I'm not sure anybody's trying to convince anybody of anything. Rather, I think people who are disappointed and even angry and frustrated about the direction of BG3, and about Larian's and WotC's attitudes about it, need a place to vent, and this forum has become that place.
Pretty much. I know initially my reaction to the game being shown the first time was one of frustration at the game I was seeing having so little to do with the original series, and it was coming off a very frustrating time playing Original Sin 2 and genuinely not grasping why anybody likes it whatsoever (and I still don't, and I doubt I ever will)
And one thing that has not changed in my attitude is that this is a sequel *in name alone*. It is a business motivated sequel, something which we see all the time in life and so it really shouldn't be a shock or a source of long held rancor. Well, unless its Bethesda Fallout, I do feel anyone who despises their take on Fallout have very good reason to feel that way and I'm kinda with them. But that's a specific example of a series becoming basically the polar opposite of what it originally was and if you understand anything about Bethesda it wasn't surprising in anyway that it became that.
Larian making Baldur's Gate 3 could be fine, even good if they design the game well for the D&D combat system and they tell a good story within the Forgotten Realms setting which I have always been fond of. It could also end up a disaster. But we won't know until its complete. Based on what I've seen, I'm pretty neutral on it. I like Shadowheart (well, except her name, they really should have given her a less ah, try-hard name) because she does remind me of Viconia a lot but not in a forced way, which does show Larian kind of grasp at how you make a character that tends towards evil but still might be someone you'd let in your party because they're pragmatic and have good reason to follow you. I hope the rest of the writing has much of that nuance, it really would improve a lot on their work on OS2 as far as writing goes.
I see a lot of responses that can be interpreted as "Stop feeling the way you feel. You don't have a right to feel and think that way. Your feelings and thoughts are invalid. How dare you think this?" Sometimes followed by some insulting ad hominem statements for good measure.
Yes, and the worst one of all being the: We don't like you posting here. Go post somewhere else.
Here's my deal. I want MY Forgotten Realms game, a contemporary game set in the FR that I will like and enjoy playing. Call me names like "selfish" or "entitled" all you want, I don't care. The day that I get *that* FR game is the day that I will gladly stop criticizing (or saying anything about) BG3. Until then, however, BG3 will remain the target of my disappointment/frustrations/anger/bitterness, etc.
@DinoDin "And frankly, you've been the worst offender, imo, on using rhetoric that belittles those who don't see things your way."
Five words, "Real time with pause Jihad." You have a VERY selective memory.
Remind me, what was the date that was said? Also, who said it, and are they posting in this subforum anymore? If not, you're just latching onto your grievances in an attempt to validate your position as being picked on. It's disingenuous if the comment was made months and months ago.
I'm not sure anybody's trying to convince anybody of anything. Rather, I think people who are disappointed and even angry and frustrated about the direction of BG3, and about Larian's and WotC's attitudes about it, need a place to vent, and this forum has become that place.
I see a lot of responses that can be interpreted as "Stop feeling the way you feel. You don't have a right to feel and think that way. Your feelings and thoughts are invalid. How dare you think this?" Sometimes followed by some insulting ad hominem statements for good measure.
I've seen that coming from both sides.
Here's how you might learn to respond to an opinion you disagree with or an emotion you don't share that you might learn in Conflict Resolution 101: "I hear you. I understand you are very disappointed and maybe even angry. (Or, I understand you are excited by the previews and interviews you see and are looking forward to the new game.) I don't feel that way, myself. I feel this other way, and I have this other opinion."
As a rule, after acknowledging the other person's feelings, thoughts, opinions, or ideas, don't use "you" language, use "I" language instead.
I think people who need to vent their negative opinions and feelings deserve to be allowed to do so without being attacked or otherwise provoked. And I think that people who want to express and share their excitement and happiness deserve to be allowed to do so without figuratively having cold water thrown on them.
I would love if this were true. 11 people can say what you said verbatim, and if even one person appears dismissive of anyone's concern on this forum, then it doesnt matter and you're back to square one.
