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What is known?

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  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058
    What's the deal with the new kits?

    First we see them mentioned in the article.

    Second we see
    bengoshi said:

    I've updated @elminster‌ 's "What's known" post with the information from the latest interview and the pdf IWDEE manual. All the new information comes in italic.

    Cheers!

    Great job! Some new kits is cool at least but then again I've barely played the current cleric kits due to power gaming bias.

    kcwise
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 19,353
    edited October 2014
    Wowo said:

    What's the deal with the new kits?

    PRIEST OF TYR: Tyr is the deity of law and justice and is primarily concerned with the punishment of wrongdoers and the general furthering of law and good in the world. The belief in justice through (benevolent) force, or at least armed vigilance, is the reason for Tyr’s existence. Tyr holds great prominence in the pantheon due to his position as leader of the Triad, a trio of lawful good gods that are collectively devoted to the concepts of courage, justice, perseverance, relief of suffering, duty, obedience, honor, and to some extent, righteous martyrdom.

    Advantages:
    – May cast Exaltation once per day every 5 levels of the caster (starts at 1st level with one use).

    EXALTATION: This spell enables a priest to aid and protect any one being other than themselves. By touch, the caster removes the effects of fear, sleep, feeblemindedness, unconsciousness, and intoxication, as well as berserk and confused states of mind. In addition, the recipient is protected against spells and other attacks that cause these effects for 1 turn.

    – May cast Divine Favor once per day every 10 levels of the caster (starts at 1st level with one use).

    DIVINE FAVOR: This spell grants the caster a +1 bonus to hit and damage rolls every 3 levels of the caster. The spell lasts for 2 rounds.

    Disadvantages:
    – Alignment restricted to lawful good, neutral good, or lawful neutral.

    From here: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/comment/468876/#Comment_468876

    and PRIEST OF TEMPUS:

    image

    Disadvantages:
    – Alignment restricted to true neutral plus all chaotic alignments

    from the manual here: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/36083/iwd-ee-pre-load-starts-tomorrow#latest and http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/comment/564847/#Comment_564847

    Actually, the cleric of Tempus sounds quite promising in particular and I think I'll try it in my first IWDEE run

    Also, according to the latest interview, "given the importance of the Lord of Battles to the storyline and setting it's a natural fit, and we've also made some subtle but important content changes for players who wish to play Battleguards.

    Post edited by JuliusBorisov on
    kcwiseelminsterNonnahswriterlolien
  • JonelethIrenicusJonelethIrenicus Member Posts: 157
    Is there any significant difference in playing evil/good like BG where the xp favored good plays?

    kcwise
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 19,353
    @JonelethIrenicus‌

    From the OP here: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/34743/iwd-ee-reputation-system#latest it follows that in vanilla IWD the reputation was not displayed at all, and in IWD with the 'IWD in BG2 engine' mod the reputation is displayed but doesn't change. I guess it will be the same in IWDEE.

    It remains to be seen, though, whether among the new items are those that alignment-specific.

    Also, according to the known facts, there will be difference in terms of cleric spells based on their alignment: higher level evil clerics won't get healing spells but in the same time they will get access to Slay Living and Destruction.

    JonelethIrenicuskcwiselolien
  • ifupaulineifupauline Member Posts: 405
    ho no an other priest kit "fighter wannabe" :/ i am deceived really, honestly I think a kit should provide as much as new role play experience than game play experience.

    I am a cleric fan, and the reason I almost never play them as single class is because there is no special feeling playing them as single class on a game-play aspect, unlike Avenger, Wild Mage or Assassin, those are kits that give me special vibes.

    Keep in mind that clerics aren't at their best because of their level 7 spells and you don't need a lot of slots for that, so it is already one good reason not to play them as single class.

    holy power? for real? All clerics can do that :/ What are we gonna do with that? save one slot?

    Why can't a kit provide an unique level 7 spells? natural resist? special summoning? maybe a spe in fire/cold/acid/lightning?. There is many ways to render a kit special by providing unique abilities (gameplay).

    All those cleric kits combined would still get wrecked by a berse/cleric, as for the tanking ability of a single cleric class, it is still no way near decency from a fighter perspective. so why persisting in those tanking abilities? Priest of Helm that's it we don't need more for that.

    I know plenty of people will disagree with me but my logic is, if you want to tank with a cleric then don't single class them.

