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The thread for coming out/share your identity

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  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,371
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    semiticgod wrote: »
    It would be nice to just shrug off the little things, but that's not actually safe. Trans folks don't really have the luxury of not caring about what people think. We're outnumbered, outgunned, and unless a miracle happens in the Supreme Court, it will be perfectly legal for folks to fire us or discriminate against us in the United States (and elsewhere, the situation is even uglier). Other people's opinions of us, and transgender people as a group, have a direct impact on our daily lives, our career, our friendships, and even our physical safety. You do have to pay attention to what other people think of you.

    The reason I carry pepper spray is because a confident, devil-may-care attitude won't stop anyone from throwing a punch. It's not safe to close your eyes.

    Much of the violence that happens to transgender individuals is the result of a straight males feeling "tricked" into finding a female transgender individual attractive. While I can certainly understand a serious case of embarrassment if you took someone home and only realized it at that time, people have been MURDERED because of this dynamic. And often times it doesn't even rise close to that level of intimacy, but simply a situation where a guy will find someone attractive, find oit later they are transgender, and their ego can't handle it.

    It's not like this is new territory. One of the great rock anthems of all-time, "Lola" by The Kinks, is explicitly about falling for a transvestite or transgender individual. But it can be deadly. Homeless and suicide rate are astronomical compared to the normal population (I feel like I see someone who is transgender homeless asking for change outside the bus terminal at least once a week). Jobs aren't safe. If you walk into the wrong bathroom because of recent fearmongering, you will be viewed as some kind of default sex predator. I'm a 6'2 straight, white male. I think nothing of walking in any area of town at any time of day or night. Others don't have this luxury.

    I remember seeing the cover of a Poison album and thinking, "wow, those girls are hot!". When I found out they were dudes, I was weirded out by it but I didn't feel any hostility toward them. Maybe I'm just not alpha material...
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited October 2019
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    semiticgod wrote: »
    It would be nice to just shrug off the little things, but that's not actually safe. Trans folks don't really have the luxury of not caring about what people think. We're outnumbered, outgunned, and unless a miracle happens in the Supreme Court, it will be perfectly legal for folks to fire us or discriminate against us in the United States (and elsewhere, the situation is even uglier). Other people's opinions of us, and transgender people as a group, have a direct impact on our daily lives, our career, our friendships, and even our physical safety. You do have to pay attention to what other people think of you.

    The reason I carry pepper spray is because a confident, devil-may-care attitude won't stop anyone from throwing a punch. It's not safe to close your eyes.

    Much of the violence that happens to transgender individuals is the result of a straight males feeling "tricked" into finding a female transgender individual attractive. While I can certainly understand a serious case of embarrassment if you took someone home and only realized it at that time, people have been MURDERED because of this dynamic. And often times it doesn't even rise close to that level of intimacy, but simply a situation where a guy will find someone attractive, find oit later they are transgender, and their ego can't handle it.

    It's not like this is new territory. One of the great rock anthems of all-time, "Lola" by The Kinks, is explicitly about falling for a transvestite or transgender individual. But it can be deadly. Homeless and suicide rate are astronomical compared to the normal population (I feel like I see someone who is transgender homeless asking for change outside the bus terminal at least once a week). Jobs aren't safe. If you walk into the wrong bathroom because of recent fearmongering, you will be viewed as some kind of default sex predator. I'm a 6'2 straight, white male. I think nothing of walking in any area of town at any time of day or night. Others don't have this luxury.

    I remember seeing the cover of a Poison album and thinking, "wow, those girls are hot!". When I found out they were dudes, I was weirded out by it but I didn't feel any hostility toward them. Maybe I'm just not alpha material...

    They absolutely did look like convincing on the "Look What the Cat Dragged In" cover. But that was hardly the beginning of it. Bowie was selling his androgynous persona as early as 1970. The original Alice Cooper band is dressed in drag on the cover of "Love it to Death". "53rd and 3rd" by The Ramones is about Dee Dee turning tricks as a male prostitute. The song "Jet Boy, Jet Girl" by Elton Morello is one of the most over the top songs about sexuality I have ever heard. Glam and punk of the 1970s were steeped in LBTQ culture decades before the phrase even existed. By the time Motley Crue and Poison came around, it had been watered down to wigs, eyeliner and alot of scarfs.
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235
    I feel like this thread's purpose might have derailed a little bit. "Welcome to beig trans, fear for your life!"
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235
    I never thought of it before, but yeah, it makes sense that someone who identifies as a certain gender, but also wants to look the part to other people. That has to be incredibly rough, especially so on people whose genetics don't let them do so easily. That gotta be some immense pressure, both put on by yourself AND by society.
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,714
    @semiticgod Congratulations, mam.
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,371
    @semiticgod

    I'm just curious but you certainly don't have to answer. Are you sexually attracted to males, females, both or neither? It's not just the gender attributes that make trans folks hard to understand for cis folks, it's also the sexual dynamics. It would have to be even harder if you were trans but still attracted to the same sex that you want to transition to. Again, this is just scientific curiosity on my part so no answer is fine if you're not comfortable talking about it...
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,371
    semiticgod wrote: »
    @Balrog99: Women. Though things have been feeling a lot less binary than they used to, so...

