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Elder Scrolls : The dumbing down

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  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2016

    Thing with most of NwN's premium modules is that they can't be legally bought anymore. Not to mention the fact that their official servers died years ago, making them without online authentication unplayable. There are ways around these severe issues but... yeah, basically it's the end of the line for them. Of course, none of the premium modules are compatible with any kind of mods as well. Being encrypted and all. One can only hope that if there's ever an NwN:EE, it will come with all premium modules intact in a playable state. Unlike Neverwinter Nights Diamond Edition. >_>

    But enough talk of that game. D&D has not exactly the greatest relevance to the TES franchise. Well, with the exception of Drow and Tiefling custom races for Skyrim and Oblivion. But that in itself is a different subject entirely. :p

    Apropos races, are there any other races other than the ten base ones folks like to play as in TES? Personally, I'd love to see the slug-like Sloads making an appearance. Given their natural talents in Necromancy and great cities below the ocean waves.

    I have installers for Darkness over Daggerford, Infinite Dungeons, Pirates of the Sword Coast and Wyvern Crown of Cormyr and they all work perfectly with the GOG version. I'm not sure what kind of legal issues exist or not since no one sells them, though I have to seriously doubt anyone is going to much care if you download them if you have purchased the GOG version legally. Since I found the links on the GOG community forum, I haven't thought too much of it.
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    I never played NWN but I loved downloading mods for it. I'm sad that Neverwinter Vault never came back.
  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 2,666
    never came back huh

    https://neverwintervault.org/
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    @megamike15: Cool!

    When did that happen? I heard the site was gone just a year ago.
  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 2,666
    they backed up everything when the old one went down.
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    I just downloaded a gigabyte of portraits and I've barely scratched the surface.
  • VallmyrVallmyr Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 2,459

    Thing with most of NwN's premium modules is that they can't be legally bought anymore. Not to mention the fact that their official servers died years ago, making them without online authentication unplayable. There are ways around these severe issues but... yeah, basically it's the end of the line for them. Of course, none of the premium modules are compatible with any kind of mods as well. Being encrypted and all. One can only hope that if there's ever an NwN:EE, it will come with all premium modules intact in a playable state. Unlike Neverwinter Nights Diamond Edition. >_>

    But enough talk of that game. D&D has not exactly the greatest relevance to the TES franchise. Well, with the exception of Drow and Tiefling custom races for Skyrim and Oblivion. But that in itself is a different subject entirely. :p

    Apropos races, are there any other races other than the ten base ones folks like to play as in TES? Personally, I'd love to see the slug-like Sloads making an appearance. Given their natural talents in Necromancy and great cities below the ocean waves.

    I want Lilmothiit, the fox people of the Black Marsh, to not be extinct. It's said they *might* still be alive on a boat somewhere or something. In Morrowind I use the Keynari race mod to RP as them and then the Fennec race mod for Skyrim. I haven't found a decent Oblivion race mod to use for the Lilmothiit yet, though.
  • VallmyrVallmyr Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 2,459
    Also on NWN, I recommend https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwn1/hakpak/original-hakpak/player-resource-consortiums-prc-pack-v35

    Followed by

    https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwn1/other/tool/prc-character-creator-18-linux-and-mac-compatible

    It contains like every 3.0/3.5 race, class, and prestige class. A few are missing but this has A LOT.
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    I think theres a Ravenloft mod for NwN.
  • GodGod Member Posts: 1,150

    they backed up everything when the old one went down.

    Unfortunately, not everything :neutral:
    I for one didn't re-upload my NWN creations to the new Vault, as I simply no longer have them, and I suspect there are many more cases like that.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    Pfft, some @God you are
  • GodGod Member Posts: 1,150

    Pfft, some @God you are


    :smirk:
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    Vallmyr said:

    Also on NWN, I recommend https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwn1/hakpak/original-hakpak/player-resource-consortiums-prc-pack-v35

    Followed by

    https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwn1/other/tool/prc-character-creator-18-linux-and-mac-compatible

    It contains like every 3.0/3.5 race, class, and prestige class. A few are missing but this has A LOT.

    Why SC Legends couldn't bè like this?
  • scriverscriver Member Posts: 2,072
    Because it takes a lot of time to develop.

    (Which is also why I suspect the people who think Beamdog's possible-presumably-5th Ed-future-rpg will feature all the core race and class options (before expansions and DLC) are setting themselves up for disappointment. Unfortunately.)
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    edited December 2016
    And the developers of SCL have gone bust before they could implemented anything that massive post-release. But that was mainly because gamers wanted another Neverwinter Nights, while N_Space had wanted to create something entirely different. Expectations were simply not met.
    Vallmyr said:


    I want Lilmothiit, the fox people of the Black Marsh, to not be extinct. It's said they *might* still be alive on a boat somewhere or something. In Morrowind I use the Keynari race mod to RP as them and then the Fennec race mod for Skyrim. I haven't found a decent Oblivion race mod to use for the Lilmothiit yet, though.

