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  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    I have no idea how we'd know that the islanders have been there for tens of thousands of years without contact with any outsiders. Even fossil evidence, if it exists, would only establish that people existed on the island; not that the island was isolated for its entire history.

    Even then, you'd need multiple samples to establish that the people who currently live there are the same as the ones who left fossilized remains. It's not unheard of for one tribe to push another one out, or for one tribe to go extinct and leave territory open for another tribe in the future. Virginia is a white-majority state today, but that doesn't mean finding a 10,000-year-old skeleton in Virginia would prove the existence of pre-Columbia white folks in America. There's a difference between people who live here now and people who lived here back then.

    Unless the Sentinelese have written records, you'd have to do genetic testing to get an idea of how long the the Sentinelese have gone without exchanging DNA with outsiders.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    ThacoBell said:

    @smeagolheart I'm saying that the tribe living isolated that long is IMPOSSIBLE without outside contact. The inbreediing would have led to CRIPPLING defects within more than a few generations.

    How do you know this?
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235

    ThacoBell said:

    @smeagolheart I'm saying that the tribe living isolated that long is IMPOSSIBLE without outside contact. The inbreediing would have led to CRIPPLING defects within more than a few generations.

    How do you know this?
    See they don't have a large enough population to have the required genetic diversity to survive for that long without intermingling with other people. Also, see @semiticgod 's comment above.

    TLDR; SCIENCE.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2018
    I'm honestly at a loss as to what an liberal/progressive or even centrist-minded voter is supposed to do in Wisconsin. They attained less seats in the legislature in a massive win in the popular vote in 2018 than they did years ago when LOST by similar margins. The state level positions they voted on in Novmeber will not even be the same as they were once Walker signs the bill. Much of the election has been rendered meaningless. The lame-duck session is just a means to an end. Ending it would be preferable, but the lame-duck session did not FORCE the GOP to act in this way. They have chosen to leave a trail of scorched earth in their wake. I sincerely DO NOT want Democrats to have to resort to these kind of tactics to stay on an even playing field, but what other choice is there??

    Furthermore, now that the funeral of HW is concluded, I can't understand any legitimate reason why the events in Wisconsin and NC aren't the biggest stories in the country. But I suspect only political junkies or residents of those States are even aware of them.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    ThacoBell said:

    ThacoBell said:

    @smeagolheart I'm saying that the tribe living isolated that long is IMPOSSIBLE without outside contact. The inbreediing would have led to CRIPPLING defects within more than a few generations.

    How do you know this?
    See they don't have a large enough population to have the required genetic diversity to survive for that long without intermingling with other people. Also, see @semiticgod 's comment above.

    TLDR; SCIENCE.
    That's what you keep saying, but how do you know how large their population is and how large a population is required, i.e. actual science. Your "science" is just saying stuff.
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,963
    edited December 2018

    I'm honestly at a loss as to what an liberal/progressive or even centrist-minded voter is supposed to do in Wisconsin. They attained less seats in the legislature in a massive win in the popular vote in 2018 than they did years ago when LOST by similar margins. The state level positions they voted on in Novmeber will not even be the same as they were once Walker signs the bill. Much of the election has been rendered meaningless. The lame-duck session is just a means to an end. Ending it would be preferable, but the lame-duck session did not FORCE the GOP to act in this way. They have chosen to leave a trail of scorched earth in their wake. I sincerely DO NOT want Democrats to have to resort to these kind of tactics to stay on an even playing field, but what other choice is there??

    Furthermore, now that the funeral of HW is concluded, I can't understand any legitimate reason why the events in Wisconsin and NC aren't the biggest stories in the country. But I suspect only political junkies or residents of those States are even aware of them.

    What can you do when they cheat like that? Something has to be done.

    They've cheated the people of Wisconsin. They've gerrymandered the state such that democrats win more votes and still control nothing. Despite the rigged system, Republicans lost the midterm election so they cripple the positions they lost.

    This is not democracy. They have subverted the will of the people.