Unfortunately, the other outcome is party A states their opinion. Party B states their opinion. Then both parties just argue about their opinions for three days (Resolving nothing. They're just opinions). Once the argument finally ends... three weeks later, the same argument starts again.
I see a lot of responses that can be interpreted as "Stop feeling the way you feel. You don't have a right to feel and think that way. Your feelings and thoughts are invalid. How dare you think this?" Sometimes followed by some insulting ad hominem statements for good measure.
The moderation team has been putting a lot of effort into handling that. No personal attack will be tolerated.
People have repeatedly voiced their concerns about that, they´re entitled to it, but interrupting the flow of a thread with impossible demands for an extended period of time and keep repeating the same things about some game design choices that are not going to change in the main thread about the game could be considered a little disrupting.
I think people who need to vent their negative opinions and feelings deserve to be allowed to do so without being attacked or otherwise provoked. And I think that people who want to express and share their excitement and happiness deserve to be allowed to do so without figuratively having cold water thrown on them.
I'd very much appreciate if the participants of this discussion, just as any other discussion on this forum, would follow your recommendation: no attacks and no provocations.
Yeah... not to nitpick but usually they advise you to avoid names in modern fantasy that describe the personality of the character (because it sounds artificial to call a pyromancer "Cinder" or your BBEG "Bloodrain" or "Slithertongue" unless they´re made-up names), names that are common names but changing one letter or two, names difficult to pronounce, names based in mythology from another world (or the real world) or names with apostrophes in the middle.
With Shadowheart, Wyll, Astherion, Lae`zel, Raphael and Gale the mage seems they´re going for a straight bingo. I wonder if they´re doing it on purpose
The fact that she is also a cleric of shar, the goddess of shadows; and her name is shadowheart does not help.
And that you have a wizard called Gale that casts wind gust and misty step.
I suppose we will also meet later Mortis the necromancer, Bandaid the healer, Pyro the fire mage, Elsa the frost mage, and Spicy the Maztican foodcart chef.
Sure, unless you want to be a gunslinger, I do not think you will have a problem;
In any case, you could always change your name to one more suitable to your profession, gunslinger, like Pew-Pew or "Wyatt Earp"; in that case, you´re in.
Or their parents were LVL 18 diviners so they decided to call her "Shadowheart" so she could get used to being a trickery cleric of Shar from the start and don´t get any ideas.
I sincerely hope it´s not the case with Raphael the cambion when they decided to name him after an archangel. Either their parents are the worst diviners ever or they have some twisted sense of humor.
Anyway, if Wyll has some particularly high wisdom saves and Asterion has a particularly beautiful point behind the ear where the parietal, temporal, and occipital bones meet (https://www.merriam-webster.com/medical/asterion) sorry but I´m out.
Assuming Shadowheart has one or more personal quests (imo she'd better) it could shed some light (no pun intended) on her choice, and perhaps her real name.
@PsicoVic Make sure to keep an eye out for the legendary artifact "The Cloak of Ban-Dai_eed."
"In any case, you could always change your name to one more suitable to your profession, gunslinger, like Pew-Pew or "Wyatt Earp"; in that case, you´re in."
Shoot Gunner? Wait, is Kojima involved somehow? These names feel very Kojima.
Shoot Gunner? Wait, is Kojima involved somehow? These names feel very Kojima.
That would be amazing.
Matt Mercer´s gunslinger it´s a great fighter subclass (based on the one in PF), but I do not think it´s in the game. Nor firearms, at least we do not have news about it.
I see a lot of responses that can be interpreted as "Stop feeling the way you feel. You don't have a right to feel and think that way. Your feelings and thoughts are invalid. How dare you think this?" Sometimes followed by some insulting ad hominem statements for good measure.
I get what you're trying to say here, but I don't think this is an accurate summary of what is occurring here. Nobody is telling anybody their opinions are invalid. All that's being asked is that people stop *repeating* the same grievance that they've expressed since February, when we first learned about this. I don't think it's ridiculous to question why folks think it's productive to air the same grievance on this forum in February, March, April, May, June and July. Are we going to continue to hear this complaint in August too? When can we objectively say enough is enough?
The point is not about having a feeling or thought. It is about *repeatedly* and for months filling a public discussion forum with that same thought.
