@brus while I sympathize with your love for Irenicus (he is a villain with a LEGENDARY presence) I don't think it is feasible or even desirable to include him in the Siege of Dragonspear plot in a major way. As a background figure at the end I think it would be a nice touch, but something more substantial might be a bit too much.
Well, I can easily imagine vampires, golems and his accomplices plotting from elves forest. But, it just came to me that this probably won't happen from technical standpoint. Namely, original Irenicus voiceactor probably is not avaiable or his voice has changed a bit after 15 years.
@brus while I sympathize with your love for Irenicus (he is a villain with a LEGENDARY presence) I don't think it is feasible or even desirable to include him in the Siege of Dragonspear plot in a major way. As a background figure at the end I think it would be a nice touch, but something more substantial might be a bit too much.
Well, I can easily imagine vampires, golems and his accomplices plotting from elves forest. But, it just came to me that this probably won't happen from technical standpoint. Namely, original Irenicus voiceactor probably is not avaiable or his voice has changed a bit after 15 years.
The original voice actor has already been confirmed to be coming back, so at the very least he has one new line
I really like the new journal pop-ups when you receive a quest. Reminds me of Pillars of Eternity.
It really is amazing if you go back and look at the original Baldur's Gate, or any other older RPG (Morrowind is a particular example) how far the informational design of quest tracking has come.
Hell, back in the day quests might not even be distinctly sorted from worldbuilding fluff....
I really like the new journal pop-ups when you receive a quest. Reminds me of Pillars of Eternity.
It really is amazing if you go back and look at the original Baldur's Gate, or any other older RPG (Morrowind is a particular example) how far the informational design of quest tracking has come.
Hell, back in the day quests might not even be distinctly sorted from worldbuilding fluff....
Honestly? I am of the complete opposite opinion - Morrowind was perfect once they added the quest index to the journal (first expansion?). Baldur's Gate was and is fine, just the sorting of side quests by chapter in which you received them was bothersome.
I don't like pop-ups since they take you out of the game and break the fourth wall. Also, usually they are just a summary of the dialogue you had anyway.
A subtle indication that the journal has been updated is much better. Updated my journal, anyone? Or the scribbling sound in Morrowind.
Don't even let me get started on quest compass and arrows. People usually tell you to just turn them off, but if they are there the entire game is usually designed around it. For example, quest givers won't even bother to give you general directions. The radiant quests in Skyrim are the worst offender here.
Pop-ups is the first feature I will disable. If we can't it would be a reason not to buy the game. As it is, I am sad that the designers spent their valuable time on features like this and the UI "improvement".
Just look at for example, the investigative quests in BG 2, such as the Bridge District murder quest and the Skindancer follow-up in Trade-Meet. Very dialogue heavy, many NPCs in a short time. Getting a pop-up all the time (possibly even telling you what to do next?) takes you out of the game and makes you feel like someone thinks they need to hold your hands.
I don't like pop-ups since they take you out of the game and break the fourth wall. Also, usually they are just a summary of the dialogue you had anyway.
exactly. without them the journal really feels like a notebook where your character writes stuff, and with them it feels like a guy floating over your head telling you what you should do next
It's obvious the developers can't please everyone. A lot of people like it "old-school", and not less people like it "PoE-style" in terms of quest pop-ups.
It really is amazing if you go back and look at the original Baldur's Gate, or any other older RPG (Morrowind is a particular example) how far the informational design of quest tracking has come.
I can appreciate the convenience of the modern CRPG journal, but the way it was handled back in the day had a sort of realism to it that I think is lost nowadays. Like a lot of areas of gameplay, the player had to keep their own stuff in order or risk blindly stumbling around in the dark.
Me being a cranky old curmudgeon (trapped in a somewhat younger body), I prefer the old school in this case. There's some romanticism in not being handed convenient packets of information that I could also look for myself. It makes me feel like the game respects me enough not to hold my hand through every obstacle.
Plus having to find my way instead of constantly being pointed in the direction of the next plot point makes the game seem less linear.
