Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Categories

Axis & Allies 1942 Online is now available in Early Access! Buy it on Steam. The FAQ is available.
New Premium Module: Tyrants of the Moonsea! Read More
Attention, new and old users! Please read the new rules of conduct for the forums, and we hope you enjoy your stay!

powergaming party (BG2 TOB,NPC and multiplayer)

zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
What is the most powergaming party that you can think of?

two different groups of posts
1) multiplayer created party by player. What classes/races (and items)
2) charname + npc's. What npc's
-this is not 1 vs 2 but creating 2 different threads for 1 purpose is silly
-bg2 tob exp limit
-no mods

and why is this the most powergaming?


for example
F/M/T half-elf - like kensai mage but +100dmg with backstab
Kensai13/Mage - i think everyone know why kensai/mage
cleric/specjalist mage - healer who is almost immortal
mage slayer13/mage - antimage
edwin - most spells

npc's
F/M/T op op
sarevok dualed to mage op
edwin - op op op
aerie - op multi
keldorn - op dispell
Cernd - SS f yeah

like you can see I prefer magic :)

Post edited by zur312 on
«13456726

Comments

  • MathmickMathmick Member Posts: 326
    Full created party.

    Because you can pick every single aspect of the character + roll for stats. Only a couple of characters have unique traits that make them (arguably) better than anything you can make, but you pay for those traits with the lack of being able to customise.

  • AnaximanderAnaximander Member Posts: 191
    I find that dualing at 9 helps you be viable for most of SoA and with 1 belm and 1 kundane you can still have 2 warriors in the party with full attacks with imp. haste. Though I think I'm using a mod for grandmastery bonuses ...

  • zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
    wow zero powergamers here?

  • KidCarnivalKidCarnival Member Posts: 3,747
    zur312 said:

    wow zero powergamers here?

    Only Cernd, it seems.

    dstoltzfusKlorox
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 3,675
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

  • Lord_TansheronLord_Tansheron Member Posts: 4,105
    I know it wasn't what you asked for, but "powergaming" the vanilla game is like bringing a Death Star to a knife fight. The min/maxing only really matters when there's adequately difficult stuff to make it relevant. This is what I used for my last clear, SCSII/Ascension/PSphere cranked to the max, on Insane difficulty:

    Kensai 13->Mage
    Kensai 13->Mage
    Barbarian 15->Cleric
    Inquisitor
    Swashbuckler 15->Fighter

    It's a melee-dps oriented party, because that's where the greatest damage lies. No backstabs, though, as most if not all relevant enemies in my setup are immune to them. The barbarian->cleric is the "tank", stacking damage resistances as much as possible. Inquisitor I find indispensable during the early game, if for the saved frustration from not having to reload 1000 times to every random city battle at low levels, where a failed save equals death to all and protection spells are scarce.

    I found that K->M's damage potential is simply unreal, Imp. Haste + Kai kills most enemies extremely quickly (especially those not immune to Timestop). The spells are used to dispel enemy defenses, which are rampant with my mods.

    As for NPCs, there's several choices that stand out. I usually mod my NPCs to suit whatever classes/kits I want to play, simply to not have to deal with the annoying MP loading times and the missing banter/romance.

    One of the cheesier choices is Jan; I made him my barb->cleric tank, where his special armor becomes ridiculous. With Defender of Easthaven, Roranach's Horn, and Armor of Faith, he can tank Ascension Melyssan all day long.

    Another great and very powerful one is Sarevok, for the obvious reason of Deathbringer Assault, which, with some luck, makes short work of even the most dangerous enemies. He can become a double-edged sword, though, if your choices/alignment make him betray you during the final battle.

    The most ridiculous NPC though is Solaufein. I like the mod because the character is fun and has a lot of dialogue, and also adds a very difficult battle (Eclipse); however, his character-specific sword is so good it dwarfs even the Flail of Ages, and not by a small margin.