"I get what you're trying to say here, but I don't think this is an accurate summary of what is occurring here. Nobody is telling anybody their opinions are invalid. All that's being asked is that people stop *repeating* the same PRAISE that they've expressed since February, when we first learned about this. I don't think it's ridiculous to question why folks think it's productive to air the same PRAISE on this forum in February, March, April, May, June and July. Are we going to continue to hear this PRAISE in August too? When can we objectively say enough is enough?
The point is not about having a feeling or thought. It is about *repeatedly* and for months filling a public discussion forum with that same thought."
This argument works both ways.
All I see here is, "go away, your opinion isn't welcome here."
I would say that the repetition has to do with venting. And the people who feel the need to vent keep getting more news that they find disappointing when Larian releases new previews or interviews.
Also, much of the "repetition" is in response to continued challenge and negative feedback from other posters. I think it would die down if people just let whatever opinion stand without feeling the need to start an argument about it.
Not responding at all to an opinion you disagree with is a valid response, you know.
"No Spam.
Unsolicited advertising, promotional materials, "junk mail", "chain letters", "pyramid schemes", or any other form of solicitation are not allowed.
Posting frequent, annoying, and/or nonsensical posts will not be tolerated. Posting the same message to multiple threads (also known as cross-posting) is also not permitted. This also includes posting multiple threads or comments in short sequence that are about largely the same thing.
." https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/63570/forum-guidelines
I do not say it´s already done in this thread because the staff would have taken care of it, but I will say it´s borderline "spammy" on many occasions and it would be great if we all avoid it.
@PsicoVic "Posting frequent, annoying, and/or nonsensical posts will not be tolerated. Posting the same message to multiple threads (also known as cross-posting) is also not permitted. This also includes posting multiple threads or comments in short sequence that are about largely the same thing."
Annoying to who? Because several of us are just as annoyed by the constant praise as you are by the lack of praise. If this is spam and against site rules, then so is every single post praising Larian and the game.
Please don't continue that discussion. If you have something to say about BG3, do that. If you have something to say about other users or their behavior - don't. Let the moderators handle that aspect. The last 2 pages of this thread have many comments about what should/should not be posted-- it's off-topic and counterproductive.
I would say that the repetition has to do with venting. And the people who feel the need to vent keep getting more news that they find disappointing when Larian releases new previews or interviews.
Also, much of the "repetition" is in response to continued challenge and negative feedback from other posters. I think it would die down if people just let whatever opinion stand without feeling the need to start an argument about it.
Not responding at all to an opinion you disagree with is a valid response, you know.
@BelgarathMTH, you've said it perfectly here. Thank you.
Hey guys. I’ve not been on much lately as I’ve been taking a break as things on here were starting to make me feel a bit negative. Hope everyone is keeping well ? Early access is still being said as August Maybe I presume? Anyone heard any different?
Comments
Pretty much. I know initially my reaction to the game being shown the first time was one of frustration at the game I was seeing having so little to do with the original series, and it was coming off a very frustrating time playing Original Sin 2 and genuinely not grasping why anybody likes it whatsoever (and I still don't, and I doubt I ever will)
And one thing that has not changed in my attitude is that this is a sequel *in name alone*. It is a business motivated sequel, something which we see all the time in life and so it really shouldn't be a shock or a source of long held rancor. Well, unless its Bethesda Fallout, I do feel anyone who despises their take on Fallout have very good reason to feel that way and I'm kinda with them. But that's a specific example of a series becoming basically the polar opposite of what it originally was and if you understand anything about Bethesda it wasn't surprising in anyway that it became that.
Larian making Baldur's Gate 3 could be fine, even good if they design the game well for the D&D combat system and they tell a good story within the Forgotten Realms setting which I have always been fond of. It could also end up a disaster. But we won't know until its complete. Based on what I've seen, I'm pretty neutral on it. I like Shadowheart (well, except her name, they really should have given her a less ah, try-hard name) because she does remind me of Viconia a lot but not in a forced way, which does show Larian kind of grasp at how you make a character that tends towards evil but still might be someone you'd let in your party because they're pragmatic and have good reason to follow you. I hope the rest of the writing has much of that nuance, it really would improve a lot on their work on OS2 as far as writing goes.