    This is evil and ridiculous. Republicans should go to jail and the people need to be in the streets and take the power back.
    Post edited by smeagolheart on
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903

    Furthermore, now that the funeral of HW is concluded, I can't understand any legitimate reason why the events in Wisconsin and NC aren't the biggest stories in the country.

    Nor can I. I can't think of anything more noteworthy than trying to rig an election by manipulating absentee ballots or virtually sabotaging an election by arbitrarily robbing newly elected officials of their typical powers for the sole reason that they belong to the "other side."

    There is no defense or alternative explanation for this behavior. This is just people trying to subvert democracy to preserve their own political power.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2018

    Furthermore, now that the funeral of HW is concluded, I can't understand any legitimate reason why the events in Wisconsin and NC aren't the biggest stories in the country.

    Nor can I. I can't think of anything more noteworthy than trying to rig an election by manipulating absentee ballots or virtually sabotaging an election by arbitrarily robbing newly elected officials of their typical powers for the sole reason that they belong to the "other side."

    There is no defense or alternative explanation for this behavior. This is just people trying to subvert democracy to preserve their own political power.
    That's the thing, the highest ranking Republican in the Wisconsin legislature flat-out admitted the only reason this bill was being forced through was to prevent the newly-elected office holders from enacting a "liberal agenda", and to counteract the power of the voters in "Madison" (which is the capital of the State, and I'm assuming it's simply meant as a pejorative like "San Francisco" is nationally). A liberal agenda is exactly what the citizens of Wisconsin voted for this time. No one stopped Walker from enacting his conservative agenda for 8 years.

    This has gone back to Clinton with the GOP. Thy never viewed him as legitimate because of the Ross Perot factor. When Obama got elected, it had to be because he was some Manchurian candidate. Shit, when liberals complain about this stuff, it's usually when we get WAY more votes and lose anyway because of archaic systems. They don't view liberal governance as a legitimate option, and haven't for decades.
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,963
    edited December 2018
    Republicans strike again in Michigan.

    Michigan GOP panel votes to strip power from Democratic secretary of state

    https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2018/12/05/mich-gop-panel-votes-strip-power-democratic-secretary-state/2217485002/

    They don't view liberal governance as a legitimate option, and haven't for decades.

    That's not it. Well that's not the main factor. Mainly they're greedy. They want power and they want bribes (campaign donations). They're basically evil.

    So Dems will sue these GOP legislatures. What a waste of time and money and meanwhile their power is less than it should be. People need to go to jail.

    ...
    North Carolina is going to pass a bill to ensure Republicans control elections. Here’s the language that has people incensed:

    > In the even-numbered year, the chair shall be a member of the political party with the second highest number of registered affiliates as reflected by the latest registration statistics published by the State Board.

    This is a fairly obvious attempt to ensure that Republicans always control county election boards of during election years. Why? Because registered Democrats consistently–and by leaps and bounds–outnumber registered Republicans in North Carolina–and there’s no indication party affiliation numbers would change to favor Republicans any time soon.

    'even-numbered year'... as in **ALL** federal and state election years.

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2018
    I read that "even-numbered years" part yesterday. I don't know whether to laugh at such a transparently obvious way of saying "only we deserve to control the election board in the years that matter", or continue to be agahst at just how brazen and effective this entire project is. I mean, it's working. Again, we cannot function when one party is going to do stuff like this. If Democrats respond in kind while in power, they get accused of engaging in the same behavior and hypocrisy. If they take the high road and remain committed to SOME sense of fair-play, they get steam-rolled. There are no viable options. You can't win a rigged game.

    As I've mentioned before, the only way to possibly make up for the Merrick Garland seat is to pack the court. There is almost no chance of that happening, and I don't necessarily believe it should happen. But that means that it will never be rectified. An entire generation of people who voted for Barack Obama in 2012 will never be afforded the Supreme Court pick their vote was partially for. It's gone, forever. It was just taken from them. As we go further and further, and I can't help but view it as the possible beginning of the end.

