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The Adventurer's Lounge: Guidance and Support for No Reload Challengers- Newbie or Veteran

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Comments

  • EnuhalEnuhal Member Posts: 406
    A decent scroll combo for this battle is greater malison + chaos. The greater doppelgangers have very good saves, so using greater malison first and a spell with automatic save reduction like chaos will be very helpful (though it's far from a guaranteed win). The wand of sleep only has a relatively low chance to affect your foes, but with greater malison, it's a very viable option as well. Note that at least two of the noblemen who turn into doppelgangers can also be charmed via Nymph's Cloak without triggering the event if you're very careful (the ones furthest away from the dukes) - you can send them away before combat and they won't transform, but to actually finish the event, you will later have to rest until the charm effects end, which should allow you to take them out.

    If you want to dispel the haste/MI effects, which is also a very viable strategy (and should be your next step if you first use the scrolls), you should propably make sure you have a pip bows and use arrows of dispelling. They'll do the trick.

    ArctodusStummvonBordwehrJuliusBorisov
  • Wise_GrimwaldWise_Grimwald Member Posts: 1,882
    Does anyone know which movie file is used when you enter the Undercity before the final battle in BG1, and where it is found? (The area before meeting Sarevok) I went through the movies available on the BG1 menu and it isn't there. :(

  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,165
    Has anyone else had trouble with the revised PPing rules from RR (V4.9 I think is what I have been using) after installing SCS? With V31 SCS it seems to have broken that. Miss a PP attempt and everyone goes hostile.
    SCS is installed after RR as suggested from last time I saw the RR compatibility chart.

  • ArctodusArctodus Member Posts: 996
    @Zaghoul For what it’s worth, I always had trouble with this pick pocketing modification : sometimes it was working, other times it didn’t. I’m not sure if it’s anything new. Does it fail all the time now or only sporadically ?

    ZaghoulAerakarBlackraven
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 3,165
    Arctodus said:

    @Zaghoul For what it’s worth, I always had trouble with this pick pocketing modification : sometimes it was working, other times it didn’t. I’m not sure if it’s anything new. Does it fail all the time now or only sporadically ?

    @Arctodus Ouch, I'm gonna miss that. Yup, testing on an old saved game seems to show it as sporadic as you mentioned. I'l just have to make sure I get a high lvl PP before using it in my no-reload run.

    Wise_GrimwaldArctodusAerakar
  • EnuhalEnuhal Member Posts: 406
    edited October 2
    A question regarding SCS: Does anybody know a way to get back into the demi-lich's room in WK level 4 if you send in one character and the character dies with the lich still alive? The game tells me it's still blocked, and it seem like I can neiter get the lost equipment back nor try to kill the demi-lich again.

    Post edited by Enuhal on
    BlackravenJuliusBorisovStummvonBordwehrGotural
  • FlashburnFlashburn Member Posts: 1,549
    For anyone doing runs with LoB mode, do you leave the double damage bonus on or do you turn it off?

  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 10,744
    I don't like extra damage because it seems simplistic, but these days I leave it on. It's the same reason I don't enable to the bonus XP: if you're going to crank up the difficulty to the extreme and unnecessary level of Legacy of Bhaal mode, you may as well go for the absolute maximum.

    EnuhalGrond0JuliusBorisovAerakar
  • StummvonBordwehrStummvonBordwehr Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 424
    edited October 13
    @semiticgod
    Good to have you back - playing BG. Always enjoy your runs.

    Regarding the Liia 2.5 update, I have found she doesnt prebuff. But once attacked, she will try to cast somewhat potent mage defences.

    1) She will begin with at least mirror image,
    2) try to stay out of melee and
    3) spam magic missile which is great against the dopplegangers mirror images.

    Since she cast magic missiles galore, I think its safest not to fire dispelling arrows at the dopplegangers. Instead I use horror * 2, and Ichtyls greater malison in tandem with chaos and confusion. It usually scatters the dopplegangers and give Liia some space and the rest of you can pick the dopplegangers that actually threaten the dukes. Liia’s magic missiler usually takes out all the images of one doppleganger - Liia and Ichtyl together is pure joy.
    It works pretty well in a non Scs installment. Add the priest of helm’s two casting of entangle and you are looking good..

    But a word of caution. Liia doesnt instacast her mirror image. She seems to freeze a short period of time when attacked. So she isnt protected, and if she is interrupted, the dopplegangers will make mince meat out of her (as per pre 2.5 behavior). I succesfully cast invisibility on her in my latest run. Liia broke it by casting mirror image and kicked butt from there (since Belt had died within the first two rounds or so it was needed). She left the whole fight without a scratch.

    In all she is now behaving like the rest of the mages in the unmodded game. If given time and space for casting, they can be deadly and hard to kill. If not - they tend to die fast.

    Post edited by StummvonBordwehr on
    Grond0Wise_GrimwaldJuliusBorisov
  • StummvonBordwehrStummvonBordwehr Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 424
    @semiticgod
    I have moved my answer to your question, so I dont clog the regular thread.