    Anyway, most trans folks are straight. So you'd switch from gay male to straight female or lesbian to straight male. In my case, I'm switching from straight male to (mostly?) lesbian.

    I'm actually lucky to be gay in this case. I think dating is easier for gay trans women than straight ones. Men tend to be a lot less forgiving of women without the standard body shape and especially the right set of junk; women don't mind the physical aspect as much.

    There is a certain kind of guy that specifically is attracted to trans women, crossdressers, and hermaphrodites. They're called "chasers," but trans women kinda have a love/hate relationship with them. It's great to have a group of men that are very much attracted to you, of course, but if they're only around because of a fetish and they don't want a real relationship and they view you as a sex object... well, that's not what most women want out of a relationship, trans or no. It doesn't help that part of the reason they're attracted to you in the first place is because they view you as different from most women, and that can be an unpleasant reminder.

    Most trans folks end up with other trans folks... which I've been thinking is really not that bad. Trans people have a habit of being very strange, interesting, artsy, kinky, and cuddly people, and that checks a lot of important boxes.

    I kind of thought that might be the case but I'm not sure why (intuition, perhaps?). It's strange that the sexual attraction doesn't work the way that people might think it would, but I guess that's from a cis point of view. I'm not sure I'd put you in the 'Lesbian' category myself, but I certainly can't blame you for being attracted to females. They are the 'fairer' sex for more reasons than just physical (they're definitely more accepting). Maybe cis alpha males are just such assholes that only 'submissive' types are attracted to them. I'm personally attracted to the female body, but not the stereotypical female mind. Probably for the same reason that I prefer cats to dogs...
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    Dunno about others, but I prefer my men feminine and my women masculine. So whenever they are trans men, trans women or anything inbetween hardly matters to me. Does that make me a chaser? :wink:
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,371
    Dunno about others, but I prefer my men feminine and my women masculine. So whenever they are trans men, trans women or anything inbetween hardly matters to me. Does that make me a chaser? :wink:

    I prefer both to be more masculine. Does that make me gay? I think I just like people to be confident, which seems to more rare in females...
  • ArviaArvia Member Posts: 2,101
    Dunno about others, but I prefer my men feminine and my women masculine. So whenever they are trans men, trans women or anything inbetween hardly matters to me. Does that make me a chaser? :wink:

    I thought you were an ooze? Or was it a slime? That means "anything goes", you set your own standards! ;)

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  • ArdanisArdanis Member Posts: 1,736
    edited October 2019
    semiticgod wrote: »
    It's precisely because it's a low-effort thing that makes it significant. If you ask someone to lift a finger and they can't even do that, you can't trust them to do anything.
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Somone is simply asking you to make the ATTMPT to use a three letter word instead of a two letter one. If that is difficult for you, you might have a problem.
    Gotta disagree here, it's precisely the low-effort habits that are among the hardest to change.
    How many people want to quit smoking, but can't? Like, what could be possibly easier than such a simple thing as not lifting a finger to light up a cigarette. Yet many struggle with it for years, even despite the fact they wanna do it not for somebody else's benefit but for their very own.

    So, there is nothing wrong with asking to make an attempt. What I do see wrong is when our left-wing friends think that people unwilling to spare the effort (not so small one, as I illustrated just above) for reasons they do not even understand (I continue to not understand) are untrustworthy, or have a problem, or are outright malicious. One of the common arguments against the "hetero white male privilege" that I heard was "even if it's not a problem for you, it's still a problem for others". Well, it goes both ways.
    chimaera wrote: »
    Often people would assume that I was male if I've used a neutral nickname. By comparison, this wouldn't happen on a Polish forum, because in Polish language the verbs are conjugated dependent on the gender of the speaker.
    This is one of things I like about English actually, it's genderless.
  • ArviaArvia Member Posts: 2,101
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Dunno about others, but I prefer my men feminine and my women masculine. So whenever they are trans men, trans women or anything inbetween hardly matters to me. Does that make me a chaser? :wink:

    I prefer both to be more masculine. Does that make me gay? I think I just like people to be confident, which seems to more rare in females...

    And isn't that a pity, that we consider self-confidence a masculine trait?
    That's one of the things I meant in my long rant about gender. We have been educated in a certain role and culturally primed to fulfill a certain role, but does that make those traits inherently masculine or feminine?
    I'm not saying men and women are the same, and there are obviously biological differences on a physical and psychological level, because most of our brains are just biochemistry, but it's hard to say which part of our behavior is genetic, and what is learned.

    @Balrog99 , just to make this clear, I'm not attacking your position or anything. I'm just wondering what's going wrong that confidence is considered a masculine trait.