    It was the moment the GOP drew a line in the sand and said "Democrats do not have the same governing powers as Republicans". Not as a fringe theory, but as a bedrock principle everyone from John McCain to Ted Cruz supported. And I believe it just plain BROKE democracy. Because it proved that you could get away with anything and suffer no consequences. What we are watching now is the death throes.
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,963

    As we go further and further, and I can't help but view it as the possible beginning of the end.

    It is. It is a one party coup to control America. Voters and Democracy be damned.
  • WarChiefZekeWarChiefZeke Member Posts: 2,651
    "North Carolina legislature votes itself supreme ruler as they are voted out"
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2018
    I'm still trying to wrestle with the geunine emotion I felt when George W. Bush broke down at the end of the speech about his father, and trying to reconcile it with my absolute loathing of his Presidency and flat-out hatred of the man I held for a decade. I don't really know how to feel about his rehabilitation. His Presidency is objectively worse than Trump's on balance at this point, but (on the other hand) he isn't a complete toxic waste dump of a human being. Should that matter?? Maybe we are finding out that it does. I mean, honestly, who is going to mourn Donald Trump other than his children??
  • WarChiefZekeWarChiefZeke Member Posts: 2,651
    edited December 2018
    Well George Bush is a genuinely good person who made some awful policy decisions. Nobody calls Trump a man of high personal morality, even if he is objectively better policy wise.

    I tend to forgive George Bush a lot regarding Iraq because of the fact that America was attacked under his watch. It is hard to imagine a lot of other outcomes other than military action to that scenario.

    While we're on that subject, does anyone remember the forged evidence the FBI/CIA used to help get us into that war? Of laughable quality that any intelligence agency should have discovered. One person referred to the fake evidence as "childlike" and in no way resembling the real thing.


    http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/03/14/sprj.irq.documents/
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2018

    Well George Bush is a genuinely good person who made some awful policy decisions. Nobody calls Trump a man of high personal morality, even if he is objectively better policy wise.

    I tend to forgive George Bush a lot regarding Iraq because of the fact that America was attacked under his watch. It is hard to imagine a lot of other outcomes other than military action to that scenario.

    While we're on that subject, does anyone remember the forged evidence the FBI used to help get us into that war? Of laughable quality that any intelligence agency should have discovered. One person referred to the fake evidence as "childlike" and in no way resembling the real thing.


    http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/03/14/sprj.irq.documents/

    I mean, I'm not the oldest person here by a longshot, but I was in my early to mid-20s during most of the Bush years, and I remember them quite vividly. There were plenty of people screaming at the top of their lungs about Iraq and how the evidence was just plain nonsense and what the exact consequences would be (check out the writing of professor Juan Cole at the time). Nobody was listening. The media was sycophantic, from the New York Times on down. Keep in mind, at this time, even MSNBC was just another run-of-the-mill cable news organization, not a liberal hotspot. They FIRED Phil Donahue for daring to speak out against the Iraq War in the lead-up. It only changed when Olbermann burst on the scene once the Iraq War started falling apart. There was not debate to be had in America at the time. If you weren't supporting the invasion, you were a god-honest traitor, and even your friends and family would tell you so. There was no place for liberals to turn in 2002-2003 other than the internet, which started the rise of the blogosphere.

    On my side, MANY Democrats were just plain petrified of seeming "soft on terror" because Bush, Cheney and Rove weaponized the war on terror politically, even though you could argue the entire thing might never have happened if they hadn't been asleep at the switch. They gave him the same leeway the American people did. Big mistake. They Administration lied to a vulnerable country. They said Iraq was directly responsible for 9/11 when they knew they had essentially nothing to do with it. I know alot of people may not like the Young Turks, but a much younger Cenk was our avatar in this clip at a certain point in those years:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hiRC5ZDTXk
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    The Bush era feels so long ago. I was in high school when it ended. Political debate back then was all about foreign policy and to a much lesser extent taxes. The Iraq War was the one big topic of the early 2000's. That and the war on terror.

    Political discussion really shifted a lot under Obama. A broader variety of things were on the public mind--healthcare, the recession, unemployment, drones. These days it's mostly Trump and Russia.