    I have inserted screen shots from the items of interest










    In hindsight the battle tankard should have been swapped with the helmet of Balduran once Caelar was dead - I wouldnt need the restoration scroll from then on. Dont know if the fattigue would come in to question - I believe its only applied when you use the scroll.

    The mordron heart is good against demons and such... I Think. But Belhifet is LE, so I should have used the medal of valor perhaps. I didnt check the alignment of the demons/devils so it may have been a major face palm moment.

    AerakarsemiticgodBlackravenJuliusBorisov
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 3,921
    The battle tankard only provides immunity to fatigue while equipped - so you really need to commit to either using it or not using it.

    StummvonBordwehrsemiticgodWise_GrimwaldJuliusBorisov
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 10,744
    It looks like there's a decently reliable strategy for breaking the Iron Throne fight even in SCS: recruit as many mages and bards as you can (Garrick, Eldoth, Dynaheir/Edwin, Xzar, Xan, Baeloth, and Quayle are all available, as is a dual-classed Imoen), then get some Wands of Fire or Frost, enter the area under Invisibility, and then blast the enemy with wand charges. The collective burst damage should shift the fight decisively in your favor (I had several of them at Near Death and Badly Injured right off the bat), and since you start out invisible, you can strike before the enemy's pre-buffs fire and also position your party to make sure that no party members take damage in the process.

    StummvonBordwehrJuliusBorisov
  • lroumenlroumen Member Posts: 1,611
    edited October 19
    Uhm... Why not just use oils of fiery burning or potions of explosions and keep your original party? That is what I do with several encounters that I find too risky to play normally in a noreload.

    BlackravenFlashburnJuliusBorisovsemiticgod
  • Serg_BlackStriderSerg_BlackStrider Member Posts: 147
    I have never understood the urge of installing SCS with mages'/priests' pre-buffs component 'on' and then trying to find a way ('exploit'/'cheese'/'excuse ', whatever) to eliminate them before those pre-buffs fire...

    lroumenJuliusBorisovAasimMantis37
  • IncasIncas Member Posts: 38
    Did BD change the Greywolf dialogue outcome? I selected "Prism only wants to finish his masterwork..." (like I always do) and he just killed him and ran off with the emeralds and Varscona.

    Blackraven
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 3,921
    @Incas I've noticed that as well. I always used that answer before, but it now appears to be subject to a reaction check, i.e. if you have poor charisma and/or reputation then Greywolf will attack anyway but otherwise he leaves you alone and just takes out Prism. If you want to be sure about triggering a combat you have to use the more aggressive answer in the dialogue.

    BlackravenJuliusBorisovAerakarStummvonBordwehr
  • BlackravenBlackraven Member Posts: 3,120
    edited October 19
    Incas said:

    Did BD change the Greywolf dialogue outcome? I selected "Prism only wants to finish his masterwork..." (like I always do) and he just killed him and ran off with the emeralds and Varscona.

    In my modded install, that dialogue option leads to Greywolf remaining completely passive (and blue-circled), so I now always choose the aggressive option ("armed to the teeth")

    edit: ninja'd by @Grond0

    JuliusBorisovGrond0
  • aldainaldain Member Posts: 227

    It looks like there's a decently reliable strategy for breaking the Iron Throne fight even in SCS: recruit as many mages and bards as you can (Garrick, Eldoth, Dynaheir/Edwin, Xzar, Xan, Baeloth, and Quayle are all available, as is a dual-classed Imoen), then get some Wands of Fire or Frost, enter the area under Invisibility, and then blast the enemy with wand charges. The collective burst damage should shift the fight decisively in your favor (I had several of them at Near Death and Badly Injured right off the bat), and since you start out invisible, you can strike before the enemy's pre-buffs fire and also position your party to make sure that no party members take damage in the process.

    I've got a reliable way to handle it: Have everyone go invisible/sanctuaried and move into the back room. The two Shennaras start hostile while the rest of the group won't go red until you talk to Zhalimar, so they can be pulled and dealt with. Then summon up a bunch of critters (preferably Skeleton Warriors), buff them a bit and send them to take the initial brunt of the attack. They'll soak up the nastiest spells (Chaos, Confusion et al), and if properly buffed are quite likely to kill at least one of the enemies as well.

    For some reason the enemies seem to prefer to go in the side rooms after dealing with your first wave of summons; occasionally one or two will head into the back room, letting you kill them while isolated (have someone with a Wand of Summoning to conjure up some distractions for the rest of the group while you kill the stragglers).

    I've used this tactic for as long as I can remember doing full SCS no-reload, and though there are usually some complications, so far my protagonist has never been in any danger of dying (in fact I can't even remember the last time I lost any party member doing this, though I'm sure there's a record somewhere in the no-reload thread).

    I have never understood the urge of installing SCS with mages'/priests' pre-buffs component 'on' and then trying to find a way ('exploit'/'cheese'/'excuse ', whatever) to eliminate them before those pre-buffs fire...