Remind me, what was the date that was said? Also, who said it, and are they posting in this subforum anymore? If not, you're just latching onto your grievances in an attempt to validate your position as being picked on. It's disingenuous if the comment was made months and months ago.
I would love if this were true. 11 people can say what you said verbatim, and if even one person appears dismissive of anyone's concern on this forum, then it doesnt matter and you're back to square one.
Unfortunately, the other outcome is party A states their opinion. Party B states their opinion. Then both parties just argue about their opinions for three days (Resolving nothing. They're just opinions). Once the argument finally ends... three weeks later, the same argument starts again.
The moderation team has been putting a lot of effort into handling that. No personal attack will be tolerated.
This is a very good observation.
I'd very much appreciate if the participants of this discussion, just as any other discussion on this forum, would follow your recommendation: no attacks and no provocations.
I didn't know Larian was doing a crossover with My Little Pony
With Shadowheart, Wyll, Astherion, Lae`zel, Raphael and Gale the mage seems they´re going for a straight bingo. I wonder if they´re doing it on purpose
And that you have a wizard called Gale that casts wind gust and misty step.
I suppose we will also meet later Mortis the necromancer, Bandaid the healer, Pyro the fire mage, Elsa the frost mage, and Spicy the Maztican foodcart chef.
In any case, you could always change your name to one more suitable to your profession, gunslinger, like Pew-Pew or "Wyatt Earp"; in that case, you´re in.
I sincerely hope it´s not the case with Raphael the cambion when they decided to name him after an archangel. Either their parents are the worst diviners ever or they have some twisted sense of humor.
Anyway, if Wyll has some particularly high wisdom saves and Asterion has a particularly beautiful point behind the ear where the parietal, temporal, and occipital bones meet (https://www.merriam-webster.com/medical/asterion) sorry but I´m out.
"In any case, you could always change your name to one more suitable to your profession, gunslinger, like Pew-Pew or "Wyatt Earp"; in that case, you´re in."
Shoot Gunner? Wait, is Kojima involved somehow? These names feel very Kojima.
That would be amazing.
Matt Mercer´s gunslinger it´s a great fighter subclass (based on the one in PF), but I do not think it´s in the game. Nor firearms, at least we do not have news about it.
I get what you're trying to say here, but I don't think this is an accurate summary of what is occurring here. Nobody is telling anybody their opinions are invalid. All that's being asked is that people stop *repeating* the same grievance that they've expressed since February, when we first learned about this. I don't think it's ridiculous to question why folks think it's productive to air the same grievance on this forum in February, March, April, May, June and July. Are we going to continue to hear this complaint in August too? When can we objectively say enough is enough?
The point is not about having a feeling or thought. It is about *repeatedly* and for months filling a public discussion forum with that same thought.
The point is not about having a feeling or thought. It is about *repeatedly* and for months filling a public discussion forum with that same thought."
This argument works both ways.
All I see here is, "go away, your opinion isn't welcome here."
Also, much of the "repetition" is in response to continued challenge and negative feedback from other posters. I think it would die down if people just let whatever opinion stand without feeling the need to start an argument about it.
Not responding at all to an opinion you disagree with is a valid response, you know.
"No Spam.
Unsolicited advertising, promotional materials, "junk mail", "chain letters", "pyramid schemes", or any other form of solicitation are not allowed.
Posting frequent, annoying, and/or nonsensical posts will not be tolerated. Posting the same message to multiple threads (also known as cross-posting) is also not permitted. This also includes posting multiple threads or comments in short sequence that are about largely the same thing.
." https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/63570/forum-guidelines
I do not say it´s already done in this thread because the staff would have taken care of it, but I will say it´s borderline "spammy" on many occasions and it would be great if we all avoid it.
Annoying to who? Because several of us are just as annoyed by the constant praise as you are by the lack of praise. If this is spam and against site rules, then so is every single post praising Larian and the game.
(You can watch the concerts via streaming)
It would be much worse if she picked that as a chosen name lol