Hell, back in the day quests might not even be distinctly sorted from worldbuilding fluff....
Hate to say it again, but I liked it that way. You mentioned Morrowind which I think was excellent in this regard. The lore I read in books and conversations always felt like it might have some practical use for my character, because sometimes it did. It helps immersion when I feel as if I'm a part of the game world, having to pay attention to stuff and do my own research, instead of being an outside onlooker who is always kept perfectly informed through the various HUD elements that keep popping out to tell me in simple English what I've just read in the game.
Okay. Let me attempt to direct this aimlessly and violently flailing rant back to the topic at hand. To conclude, I hope the new journal popups in SoD (and the EEs in general) will be optional, otherwise I think they could be intrusive to those of us with giant sticks up our butts.
Edit: Triple ninja'd. I should probably try to write shorter rants from now on.
Optional is good, but I think people underestimate the interaction between UI and general game design. For example, with the popups.
Are they going to contain the same text as the journal? Then the journal text needs to be brief and concise enough to fit into the popup and be read in a short amount of time. This would clash with the current style.
Or is it another text? Then it means more work for the writer and less time for other things. It would also mean that the same information has to be maintained and synced in three independent text blocks: journal, dialogue and popup. More potential for discrepancies errors.
The point I am trying to make: these features tend to affect even those of us who turn them off. In most games with popups the affect the design on a fundamental level.
Can it be be done right? Probably. But I wonder if it worth the risk and the cost given that most customers are already familiar and comfortable with the existing UI. I can't really see it attract many new customers.
I think that UI popups are convenient but without them we could still cherish the game. What is neccesary and important that they reimplement spell UI. Everyone who was playing with mage/cleric on higher levels and tried to find desired spell in spell toolbar knows how tedius this can be.
Optional is good, but I think people underestimate the interaction between UI and general game design. For example, with the popups.
Are they going to contain the same text as the journal? Then the journal text needs to be brief and concise enough to fit into the popup and be read in a short amount of time. This would clash with the current style.
Or is it another text? Then it means more work for the writer and less time for other things. It would also mean that the same information has to be maintained and synced in three independent text blocks: journal, dialogue and popup. More potential for discrepancies errors.
The point I am trying to make: these features tend to affect even those of us who turn them off. In most games with popups the affect the design on a fundamental level.
Can it be be done right? Probably. But I wonder if it worth the risk and the cost given that most customers are already familiar and comfortable with the existing UI. I can't really see it attract many new customers.
What if the popup only contain the title of the quest? That would not require any more to be written and would still tell you what part of your journal to check for more information.
What if the popup only contain the title of the quest? That would not require any more to be written and would still tell you what part of your journal to check for more information.
I think it can be a solution for the concerns @Ammar has voiced.
The thing is, from the screenshot we know, it's unclear, if "I must choose a unit and defeat the wizards" is the title or the description of the quest (it's not even a quest, it's an important event, so basically that phrase could duplicate the whole journal enty as it is, maybe in this particular case it didn't need to have more words in it).
After Adventure Y we have some more projects in the works that use a more modern engine.
Which one?
I'd say it's a pretty safe bet to guess Unity 5. They mentioned some while back about looking into using the Pillars of Eternity engine for future projects.
It's obvious the developers can't please everyone. A lot of people like it "old-school", and not less people like it "PoE-style" in terms of quest pop-ups.
The same situation is with Health bars.
This is why they're toggleable options.
What about those who want REALLY old school? Will there be sheets of graph paper in the box?