    Anyway... at the end I am convinved that there will be much more positive things to say about iwd ee than negative things it's just that my previous cleric still exist only in my dream.... snif snif...

    Frogmanelminsterswit
  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 2,286
    you can make a dual class at, say, level 6 and have holy power and some other self-boosting spells for the cost of some hp. pretty strong.

    i wonder what is the casting time for the special-ability holy power. maybe it's faster.

    RAM021
  • OlvynChuruOlvynChuru Member Posts: 2,353

    Keep in mind that clerics aren't at their best because of their level 7 spells and you don't need a lot of slots for that, so it is already one good reason not to play them as single class.

    In IWD, clerics have the level 7 spell Symbol of Hopelessness, which is bar none the most overpowered spell in the entire game. Even Mirror Image and Stoneskin are nothing in comparison.

    All those cleric kits combined would still get wrecked by a berse/cleric, as for the tanking ability of a single cleric class, it is still no way near decency from a fighter perspective. so why persisting in those tanking abilities? Priest of Helm that's it we don't need more for that.

    Well of course the multiclasses and dualclasses are overpowered; we've known that for a long, long time. Although I don't approve of this unbalance, it is nigh impossible to fix without drastically altering the rules of the game.

    Also, another thing. This new Battleguard of Tempus kit is more than just a wannabe fighter. Its second ability affects everybody; it's not just another self buff. It also keeps getting better, so it would be fun to use as a level 30 cleric.

    One last note. It is very important for each class to at least give the impression of having a point.These clerics can cast spells but aren't as good in combat as fighters, while the fighters can't cast spells but are great in combat. What would be the point of having a fighter if this new cleric was just as good at fighting as a fighter, except with the ability to cast spells?

    elminster
  • ifupaulineifupauline Member Posts: 405
    edited October 2014

    One last note. It is very important for each class to at least give the impression of having a point.

    Well in this case priest kits don't even give the impression of having a point :/

    If I choose to multi or dual a druid, I will lose plenty of relevant abilities that I can get only if I single class them. While a priest... What do I lose really that is so bad? I don't care about a +1 damage +1 extra attack per round or a temporary better tacho. Those innate abilities are simply not good enough to make those kits worth playing aside of a role-play.

    I hope I am not the only one having those thoughts of those priest kits.

  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 2,286
    edited October 2014
    you will have faster spell progression, will be able to cast more spells and use those abilities at a greater degree of power. it's not bad.

    RAM021
  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058

    One last note. It is very important for each class to at least give the impression of having a point.

    Well in this case priest kits don't even give the impression of having a point :/

    If I choose to multi or dual a druid, I will lose plenty of relevant abilities that I can get only if I single class them. While a priest... What do I lose really that is so bad? I don't care about a +1 damage +1 extra attack per round or a temporary better tacho. Those innate abilities are simply not good enough to make those kits worth playing aside of a role-play.

    I hope I am not the only one having those thoughts of those priest kits.

    I agree. A single class cleric in all my experience of IE games is useless compared to a multi.

    However, I have read that a single clerics Turn Undead ability can be quite powerful in IWD so that is one thing to consider at least.

    Klorox
  • JonelethIrenicusJonelethIrenicus Member Posts: 157
    bengoshi said:



    - Reputation (this will be interesting to @JonelethIrenicus‌ and @Blackraven‌ )

    In IWDEE your reputation will be reduced if you kill an innocent NPC. Your reputation may let you benefit from additional store discounts, in addition to the discount bestowed by a high Charisma. If you are a villain known for your low reputation, you may find yourself paying higher prices for your equipment. Also, you can raise your reputation by donating to temples: the amount of gold that must be donated to raise the party’s reputation one point is connected to the current reputation level.

    Great news man. My plan is to have both good and evil characters in the party

    JuliusBorisovkcwiseBlackravenjackjack
  • JonelethIrenicusJonelethIrenicus Member Posts: 157
    Another question, will the sorcerer benefit from high charisma?

    kcwise
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 19,353

    Another question, will the sorcerer benefit from high charisma?

    Just as any other character: high CHA means better prices. Don't forget about using the Friends spell (from a scroll) when you want to buy something big and expensive.