    The news has never seemed so busy and so ephemeral. Seems like every week we have a new scandal in the news, and you know it's going to just vanish as soon as the next big shiny thing pops up.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850

    The Bush era feels so long ago. I was in high school when it ended. Political debate back then was all about foreign policy and to a much lesser extent taxes. The Iraq War was the one big topic of the early 2000's. That and the war on terror.

    Political discussion really shifted a lot under Obama. A broader variety of things were on the public mind--healthcare, the recession, unemployment, drones. These days it's mostly Trump and Russia.

    The news has never seemed so busy and so ephemeral. Seems like every week we have a new scandal in the news, and you know it's going to just vanish as soon as the next big shiny thing pops up.

    I've told the story before, but going into 2000, I was voting like many young people vote: stupidly. My reasons for supporting Nader were that Tipper Gore had been the head of the PMRC and I had written my Senior term paper in high school on music censorship (which I am actually still quite proud of writing). Basically, I was listening to way too much Rage Against the Machine and getting my politics from Zach de la Rocha. As I watched the recount unfold, I realized this wasn't a game and that my support of a looney third-party candidate who had no chance of victory was the height of narcissism. I still believe Gore won Florida, I think there is at least a 50/50 chance the holdovers from the Clinton Administration who were raising alarm bells about Osama bin Laden all throughout the summer of '01 would have been listened to by a Gore Administration and the entire thing could have been stopped dead in it's tracks.

    The Iraq War fractured the country on foreign policy just like Vietnam. The recession broke it apart economically. I believe deep down that Obama tried to do everything he could to steer out of the ditch and try mend these wounds, and was successful, even if it was only a modest success. Then Trump came and opened up a cultural fault-line that I'm not sure can ever be repaired.
  • BallpointManBallpointMan Member Posts: 1,659

    Well George Bush is a genuinely good person who made some awful policy decisions. Nobody calls Trump a man of high personal morality, even if he is objectively better policy wise.

    Unfortunately, I think the jury is still out on this. I saw recently that the 3 year and 5 year treasury bond yields have converged. The most literal interpretation that I can come up for this is that fed does not expect the economy to be in a better place (relative to inflation, I guess?) in 5 years than it is in 3 years. That signals the likelihood of a recession.

    I took a look at the treasury bond yield in other years (the government has a website that lists them for each day, which is kind of a ton of information), and at a quick glance, the last time the bond yields converged like this was in 2007 (i think) - shortly before the great recession.

    I'll admit I didnt look at every day from 2009-2017. So it's possible this happened a few times when it did not presage a recession.
  • BallpointManBallpointMan Member Posts: 1,659
    On an unrelated note (and therefore a new post), I'm curious what @Balrog99 as a conservative Michigander thinks about the GOP in Michigan voting to restrict power from the incoming Democratic Governor during the lame duck session?
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,963
    edited December 2018

    Well George Bush is a genuinely good person who made some awful policy decisions. Nobody calls Trump a man of high personal morality, even if he is objectively better policy wise.

    What's to like about Trump's policies? He's done nothing except cut common sense safety regulations and his massive tax cuts for the rich have doubled the deficit that Obama left him. A lot of people aren't fans of putting kids in cages, trying to take away people's healthcare, and racist fearmongering immigrants isn't very admirable either. Then there's also the massive corruption from Trump's administration Zinke, Pai, Devos, and all the ones that have been fired or quit. Massive corruption from Trump including personal corruption of running the country to benefit his own businesses.

    Having said that, I'd agree with the first part. I got no sense of George HW Bush being a bad guy. He was fine as I recall.

    I think George W. Bush meant well but made bad decisions because he was surrounded by bad people like Bolton, Rowe, Cheney, et al.