    I do this to the mercenaries outside the Cloakwood Mine :( I've decided to stop though, as I recently took them on "honourably" and really, they're not that tough: Drasus can be easily tanked with Full Plate Mail and a Potion of Absorption (and has rather crummy AC himself), Genthore is entirely pointless and can be left for last, while Rezdan and Kysus are easily distracted with a Wand of Monster Summoning, of which there are two readily available (Valley of Tombs and second underground level of Durlag's).

    I realize this has little to do with your post, but.. I liked taking them on fairly and wanted to share :)
    Grond0 said:

    @Incas I've noticed that as well. I always used that answer before, but it now appears to be subject to a reaction check, i.e. if you have poor charisma and/or reputation then Greywolf will attack anyway but otherwise he leaves you alone and just takes out Prism. If you want to be sure about triggering a combat you have to use the more aggressive answer in the dialogue.

    I had an interesting outcome when I used Scorcher against Greywolf: He went after my protagonist, I backed away, Prism got caught in the beam and instantly died... and Greywolf just buggered off from the map, taking his sword (but not the emeralds) with him! Anticlimactic, and rather weird, as you'd expect he'd swipe the emeralds.

    Grond0AerakarSerg_BlackStrider
  • IncasIncas Member Posts: 38
    So I played SoD blind with my C9->M and when I recruited Viconia as cleric replacement I let her charm some no name refugee to kill in the woods. (What else to do, to prevent her leaving?)
    And this immediately ended my run with a game kill character, lol. Oh sweet memories of no reload runs ending with Arcanis Gath and Winski Perorath.

    Is it possible to just speed run SoD solo the next time? Anyone done it?

  • IncasIncas Member Posts: 38
    @semiticgod

    The name was Andrus Gath (they have a whole family of game killers it seems) and yes this was Coast Way Crossing.

    Thanks for the detailed description! That sounds like these are pretty difficult encounters.
    Two further questions. Are there rest restrictions? And is there a way to flee from difficult encounters? At least one encounter I had was magically walled.



  • EnuhalEnuhal Member Posts: 406
    edited October 23
    Regarding 3), surrendering Bridgefort will only avoid the battle against the main crusader forces there, the battle to prevent the crusaders from blowing up the bridge still has to be fought.

    As for 4), maze can also simply be avoided via chaotic commands. Generally, with level 5 cleric slots being limited, it is recommended to buy up all of the many CC scrolls available in SoD - keeping that buff active will prevent many dangerous situations.

    Resting restrictions aren't really present in SoD all that much, not even in Avernus. You will get interrupted by monsters while resting quite often, but this can be easily avoided by casting invisibility on yourself before going to rest and then running away to try again a screen away.

    I can't give you a lot of gameplay tips, as I've always relied a lot on physical damage when soloing SoD (having done so twice with ranger/clerics and once with a dwarven defender), so I'm not familiar enough with the opponents spell resistances and protections to be of much help. Let's just say that for most battles, the wand of fire is your best friend - and if it doesn't do anything, you're propably in for a long and difficult fight. @semiticgod has already given some great general advice regarding important buffs and strategies, though.

    Post edited by Enuhal on
    BlackravenJuliusBorisovsemiticgodStummvonBordwehr
  • FlashburnFlashburn Member Posts: 1,549
    For #2, you can just wait out the fight until Caelar appears. You don't have to beat the crusaders. Quite often, she appears before I get the chance to kill one of them.

    For #3, killing the Fire Elemental that the mage summons at the bridge is enough to win that fight. The mage will turn neutral and run away if this happens.

    StummvonBordwehrsemiticgodJuliusBorisov
  • IncasIncas Member Posts: 38

    @Incas: Andrus is a key NPC later in the game, so I'm guessing she's there to prevent you from killing people on the side of the coalition or some such. I'm surprised that applies to a refugee out in the woods, though--I'd have guessed only plot-critical characters like Bence Duncan would warrant that.

    I had a look into the game code and the related global variable will be set by killing a lot of NPCs. Refugees, militia, neutral soldiers, mercenaries and a handful named ones.
    (I wonder why Andrus doesn't show up when you kill Mizhena, she too has the class script that sets the global variable.)

    This lazy scripting practice really makes me not want to play SoD in no reload.

  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 10,744
    I think you'll just have to avoid killing characters with blue circles. From an RP and realism perspective, it makes sense. If you're part of a military campaign, the higher-ups wouldn't want their soldiers to go around killing non-combatants.

    StummvonBordwehr
  • IncasIncas Member Posts: 38
    From an RP perspective I would ask why a 18th level conjurer does not solve the campaign on his own. And how is she even seeing things in middle of the wood with divination as forbidden school? :D

    semiticgod
  • FlashburnFlashburn Member Posts: 1,549
    I'm considering a full re-install of both EEs for my next run, but sticking with v2.3 because v2.5 is of an unacceptable quality to me. How does SCS interact with SoD? I've never used SCS for BGEE because I thought all kinds of things could go wrong installation-wise with SoD being present.

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