    Also, party's morale is positively influenced by having a leader (the topmost character in the portraits) with high CHA, by the environment in which the character is located (for example, kobolds and drow like being underground more than outside spaces), by some spells (for example, Remove Fear), and by the type of enemies that are visible (easy enemies will raise morale). Which character to choose as a leader, you decide.

    Other than that, there're no benefits from CHA.

    JonelethIrenicuskcwisekaguanalolien
  • JonelethIrenicusJonelethIrenicus Member Posts: 157
    bengoshi said:

    Another question, will the sorcerer benefit from high charisma?

    Just as any other character: high CHA means better prices. Don't forget about using the Friends spell (from a scroll) when you want to buy something big and expensive.

    Also, party's morale is positively influenced by having a leader (the topmost character in the portraits) with high CHA, by the environment in which the character is located (for example, kobolds and drow like being underground more than outside spaces), by some spells (for example, Remove Fear), and by the type of enemies that are visible (easy enemies will raise morale). Which character to choose as a leader, you decide.

    Other than that, there're no benefits from CHA.
    I see, thought they used charisma for the sorcerer spells. Might be in 3e and/or IWD2. Also can you play drow? Are you kidding me that's awesome

    kcwiseBlackraven
  • kcwisekcwise Member Posts: 2,287
    edited October 2014
    bengoshi said:

    In IWDEE your reputation will be reduced if you kill an innocent NPC. Your reputation may let you benefit from additional store discounts, in addition to the discount bestowed by a high Charisma. If you are a villain known for your low reputation, you may find yourself paying higher prices for your equipment. Also, you can raise your reputation by donating to temples: the amount of gold that must be donated to raise the party’s reputation one point is connected to the current reputation level.

    I predict pitchforks and torches are being gathered as we speak...

    JuliusBorisovJonelethIrenicus
  • BlackravenBlackraven Member Posts: 3,235
    edited October 2014
    Thanks @bengoshi for the information!
    bengoshi said:

    Just a heads up based on the manual and new forum posts by the Devs:
    - characters are capped at level 30. The 8 million XP limit is per class, not per character. Meaning that a level 30/30/30 multi-classed Fighter/Mage/Thief is possible, just like it was in the original game. You would need around 24 million XP for that though, which isn't that easy to reach, even with Heart of Fury mode, unless you're playing solo.

    This is pretty interesting. Not sure yet what to make of it, except that F/M/T and F/M/C will be the solo classes it seems.

    jackjackJuliusBorisov
  • DreadKhanDreadKhan Member Posts: 3,859
    Sergio said:

    Why would a villain pay more? That part never made any sense. A customer is always a customer. If I was a villain and I knew you would make a worse price to me just because of my reputation, I would butcher you.

    If macchiavelli taught us anything, is that fear is better than being loved.

    Most people would be cool with undercharging someone famous (ie great athelete, rockstar, etc), and cool with refusing service to known murderers, if only due to concerns about aiding a criminal.

    Macchiavelli was a pretty satirical writer you know, right? He was pointing out ****ed up government in Italy was then.

  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 2,286
    machiavelli was actually dead serious and completely right. he wasn't however cynical the way he is portrayed, just realistic.

    also, refusing service because you don't like someone doesn't relate to charging higher prices. this is only logical if you rent something or take a loan. not if you buy something.

  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 15,958
    edited October 2014
    kensai said:

    So, what I discovered after an hour of gaming
    - paladins and rangers descriptions states that they can cast divine spells from 6 level. But characters created in HOW only had 1 spell slot at 1lvl. I can suppose that they don't receive spellcasting at 6 level. Bug?

    HoW Rangers in IWDEE would start at level 9. At that level they only get a single level 1 spell. No different than at level 6. Next level they will get a level 2 spell.

    The following is the rangers progression table MXSPLRAN.2DA (the spell progression table for rangers) taken from a GoG.com install of the original IWD (meaning it has HoW installed).