    Speaking of weapons, even with the ItemUpgrade mod, FoA+5 remains the best weapon in the game (except for Solaufein's, see above). Staff of the Ram certainly is powerful as well, but it's a) 2h (meaning less APR) and b) makes you lose Roranach's Horn, which comes in handy at times. Kundane/Belm/Scarlet Ninja-to are of course no-brainers and a must-have for any dual-wielder. Axe of the Unyielding is also incredibly powerful, though more so for plowing through trash than for killing bosses (who are pretty much exclusively immune to vorpal hits).

    Spell-wise, I found myself using 90% buffs/debuffs and only 10% damage spells, of which 99% were Magic Missile and Horrid Wilting. There really is little reason to use any other offensive spells, given their cast time, enemy defenses, and damage that just doesn't compare to melee hits. Stoneskin is, of course, the best spell of all, followed closely by Improved Haste.

    ReadingRamboFredjo
  • zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
    edited April 2013
    this is what i was asking for

    other ppl just post random 1 lines

    can you explain why 15 lvl barb?

  • teancum42teancum42 Member Posts: 7
    The multi-player party will certainly be the more powerful... It should probably include a paladin to wield Carsomyr, followed by a bunch of dual-class characters with a lot of magic. Maybe something like:

    Paladin (Cavalier?)
    Kensai -> Thief (For all your thieving with stupid powerful backstabs needs)
    Kensai -> Mage (Because you might as well get some extra hp and thAC0, right?)
    Berserker -> Cleric (Let's be real, from a powergaming standpoint, dualing out of a fighter kit is just better)

    After those 4 I think you can do anything you want. Probably some more casters... maybe a ranger/cleric to get all those druid spells without needing to be a druid. The last spot should be an arcane caster. Sorcerer? Another dualed mage type? Something.

    For single-player it seems a lot more subjective, but the idea that more magic = better remains true. I personally like for my PC to be a half-orc fighter/thief, because 19 strength is just fun. But there are plenty of belts and, if you go through BG1 first, that lovely tome, so in the end it doesn't matter much. Then you take along Keldorn (with a strength belt and some dex gloves) for Carsomyr, Minsc/Sarevok to be your other frontliner, Jan for magic and thief stuff, Viconia because... well... because Viconia, and Aerie, because if you follow the philosophy that more magic is better, being a cleric/mage is pretty darn good.

    Dualing Sarevok is always a choice, but I'm not sure it is a good one. You will likely have all your thief needs covered (either by the PC or by Jan) and if you make him a mage he is just a low-level mage for the vast majority of the time.

    Those are my thoughts.

  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,456
    I'm thinking

    Ranger -> Cleric
    Kensai -> Mage
    Swashbuckler -> Mage
    Inquisitor
    Sorcerer (maybe a dualed mage if you prefer - also, are there enough scrolls LOL)
    Zerker -> Druid?

  • zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
    who is stronger viconia or aerie? because i have a discussion on reddit and i don't mean only cleric part of aerie but overall

  • Lord_TansheronLord_Tansheron Member Posts: 4,105
    zur312 said:

    this is what i was asking for

    other ppl just post random 1 lines

    can you explain why 15 lvl barb?

    Barbarians gain extra damage resistance at lvl15, that's why I don't dual them at 13. Two levels seem a small price to pay in the end.
    zur312 said:

    who is stronger viconia or aerie? because i have a discussion on reddit and i don't mean only cleric part of aerie but overall

    This is not something that can be decided by a blanket statement. "Stronger" depends on many factors; Viconia has pretty good stats and magic resistance, and she is also a pure cleric, meaning her Turn Undead will be much stronger. Especially in the vanilla game, liches and vampires are among the most powerful enemies you face and being able to blow them up (or control them) is very good. That being said, Aerie is an insanely versatile and powerful spellcaster, and spells are king in BG2, especially in an unmodded game. You can also do silly things such as divine-spell contingencies or the ever so popular Timestop + Harm combo.

    In a modded game, there is a noticeable shift away from spell power and to physical damage; I wouldn't want a cleric/mage in the games I usually play.

  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,456
    Uh, barbarians can't dual.