    I mean, I'm not the oldest person here by a longshot, but I was in my early to mid-20s during most of the Bush years, and I remember them quite vividly. There were plenty of people screaming at the top of their lungs about Iraq and how the evidence was just plain nonsense and what the exact consequences would be (check out the writing of professor Juan Cole at the time). Nobody was listening. The media was sycophantic, from the New York Times on down. Keep in mind, at this time, even MSNBC was just another run-of-the-mill cable news organization, not a liberal hotspot. They FIRED Phil Donahue for daring to speak out against the Iraq War in the lead-up. It only changed when Olbermann burst on the scene once the Iraq War started falling apart. There was not debate to be had in America at the time. If you weren't supporting the invasion, you were a god-honest traitor, and even your friends and family would tell you so. There was no place for liberals to turn in 2002-2003 other than the internet, which started the rise of the blogosphere.

    On my side, MANY Democrats were just plain petrified of seeming "soft on terror" because Bush, Cheney and Rove weaponized the war on terror politically, even though you could argue the entire thing might never have happened if they hadn't been asleep at the switch. They gave him the same leeway the American people did. Big mistake. They Administration lied to a vulnerable country. They said Iraq was directly responsible for 9/11 when they knew they had essentially nothing to do with it. I know alot of people may not like the Young Turks, but a much younger Cenk was our avatar in this clip at a certain point in those years:

    You are talking about George W. Bush. I think Zeke was talking about George HW Bush but maybe he wasn't.
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 7,322
    In relation to objectively bad policy decisions, I've talked quite a bit before about the way Trump cancelled the Iran deal (at least as far as the US is concerned). That's part of a wider pattern that is based on the belief that you can solve any international issue by bilateral discussions (as opposed to using more general international organisations or treaties). I find it hard to fathom how anyone could possibly believe that.

    My reason for raising that now is that I see the US has just had Huawei's Chief Financial Officer arrested by Canada - apparently for breaching sanctions on Iran. There are 2 points about that:
    (i) the sanctions are unilateral from the US, i.e. they are attempting to dictate to the whole world how they should run their affairs. In some aspects of trade the US does have a legitimate interest, e.g. it's not unreasonable to say that US settlement arrangements should not be used for money laundering - but these sanctions cover transactions in which the US has no direct interest at all. The seeds have been sown here for a potential and damaging long-term conflict. I've posted before about what could happen when the US attempts to enforce these sanctions on EU countries and the disruption and worsening international relations that will cause.
    (ii) my belief is that this arrest in fact has little to do with sanctions and is far more about trying to pressure China over the current trade war. Huawei makes a soft target there because there have been international concerns about the possible use of Huawei equipment by the Chinese government. Those are reasonable concerns, but this way of expressing them is extremely dangerous. This reflects another enormous blind spot in Trump's character, i.e. that while he reacts incredibly emotionally himself during any discussions, he assumes that everyone else will react entirely without emotions. Hence he feels free to make vicious statements about other people's character and directly threaten them without consequences - he believes that saying nice things once a deal is done means everything said and done up to then has no meaning.

    In this case arresting such a senior person (and the daughter of the company founder) will clearly impact on the Chinese concept of 'face'. This is not just making it harder to resolve the trade dispute, but also risks broadening that dispute well beyond trade matters. I would class this as an 'objectively bad policy decision'.
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,963
    edited December 2018
    Grond0 said:

    In relation to objectively bad policy decisions, I've talked quite a bit before about the way Trump cancelled the Iran deal (at least as far as the US is concerned). That's part of a wider pattern that is based on the belief that you can solve any international issue by bilateral discussions (as opposed to using more general international organisations or treaties). I find it hard to fathom how anyone could possibly believe that.

