes spiders, she IS like a spider. Casting webs of plans and manipulating events to her advantage. She doesn't enjoy mindless slaughter, throwing her handmaidens into harms way, but she does approve of killing as a way to advance in rank. That's why she approves of other males going after Drizzt, to advance in rank. For a female that would be pointless, it wouldn't advance them anywhere, since Drizzt is already a thousand ranks below them.
This very same thing applies to Jarlaxle and Gromph Baenre as well, that's how they keep their station in society.
(1) Lolth decides not to attack Drizzt. This could be because:
-(A) She wants everybody to see an example of badass drow power, which Drizzt demonstrates to surfacers.
-(B) She doesn't want Drizzt to murdalize her faithful, and rob her of valuable assets.
-(C) She doesn't want Drizzt to murdalize her faithful, and make her evil drow look weak.
(2) Lolth decides to attack Drizzt. This could be because:
-(A) She doesn't like good drow and feels like they're an embarrassment in the eyes of others.
-(B) She wants to kill off Drizzt for disobedience.
-(C) She wants to emphasize Drizzt's badass drow power by giving him another epic fight to win.
Not all of these are particularly plausible, but we can't rule all of them out.
@DragonKing, you're never happy.
As I said before, there had to be a end game I just don't know about. Happy, what is happy? Oh is that the feeling I get when I reach into the depths of pure chaos just to turn a hamster pink?