    TJ_HookerKlorox
  • zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
    viconia is pure cleric she is ok but lack a def spells so combining this with her low hp she is not versatile character

    aerie is part mage = almost immortal with mirror images/stone skin

    viconia is cleric so her spells are cleric spells = not the best in the game but greater restoration revive etc. are pretty cool

    aerie is part mage = best spells in the game + best spells of cleric in the game but lower amount

    that's why i think aerie is stronger

    turn undead is cool on paper or in roleplaying but i don't think it matters

  • mjsmjs Member Posts: 742
    Ranger/cleric
    Kensai13> mage
    fighter/thief
    Cleric/illusionist
    Sorcerer
    the 6th could be anything and this team would still power through, either any bard kit or maybe a monk for mid soa and beyond, a resistance/immunities tank like the berserker, cav or dwarven defender

    Bg ee

    Archer pc
    Kagain
    Coran
    mr surprise
    Edwin
    quayle

    bg 2

    Edwin (illegally powerful)
    Haer dalis (illegally powerful)
    Aerie (c/m is always great)
    Jan (m/t is always great)
    sarevok/korgan/keldorn (tank)
    fighter/thief pc (powerful multi)

  • DexterDexter Member Posts: 253
    People seem to like kensai -> mages a lot. Have you ever played BG2 mod Tactics? This is quite an old mod, and one of its components was a kensai 13 -> mage 14 named Kuroisan. He showed up buffed to the max shortly after adquiring celestial fury and tried to steal it from you because "he liked katanas". He was wearing all the goodies (vecna, gaxx, amulet of power...) plus his own powerful magic katana+4 (so powerful I declined to use it). Really tough and cheesy guy. Of course, my next run after meeting him I played a kensai 13 -> mage...
    Ahh... kuroisan and improved illych, such a beautiful, painful memories...

    lunarFredjo
  • zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
    edited April 2013
    ppl were killing improved illych solo mage but I...
    ... I just ran ; D

  • zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
    edited April 2013
    mjs said:

    Ranger/cleric
    Kensai13> mage
    fighter/thief
    Cleric/illusionist
    Sorcerer
    the 6th could be anything and this team would still power through, either any bard kit or maybe a monk for mid soa and beyond, a resistance/immunities tank like the berserker, cav or dwarven defender

    Bg ee

    Archer pc
    Kagain
    Coran
    mr surprise
    Edwin
    quayle

    bg 2

    Edwin (illegally powerful)
    Haer dalis (illegally powerful)
    Aerie (c/m is always great)
    Jan (m/t is always great)
    sarevok/korgan/keldorn (tank)
    fighter/thief pc (powerful multi)

    i dunno about fighter/thief - isn't he better as fighter/mage/thief? it's about the same but stone skin ,mirror images, spell immunity and other goodies

  • TJ_HookerTJ_Hooker Member Posts: 2,438
    zur312 said:

    i dunno about fighter/thief - isn't he better as fighter/mage/thief? it's about the same but stone skin ,mirror images, spell immunity and other goodies

    A triple multiclass levels up very slowly, especially in a full party. For example, in order to cast stoneskin, you'd need 180000 xp (more than the xp cap of BG:EE). Also, you'll never be able to cast level 9 spells. It's not as simple as saying that changing a F/T to a F/M/T is nothing but an upgrade, in the form of spellcasting. There's definitely a trade off for adding that extra class.

  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,126
    clicking CTRL+8 to get all your stats to 18 would be powergamey

  • ajwzajwz Member Posts: 4,122
    kensai12-mage - 2 weapon fighting Flail of ages, defender of easthaven
    kensai12-mage- 2wf Frostreaver axe, Azuridge
    kensai12-mage - Gensens Bow
    kensai12-mage - 2handed weapons Silver Sword
    Swashbuckler15-fighter - 2wf Celestial Fury, Malakar
    Fighter/Cleric - 2wf CromFayer, Mace of disruption

    kensaiTEMNOZORAN
  • Lord_TansheronLord_Tansheron Member Posts: 4,105

    Uh, barbarians can't dual.