    Level Spell Levels
    1 2 3 4 5 6
    6 1 0 0 0 0 0
    7 1 0 0 0 0 0
    8 1 0 0 0 0 0
    9 1 0 0 0 0 0
    10 1 1 0 0 0 0
    11 1 1 0 0 0 0
    12 1 1 1 0 0 0
    13 1 1 1 0 0 0
    14 2 1 1 0 0 0
    15 2 1 1 1 0 0
    16 2 2 1 1 0 0
    17 2 2 2 1 0 0
    18 3 2 2 1 0 0
    19 3 3 3 2 0 0
    20 3 3 3 3 0 0
    21 4 3 3 3 0 0
    22 4 3 3 3 1 0
    23 4 4 3 3 1 0
    24 4 4 4 3 1 0
    25 4 4 4 4 1 0
    26 4 4 4 4 2 0
    27 5 4 4 4 2 0
    28 5 5 4 4 2 0
    29 5 5 5 4 2 1
    30 5 5 5 5 3 1
    In BG2 at that level 9 you would normally have two castings for level 1 spells, but as you can see spell progression works differently in Icewind Dale (it also works differently than BG2 when it comes to paladins).
    - ranger\cleric is now fixed, and receive druidic spells only then ranger gains 9th level. He is now weaker than fighter\mage and a little munckin cries inside of me
    Its working as it did in the original Icewind Dale. If you want it to be treated as it was in BG2 then go into baldur.ini in documents/icewind dale enhanced edition and change the Cleric Ranger Spells line to have a 0 value instead of a 1. Check out this post for more info.

    http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/36188/neat-little-option-that-cleric-rangers-players-might-be-interested-in-knowing

    Also Iron Skins now has a casting time of 1. So they are even better when you do this since they can protect themselves from physical damage with it (and replenish it in the middle of battle), protect themselves from hold effects with Free Action, and protection themselves from mental effects with Chaotic Commands.
    Katana's has a very poor variety - +1\+2\+3 and only two named katanas. That's sad, I don't recommend katanas to duald wielders.
    Its possible some special katana's were added to the game. I don't recall.

    NonnahswriterkcwisekensaiRAM021
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    You wouldn't expect to see many katanas in IWD. There is a specific warning about choosing "foreign" weapons in the manual.

    elminsterkcwise
  • billygreatbillygreat Member Posts: 66
    Check this baby Solemn Duty +3 :

    Not much is known about this katana; its true origin has been lost to time. The edge of the blade has been sharpened to perfection, giving the wielder a chance to slay an opponent with a single blow, unless they can somehow survive the sudden loss of their head. Markings engraved upon the hilt suggest that the sword is especially potent when used against creatures from the outer planes, while protective enchantments keep the wielder's mind clear of doubt and focus will. Who originally commissioned the creation of this weapon, or why, remains a mystery. Two words are etched into the blade itself: "Solemn Duty."

    STATISTICS:

    Equipped abilities:
    – Immunity to confusion

    Combat abilities:
    – 3% chance of decapitating an opponent on each hit

    THAC0: +3, +5 vs. outer planar creatures
    Damage: 1d10+3, +2 magic damage vs. outer planar creatures
    Damage Type: Slashing
    Speed Factor: 1
    Proficiency Type: Katana
    Type: One-handed
    Requires:
    6 Strength

    Weight: 3

    kcwise
  • kensaikensai Member Posts: 228
    edited November 2014

    Check this baby Solemn Duty +3 :

    Yep that's second of two named katanas in game. While this vorpal effect seems good, but a percentage seems really small to me.
    IMHO katana +2 with +5% to critical is better, if you single wield it - then it would be +10%, IF THEY DOES STACK! (I don't know that now)
    elminster said:

    kensai said:

    So, what I discovered after an hour of gaming
    - paladins and rangers descriptions states that they can cast divine spells from 6 level. But characters created in HOW only had 1 spell slot at 1lvl. I can suppose that they don't receive spellcasting at 6 level. Bug?

    HoW Rangers in IWDEE would start at level 9. At that level they only get a single level 1 spell. No different than at level 6. Next level they will get a level 2 spell.
    Guess it's my mistake then :(
    elminster said:

    kensai said:


    - ranger\cleric is now fixed, and receive druidic spells only then ranger gains 9th level. He is now weaker than fighter\mage and a little munckin cries inside of me
    Its working as it did in the original Icewind Dale. If you want it to be treated as it was in BG2 then go into baldur.ini in documents/icewind dale enhanced edition and change the Cleric Ranger Spells line to have a 0 value instead of a 1. Check out this post for more info.
    Wow, suddenly it becomes such a difficult choice to me, worthy of Hamlet's "to be or not to be" O_o
    But thanks for the information!

    elminster
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