    My reason for raising that now is that I see the US has just had Huawei's Chief Financial Officer arrested by Canada - apparently for breaching sanctions on Iran. There are 2 points about that:
    (i) the sanctions are unilateral from the US, i.e. they are attempting to dictate to the whole world how they should run their affairs. In some aspects of trade the US does have a legitimate interest, e.g. it's not unreasonable to say that US settlement arrangements should not be used for money laundering - but these sanctions cover transactions in which the US has no direct interest at all. The seeds have been sown here for a potential and damaging long-term conflict. I've posted before about what could happen when the US attempts to enforce these sanctions on EU countries and the disruption and worsening international relations that will cause.
    (ii) my belief is that this arrest in fact has little to do with sanctions and is far more about trying to pressure China over the current trade war. Huawei makes a soft target there because there have been international concerns about the possible use of Huawei equipment by the Chinese government. Those are reasonable concerns, but this way of expressing them is extremely dangerous. This reflects another enormous blind spot in Trump's character, i.e. that while he reacts incredibly emotionally himself during any discussions, he assumes that everyone else will react entirely without emotions. Hence he feels free to make vicious statements about other people's character and directly threaten them without consequences - he believes that saying nice things once a deal is done means everything said and done up to then has no meaning.

    In this case arresting such a senior person (and the daughter of the company founder) will clearly impact on the Chinese concept of 'face'. This is not just making it harder to resolve the trade dispute, but also risks broadening that dispute well beyond trade matters. I would class this as an 'objectively bad policy decision'.

    That's ridiculous. I saw that she was arrested but it didn't say why. Violating sanctions on Iran? Wtf? The US can't force China to adhere to US sanctions on Iran. I hope there's more to this because as is this is a major needless international incident.

    And I thought it was Japan that had 'face'. I'd not heard of it being Chinas thing too but it probably is. Saudi Arabia has "face" too - of sorts. There you have to appear strong or they will kill you basically. If you don't project strength, you are shit. It's all macho BS.
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 7,322

    And I thought it was Japan that had 'face'. I'd not heard of it being Chinas thing too but it probably is. Saudi Arabia has "face" too - of sorts. There you have to appear strong or they will kill you basically. If you don't project strength, you are shit. It's all macho BS.

    The Chinese certainly think of it as their concept - and I would agree with that. Chinese culture is older than Japanese and this is an old cultural concept - here is what Wikipedia has to say about it.
  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 7,811
    I was going to bring up the Huawei arrest tomorrow and Canada’s role in it, but now that it is here:

    The charges, as of now, are not stated. It is assumed it had to do with trading with Iran, but it might have more to do with the company’s technology allowing the Chinese government to backdoor spy on all of its users. The US, New Zealand and Australia have already banned Huawei from helping develop 5e networks in their countries and the US is pushing other western companies to follow suit.

    If this was just about Iran, I do not think Canada would make the arrest, but if broader international securities are at risk, and getting this individual to answer to those types of charges, may help Canada and other nations swing towards banning the company.

    I also think this is CIA driven and Trump doesn’t have a clue about it. If he did, he would have tweeted about it today before the arrest. He will certainly tweet about it tomorrow though.

    And anyone who thought the US and China actually made a deal during that dinner hasn’t been paying attention to Trump’s playbook. I knew it was all smoke as soon as they said they were not going to talk about it until after Bush’s funeral, which does have a nice coincidence going on with this individual being arrested right after the Funeral.
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    So, some "news" (sort of) out of Spain...

    Two altar boys were arrested for putting weed in the censer-burner

    What started as a joke ended with the future of two altar boys from Spain. They were detained overnight, after having surprised them putting weed in the censer-burner of the Cathedral of Santiago de Compostela.
    This is a parody site.
    https://thereisnews.com/two-altar-boys-was-arrested-for-putting-marijuana-in-the-censer-burner3333/?fbclid=IwAR1bD2eLF1o1LqBf5OtojonczIbOzfatRBevfIHWSjk4rPWDJoaElSzVIVg
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    And now some not parody news. Spoilered, as per usual.

    How a remnant of Jim Crow helped Georgia Republicans win Tuesday's race for secretary of state

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817238/-How-a-remnant-of-Jim-Crow-helped-Georgia-Republicans-win-Tuesday-s-race-for-secretary-of-state?detail=emaildkre
    Once, Georgia had done away with runoff elections. in 2004 for the first time since Reconstruction, they revived those runoffs, knowing that black voters tend to turn out at lower rates whenever there’s a second round of voting. That change worked just as planned: In 2006 and 2008 elections for state public service commission, which regulates utilities, Democrats won pluralities on Election Day yet lost the subsequent runoffs, and Democrats have done worse in every runoff since 2005.