Health bars above characters? We already have health bars on the portraits... and colouration of health numbers on portraits. How much superfluous information do you need..........
why do the health bars have five segments when the mouse over information so far has only revealed four degrees of injury: barely injured (<=1/1hp), injured (<=3/4hp), badly injured (<=1/2hp) and near death (<=1/4hp)?
why do the health bars have five segments when the mouse over information so far has only revealed four degrees of injury: barely injured (<=1/1hp), injured (<=3/4hp), badly injured (<=1/2hp) and near death (<=1/4hp)?</p>
why do the health bars have five segments when the mouse over information so far has only revealed four degrees of injury: barely injured (<=1/1hp), injured (<=3/4hp), badly injured (<=1/2hp) and near death (<=1/4hp)?</p>
(roughly)
5/5 = Full Health 4/5 = Barely Injured 3/5 = Injured 2/5 = Badly Injured 1/5 = Near Death
Judging from the previous changes they've made, I'm pretty sure alot of these new UI improvments were made with tablet users in mind, ie. floating health bars to quickly get an overview of the battle at hand.
what devs are doing is indeed cruel, when they were making announcement i thought that game will be in maximum 2 months, i was naive, but they were making this feeling that the game release is so close, and they were talking that after they will give more details, i was lied to !!
Comments
So, they're still adding to SoD.
Hell, back in the day quests might not even be distinctly sorted from worldbuilding fluff....
I don't like pop-ups since they take you out of the game and break the fourth wall. Also, usually they are just a summary of the dialogue you had anyway.
A subtle indication that the journal has been updated is much better. Updated my journal, anyone? Or the scribbling sound in Morrowind.
Don't even let me get started on quest compass and arrows. People usually tell you to just turn them off, but if they are there the entire game is usually designed around it. For example, quest givers won't even bother to give you general directions. The radiant quests in Skyrim are the worst offender here.
Pop-ups is the first feature I will disable. If we can't it would be a reason not to buy the game. As it is, I am sad that the designers spent their valuable time on features like this and the UI "improvement".
Just look at for example, the investigative quests in BG 2, such as the Bridge District murder quest and the Skindancer follow-up in Trade-Meet. Very dialogue heavy, many NPCs in a short time. Getting a pop-up all the time (possibly even telling you what to do next?) takes you out of the game and makes you feel like someone thinks they need to hold your hands.
The same situation is with Health bars.
This is why they're toggleable options.
Me being a cranky old curmudgeon (trapped in a somewhat younger body), I prefer the old school in this case. There's some romanticism in not being handed convenient packets of information that I could also look for myself. It makes me feel like the game respects me enough not to hold my hand through every obstacle.
Plus having to find my way instead of constantly being pointed in the direction of the next plot point makes the game seem less linear. Hate to say it again, but I liked it that way. You mentioned Morrowind which I think was excellent in this regard. The lore I read in books and conversations always felt like it might have some practical use for my character, because sometimes it did. It helps immersion when I feel as if I'm a part of the game world, having to pay attention to stuff and do my own research, instead of being an outside onlooker who is always kept perfectly informed through the various HUD elements that keep popping out to tell me in simple English what I've just read in the game.
Okay. Let me attempt to direct this aimlessly and violently flailing rant back to the topic at hand. To conclude, I hope the new journal popups in SoD (and the EEs in general) will be optional, otherwise I think they could be intrusive to those of us with giant sticks up our butts.
Edit: Triple ninja'd. I should probably try to write shorter rants from now on.
Are they going to contain the same text as the journal? Then the journal text needs to be brief and concise enough to fit into the popup and be read in a short amount of time. This would clash with the current style.
Or is it another text? Then it means more work for the writer and less time for other things. It would also mean that the same information has to be maintained and synced in three independent text blocks: journal, dialogue and popup. More potential for discrepancies errors.
The point I am trying to make: these features tend to affect even those of us who turn them off. In most games with popups the affect the design on a fundamental level.
Can it be be done right? Probably. But I wonder if it worth the risk and the cost given that most customers are already familiar and comfortable with the existing UI. I can't really see it attract many new customers.
The thing is, from the screenshot we know, it's unclear, if "I must choose a unit and defeat the wizards" is the title or the description of the quest (it's not even a quest, it's an important event, so basically that phrase could duplicate the whole journal enty as it is, maybe in this particular case it didn't need to have more words in it).
5/5 = Full Health
4/5 = Barely Injured
3/5 = Injured
2/5 = Badly Injured
1/5 = Near Death
(< is idiot)
edit: since we talked about UI, there's a UI improvement i'd really like - the bestiary