    Chances are that if TES:VI will take place in Black Marsh, renmants of the Lilmothiit (or at least their descendants) will be encountered by the player. After all it was said that the Snow Elves/Falmer were also extinct when Morrowind's Bloodmoon add-on was first released in 2003.
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428

    And the developers of SCL have gone bust before they could implemented anything that massive post-release. But that was mainly because gamers wanted another Neverwinter Nights, while N_Space had wanted to create something entirely different. Expectations were simply not met.

    Nice, Argonians are my favourite race.

    #Reptilesrule




  • scriverscriver Member Posts: 2,072
    Falmer would've been better off staying dead than the awful treatment they got in Skyrim. They destroyed an opportunity to have something cool or fresh or even just another race of people in favour of creating another flat, uninteresting, always-hostile-no-noncombat-interaction monster race. Particularly since the entire design and concept was stolen directly from a movie series about a bunch of cave dwelling monsters descended from humans: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEjyuyUv5EE
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    Oh, I wouldn't go that far. The idea itself of having the Falmer survive from extinction in some form was interesting to me at least. It also gave insights of how the Dwemer lived and their way of thinking. The hypothesis that Wispmothers are in fact the spectres of female Snow Elves also gets my approval.

    What I didn't like about the degenerated Falmers, however, was that Bethesda made them into Skyrim's Goblins. They even share the same sounds, animations and size as Oblivion's green-skinned cave dwellers. Which admittingly feels rather lazy and inappropriate. At least they did better with the Rieklings, which are also speculated as being descendants of the original Snow Elves.
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    scriver said:

    Falmer would've been better off staying dead than the awful treatment they got in Skyrim. They destroyed an opportunity to have something cool or fresh or even just another race of people in favour of creating another flat, uninteresting, always-hostile-no-noncombat-interaction monster race. Particularly since the entire design and concept was stolen directly from a movie series about a bunch of cave dwelling monsters descended from humans: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEjyuyUv5EE

    Don't forget HG Wells Time Machine and Lovecraft's Lurking Fear.
  • scriverscriver Member Posts: 2,072
    Yeah, but those aren't literally look exactly like Skyrim's Falmer. I swear it is if some Beth design lead watched that movie just before production start, and went "oh that's so cool we need to have these in the game".
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    Part 2

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2E0_Oo4P4CU

    Please Todd, do something smart for once and hire this guy along with Avellone to write the new TES game.
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    edited December 2016
    I'd really wish Bethesda would give us mattering branching dialogue options for any upcoming TES game as well. It doesn't have to be as deep or well thought out as Tides of Numenera's, but at the very least on par with Fallout: New Vegas. Beth's latest dialogue tree designs can be broadly summarized as "yes/accept", "no/decline" and the occasional "ask more", not counting the ever popular "Esc" option. It was especially bad in Skyrim with forced quests one couldn't refuse.... Aventus Aretino and Brynjolf, anyone? *ugh*
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    I'm surprised the Resident Beth bashers haven't posted on this yet.
  • DragonKingDragonKing Member Posts: 1,977
    edited December 2016
    scriver said:

    What TES needs more than good writing is a basic connection between gameplay and plot. It's pointless to have an open world when almost every plot is 100% on rails and lacks response to the character's and/or player's actions.

    Now this, I can cosign this so damn hard. I mean at the end of the DA; you assassinate the -bleeping- emperor. Even if people don't know that it is you, that should affect the world.

  • DragonKingDragonKing Member Posts: 1,977

    So which Is better? Morrowind or Never Winter Nights?

    @ShapiroKeatsDarkMage
    Better question, why does one got to be better. Why can't the both be great games with their own strengths and weaknesses?
  • the_spyderthe_spyder Member Posts: 5,018
    scriver said:

    What TES needs more than good writing is a basic connection between gameplay and plot. It's pointless to have an open world when almost every plot is 100% on rails and lacks response to the character's and/or player's actions.

    This more or less depends on what you play the game for. If you are focused on plot lines, then yes. If all you want is an open world to stomp around in and explore, not so much. And yes, there are players that just want to explore the wasteland or Hyrule or Morrowind or wherever.
  • scriverscriver Member Posts: 2,072
    Are those people really in need writing at all, then?

    What I am talking about is integrating the open world concept into the quest/plot structure. For example when playing the Murderer On the Loose plot in Windhelm I was playing a sneaky-sneak character, so of course I immediately started investigating the homes of suspicious people for clues. And lo and behold, locked in a chest on the second floor I found the murder implements and the third part of the murderer's journal, proving this was the murderer. Could I go tell the guards about this, though? No, of course not. I had to go through the whole questline the way Beth's linear narrative demanded I do, first accusing the wrong person of the crime and then waiting until the next murder to happen before I can actually bring the culprit to justice. And that is the problem with Beth's writing. It doesn't care about the fact that this is an open world game they are making, and it doesn't care about what that allows the player to do. And that is the main thing I would want them to change about the way they make games.
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