Convincing Erg to play the EEs
JuliusBorisov
Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,760
This discussion was created from comments split from: Wasteland 2 thread.
Here you go, ladies and gentlemen. Feel free to express your views on the EEs here.
Here you go, ladies and gentlemen. Feel free to express your views on the EEs here.
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Kotor 2 is also from Obsidian and has mods, so I did buy it. Twice, actually.
Also NWN 2 is from Obsidian ans has mods and I did buy it once.
But I think we have to thank Bioware more than Obsidian for the fact that both Kotor 2 and NWN 2 have mods, so Obsidian is still number one on the list of video game developers that I most despise.
Beamdog is number two
And I really regret that @Erg lost interest in EE, cause I really hoped to see more of his mods. Sigh.
As for Wasteland 2. Like ten seconds in and my restartitis kicks in.
Yes, the fact that they didn't manage to fully implement TobEX features is quite embarrassing.
ToBEX was made by one guy using reverse engineering, because he had no access to the source code, working in his own free time, and he has managed to outdo Beamdog despite all its paid developers with full access to the source code.
However, that's not the main reason.
I just can't stand what they have done to one of my favourite games, and by that I mean all the unnecessary and arbitrary changes.
There are other reasons too (lack of customisability, subpar original content, etc.), but the above is the main one.
[spoiler=Tempest]
[spoiler=A room full of spiders according to Beamdog]
[spoiler=A room full of spiders in Tutification]
I don't know what unnecessary and arbitrary changes you are referring to, but as for lack of customisability you do have some valid points. There should be as many customize options in menu as possible (some more hardcore and under-the-hood changes should indeed go to .ini file). As for subpar content, well maybe for BGEE, but they were just starting, they had an evil Atari above their heads and they were just a bunch of people trying to make their beloved game better. BG2EE looks much better in that regard and I have a feeling SoD will be as good as originals.
Look, you clearly didn't loose interest in franchise, since you still play vanilla. I know you reacted something like "too little to late" when I passed the news about concentration checks finding their way in soon enough (new patches and SoD). But since these will be added maybe all relevant TobEX features will too. They said lot about UI modding being easier and they also said there will be many new items in SoD with unique properies (so there surely will be new options). I find it hard to believe they'll not doing anything good to scripting capabilities and forget about externalizations. Maybe give them one last chance after SoD and new patches come out?
Finally, I don't know if you're familiar with it, but @swit is doing EET mod, which is one may say equivalent of BGT and a bunch of tweaks and other mods compatible with it too. Now, I know that spawning system in EE is something that bothers you greatly (because it makes the game easier, right?), but @swit made a mod called BGEE Spawn (or adapted some other version of spawning mod, I'm not sure). I don't know how close it is to fullfill your expectations regarding spawning system, but maybe it's close enough to spark some interest. Either way you should check it, even if for giving some feedback to improve it, if you find some cool features lacking. Anyway, I find EET as a starting point for my future playthroughs and hope its feature of allowing parties to go anywhere on the world map, at any point, would lead to releasing great mods, that will add a high-level content to once visited areas (like Baldur's Gate).
Edit: Since we deviated a bit from a W2 topic, maybe some moderator could put my conversation with @Erg and @typo_tilly to a separate topic? I really don't want to hijack this thread anymore. Thanks.
Examples of unnecessary and arbitrary changes:
1) the way pickpocket works
2) the behaviour of the sleep spell, plus other similar spells
3) the lack or respawning in some critical areas
4) kits and other BG2 crap in BG1 and IWD (some of these are good but they should be left to mods; now we can't even play vanilla anymore)
5) forcing 1PP down our collective throats
and the list could go on and on !!! It's easy to blame evil Atari for everything, but IMO Beamdog managed to do even worse, since Atari is out of the picture. I don't have direct experience with the new content in BGII:EE (and I never will), but from what I read here, it is really bad, and I mean Hexxat bad
It is just easier for me to mod the original games, because they are closer to my taste to start with.
The bottom line, as I see it, is that you never needed Enhanced Edition to begin with and you're perfectly fine with vanilla + mods. Because I can't imagine what enhancements the game should have to be appealing to you. It seems even the slightest deviation from vanilla behavior is a bad and arbitrary decision to you. It's not possible to put each minor change as an (ini) option, there have to be some development decisions somewhere in the process.
Yes, I think that every deviation from vanilla behaviour (even the "good" ones and/or the ones I may personally like) should be entirely optional, and implemented through
1) in-game options settings
or
2) ini files
or
3) WeiDU (official) mods.
or a combination of the above.
What can I say? I really like customisability and modularity, and this is where the original games really outshine the so called Enhanced Editions.
Nooooooo!!! Please don't do that!!! We need you!
Also, I love spears and halberds and I would kill for more of them!