    It's true that they can't in the vanilla game, though it is likely to be an oversight. Barbarians are coded as a fighter kit. PnP Barbarians can dual. There really is no compelling reason why Barbarians shouldn't be able to dual-class, and so many mods introduce the option.

    clicking CTRL+8 to get all your stats to 18 would be powergamey

    That isn't powergaming, that is cheating. I admit that the border is blurry at times, but min/maxing is distinctly different from max/maxing.
    ajwz said:

    kensai12-mage - 2 weapon fighting Flail of ages, defender of easthaven
    kensai12-mage- 2wf Frostreaver axe, Azuridge
    kensai12-mage - Gensens Bow
    kensai12-mage - 2handed weapons Silver Sword
    Swashbuckler15-fighter - 2wf Celestial Fury, Malakar
    Fighter/Cleric - 2wf CromFayer, Mace of disruption

    Kensai can't use ranged weapons. Dual-wield should always include a +APR weapon (Kundane, Belm, or Scarlet Ninja-to). Crom Faeyr on a cleric is largely redundant because DuHM will give them 25 STR anyway.

  • mjsmjs Member Posts: 742
    zur312 said:



    i dunno about fighter/thief - isn't he better as fighter/mage/thief? it's about the same but stone skin ,mirror images, spell immunity and other goodies

    you also lose a lot. you do get spell stuff, but i think that's adequately covered by having edwin, jan, haer'dalis and aerie. in a different party, an f/m/t is a worthy addition, but for this party balance an f/t is better for:

    more HLAs (23 compared to f/m/t's 3)
    better backstab (x5 rather than x4)
    more weapon pips
    more thief points (largely irrelevant with jan too, but a nice to have)
    get higher APR sooner

    certainly by the time you're hitting the HLAs, having more allows for spike trap cheese, time stop + IH + assassination, use any item cheese, IH + critical strike,

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 3,675
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

    Eudaemoniumdarius404
  • TJ_HookerTJ_Hooker Member Posts: 2,438
    mjs said:

    zur312 said:



    i dunno about fighter/thief - isn't he better as fighter/mage/thief? it's about the same but stone skin ,mirror images, spell immunity and other goodies

    you also lose a lot. you do get spell stuff, but i think that's adequately covered by having edwin, jan, haer'dalis and aerie. in a different party, an f/m/t is a worthy addition, but for this party balance an f/t is better for:

    more HLAs (23 compared to f/m/t's 3)
    better backstab (x5 rather than x4)
    more weapon pips
    more thief points (largely irrelevant with jan too, but a nice to have)
    get higher APR sooner

    certainly by the time you're hitting the HLAs, having more allows for spike trap cheese, time stop + IH + assassination, use any item cheese, IH + critical strike,
    (emphasis mine)

    Err, how did you come up with F/M/Ts only getting 3 HLAs? Remember, a character starts getting HLAs at their first level up after hitting 3 million xp. For a multiclass character, all classes contribute towards meeting this 3 million xp threshold. And I'm guessing that an F/M/T is going to level up more than 3 times after hitting 3 mil.

  • mjsmjs Member Posts: 742
    whoops, bad maths (divided 8mil by 6 instead of 3), 11 HLAs...still quite the difference

  • zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
    Samus said:

    zur312 said:

    viconia is pure cleric she is ok but lack a def spells so combining this with her low hp she is not versatile character

    *speechless*
    no stone skin/mirror images/iron skin plus very low hp

    the only real defensive spell of her is armor of faith but it is not stacking in BG:ee so only 25% max reduction of damage

    About f/t vs f/m/t maybe f/t can have faster apr but he has no defense like viconia

  • revaarrevaar Member Posts: 160
    Cleric/illusionist for bhaalspawn
    Ranger7->cleric
    Kensai13->Mage
    Kensai9-> theif
    Swashbuckler10->Mage
    Berserker13->cleric

    This group should stay powerful throughout, since the dual classes are spread out, minimizing downtimes, and will be absolute wrecking balls at the end.

  • zur312zur312 Member Posts: 1,358
    seriously why so many clerics? ;D i know duhm is good but man you went just way overboard

Sign In or Register to comment.