    'This is the right thing to do': Chef José Andrés goes to the southern border to aid asylum-seekers

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817249/--This-is-the-right-thing-to-do-Chef-Jos-Andr-s-goes-to-the-southern-border-to-aid-asylum-seekers?detail=emaildkre
    José Andrés’ latest humanitarian mission shows why he not only deserves his recent nomination for the Nobel Peace Prize, but also why he deserves to win it. The chef has taken his famed World Central Kitchen to the Mexican side of the southern border, where in the last few days he estimates he has fed as many as 3,000 refugees a day. He tells The Washington Post he’s there because he’s compelled to be there.
    “’In the end, it’s very simple,” he said. “Our motto comes from John Steinbeck’s ‘The Grapes of Wrath.’ Wherever there’s a fight so hungry people may eat, I will be there.” The Washington Post reports that “then Andrés put his own amendment on Steinbeck’s famous line: ‘We will be there,’ he added.” Over 30 volunteers are there currently helping a smaller group of World Central Kitchen people.
    This is a wonderful thing! I would support his winning the Nobel Peace Prize

    Republicans move to exempt 93.5% of Michigan companies from paid sick leave law.

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817221/-Republicans-move-to-exempt-93-5-of-Michigan-companies-from-paid-sick-leave-law?detail=emaildkre
    More from the Republican state house did to screw people over.

    Former Trump cybersecurity adviser draws mockery after typo leads to prank, conspiracy claims

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817224/-Worldwide-mocking-of-Trump-s-top-cybersecurity-advisor-after-typo-leads-to-prank-conspiracy-claims?detail=emaildkre
    Rudy Giuiani shows why he should just retire more and more every day.

    'It doesn't f**king matter,' says neo-Nazi who allegedly killed Heather Heyer in Charlottesville

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817219/--It-doesn-t-f-king-matter-says-neo-Nazi-who-allegedly-killed-Heather-Heyer-in-Charlottesville?detail=emaildkre
    James Alex Fields, the self-identified neo-Nazi who allegedly killed Heather Heyer when he drove his car into a crowd of counterprotesters at the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, on August 12, 2017, said "It doesn't fucking matter" that she died, as reported by Buzzfeed News.
    At this point, Fields’ defense lawyers are not denying that he struck and killed Heyer. Their focus is on his intent. They’re hoping the evidence will suggest that he acted out of a need to defend himself because he feared for his life. But based on evidence that’s been brought before the jury so far, they have their work cut out for them in defending the white supremacist.
    In a phone call to his mother, Fields described Heather Heyer and her mother as "Communists" and "The Enemy". Yeah, I don't see his Lawyers getting him off with such a cold indifference to the life of the woman he killed. I believe the words "Depraved Indifference" to use a Law & Order term, should be applied here.

    Massachusetts church's nativity scene features infant Jesus in a cage, wise men separated by fence

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817227/-Massachusetts-church-s-nativity-scene-features-infant-Jesus-in-a-cage-wise-men-separated-by-fence?detail=emaildkre
    A Christmas nativity scene outside St. Susanna Parish near Boston, Massachusetts, features the infant Jesus in a cage in a display that church leaders hope, reports the Boston Globe, “will provoke conversations about how immigrants are being treated at the U.S.-Mexico border, including the controversial separation of children from their parents.”
    I applaud this, and wish more churches did the same.

    High schoolers sing 'Let's kill all the blacks' in racist rendition of holiday jingle

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817197/-High-schoolers-sing-let-s-kill-all-blacks-in-racist-rendition-of-holiday-jingle?detail=emaildkre
    And of course, someone filmed it and posted it online, which led to it being discovered.

    Trump Jr. goes on Twitter to cry about being an oppressed man—and gets destroyed

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817248/-Trump-Jr-goes-on-Twitter-to-cry-about-being-an-oppressed-man-and-gets-destroyed?detail=emaildkre
    Kirsten Gillibrand, after seeing all the women recently elected to the House, tweeted:
    "Our future is:
    Female
    Intersectional
    Powered by our belief in one another.
    And we’re just getting started."
    Donald Jr. responded
    "Good to know. My girls will be excited about this. When is it appropriate to let my boys (9, 7 and 6 years old) that there's no future for them?
    Not sure this is a winning platform but you be you."
    One twitter user "MericanDaddy" responded,
    "Probably shortly after your indictment. Seems like the appropriate time."
    LOL! I have no sympathy for Trump, Jr.

    Feds: Ex-Baltimore police officer admitted misconduct, expanding scope of corruption probe

    https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/bs-md-ci-gttf-ryckman-letter-20181204-story.html
    This case is going on in Baltimore and also in California. This is from the "Gun Trace Task Force Scandal".

    NBC News gets roasted for wishful claims of a 'Toned-down President Trump'

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817268/-NBC-News-gets-roasted-for-wishful-claims-of-a-Toned-down-President-Trump?detail=emaildkre
    On Tuesday, yet another press outlet got rightly roasted and ratio'd for, yet again, wondering if an uncharacteristically long span between raging Donald Trump tantrums could be counted as actual grown-up behavior of the sort we would expect of literally any other person in the public sphere. This time it was NBC News, and the pretense is, roughly, that since he didn't immediately attack a dead ex-president and since he canceled multiple meetings with foreign leaders, showing admirable laziness, by God that almost, sort of, barely counts as normal!

    Michael Flynn may have handed over recordings of conversations with Trump or others

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817199/-Michael-Flynn-may-have-handed-over-recordings-of-conversations-with-Trump-or-others?detail=emaildkre
    The nature of the documents leaves a lot of room for speculation, and one phrase in one sentence in the document has generated a ripple of excitement. That phrase is the mention that Flynn’s cooperation may include “participating in covert law enforcement activities.” That’s because the term “covert” in this context generally means wearing a wire and recording a conversation.
    As Raw Story reports, that realization earned gasps on MSNBC’s Morning Joe and it’s generated a flurry of dropped jaws and rubbed hands across the social media landscape. But … is it possible? Could Michael Flynn’s cooperation with Robert Mueller have included chatting about criminal activity with Donald Trump or others?

    A Few Warnings tucked away within the Unredacted Text of the Flynn Filing

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817265/-A-Few-Warnings-tucked-away-within-the-Unredacted-Text-of-the-Flynn-Filing?detail=emaildkre
    More about the 'covert' activities mentioned in court filings.

    Pelosi: 'We will hold the Trump admin accountable' for 'trauma and anguish' of family separation

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/5/1817208/-Pelosi-We-will-hold-the-Trump-admin-accountable-for-trauma-and-anguish-of-family-separation?detail=emaildkre
    Good. They should. That shouldn't happen to any families.
  • WarChiefZekeWarChiefZeke Member Posts: 2,651
    edited December 2018
    On the stock market:

    As Politico points out "We’ll also note that it’s unclear how valuable the stock market is as a gauge of the country’s economic health. Not every American is invested, so it’s probably not the most important economic metric."

    Wages and unemployment > stock market when measuring the health of the economy. Real people matter more than big businesses.

    It's also not true that Obama oversaw nothing but a period of steady growth in that area.

    We should also talk about Fed policy, since the Fed has raised interest rates 7 times over the past 2 years. In the past 8, they kept interest rates at near zero the whole time. This raises the cost of consumer borrowing. They typically do this during period of economic health, helping those who save money, but it slows growth, and more are expected next year.

    https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2018/jan/08/how-trump-obama-compare-stock-market/

    https://www.npr.org/2018/09/26/651145595/another-fed-rate-hike-is-coming-when-will-it-start-to-hurt-consumers






  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,963
    edited December 2018
    Your Trump chart leaves out the last 11 months during which gains have been erased, might even be negative now. Recently there's been big fluctuations as Trump's trade whims, tarrifs, and Twitter meltdowns have led to volatility in the markets.
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