    I like confident people, too, but there's a fine line between a calm confidence and the arrogance of an alpha gorilla. That's about the least attractive trait in a person, for me. I'm considered

    Out of scientific curiosity, I would like to hear what people here consider typical feminine and typical masculine behavior and attitudes, depending on their cultural background. But it would be impossible to measure, and besides, people are influenced by a lot more than their cultural background. Still, it would be so interesting to find out what depends on nature and what on education and examples in your family.
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235
    edited October 2019
    I have no idea what would be considered strandard masculine or feminine traits. I've had far more female friends over the years than male, my best male friend and I were so close that everyone thought we were romantically involved, this persisted for both of us until we found our wives, my ex used to say that dating me was like dating another woman, and my wife and I always laugh at those meme "Wives do this, but husbands do that" posts (We have the exact opposite dynamic).
    When people mention gender sterotypes, the only exaples I can think are hypereaggerated. Like He-Man, Barbie, and the Old Spice guy (Terry Crews or theone before him, both work). Even then, I've never known anyone remotely like a "barbie", as most of my experience with women has been varrying degrees of what people call "tomboys".
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    semiticgod wrote: »
    @Balrog99: Women. Though things have been feeling a lot less binary than they used to, so...

    Anyway, most trans folks are straight. So you'd switch from gay male to straight female or lesbian to straight male. In my case, I'm switching from straight male to (mostly?) lesbian.

    I'm actually lucky to be gay in this case. I think dating is easier for gay trans women than straight ones. Men tend to be a lot less forgiving of women without the standard body shape and especially the right set of junk; women don't mind the physical aspect as much.

    There is a certain kind of guy that specifically is attracted to trans women, crossdressers, and hermaphrodites. They're called "chasers," but trans women kinda have a love/hate relationship with them. It's great to have a group of men that are very much attracted to you, of course, but if they're only around because of a fetish and they don't want a real relationship and they view you as a sex object... well, that's not what most women want out of a relationship, trans or no. It doesn't help that part of the reason they're attracted to you in the first place is because they view you as different from most women, and that can be an unpleasant reminder.

    Most trans folks end up with other trans folks... which I've been thinking is really not that bad. Trans people have a habit of being very strange, interesting, artsy, kinky, and cuddly people, and that checks a lot of important boxes.

    I kind of thought that might be the case but I'm not sure why (intuition, perhaps?). It's strange that the sexual attraction doesn't work the way that people might think it would, but I guess that's from a cis point of view. I'm not sure I'd put you in the 'Lesbian' category myself, but I certainly can't blame you for being attracted to females. They are the 'fairer' sex for more reasons than just physical (they're definitely more accepting). Maybe cis alpha males are just such assholes that only 'submissive' types are attracted to them. I'm personally attracted to the female body, but not the stereotypical female mind. Probably for the same reason that I prefer cats to dogs...
    I feel compelled to speak out in defense of cis dudes, just to be clear. Cis males do have a harder time accepting trans folks, but the majority of them aren't jerks. It goes without saying, but it's still worth repeating. This forum and this thread are majority cis and male, but that hasn't prevented a whole bunch of people from being incredibly supportive and sensitive, and I appreciate it.

    @Arvia: Maybe you are a teensy bit trans! Not every trans person needs to suffer from crippling lifelong dysphoria to qualify, and not everyone needs to switch from one to the other. The "trans" prefix can mean "transcending" rather than just "transitioning," and there are plenty of people who fall in between: nonbinary (also called NB or the cute form, "enby") folks, intergender, and genderqueer people don't fit into the two "standard" genders, and many use gender-neutral pronouns like "they/them."

    There are some other, newly-coined pronouns like "ze/zem/hir" and even some fancy ones like the fairy-themed "fey/fem/fir," which are interesting and sometimes cute but very unfamiliar and not commonly used. "They/them" is the most common gender-neutral set of pronouns.

    A friend of mine likes to point out that the singular, gender-neutral "they" predates the singular, gender-neutral "you" by 400 years. It dates back to Chaucer! It actually has a very longstanding precedent for referring to a single person.

    There are some folks who do think people need to suffer from crippling lifelong dysphoria to qualify as trans, but they're the minority. Some trans folks call them "truscum" for not being fully inclusionary. It's an insult, but some "truscum" people use the term to refer to themselves. I still wouldn't encourage its use, though, just for friendliness' sake. The majority opinion seems to be that you can be trans even if you don't have dysphoria. Being gender-conforming or even just transitioning to get gender euphoria, the counterpart to dysphoria, brings you under the trans umbrella.
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235
    What does "cis" mean? I keep seeing it thrown around everywhere.
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235
    Well huh. That's kinda neat.
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    Yeah, if you just said "normal" that would imply that trans people were abnormal. Same reason we say straight for people who aren't gay.
  • ArviaArvia Member Posts: 2,101
    semiticgod wrote: »
    @ThacoBell It refers to people who aren't trans. It's a chemistry pun, cis and trans being different isomers of chemicals with the same formula and bonds, but who have different configurations.

    Cis molecules are the standard ones that chemists and drug producers try to create, while trans molecules are the unintended variants that are generally ineffective or toxic. So, the term isn't entirely generous to trans folks, but I do think that it's a cute pun.

    I think our chemistry guy @Balrog99 can explain that better, but I don't think that trans isomers are generally toxic or ineffective. They're just the same molecules with a slightly different geometry and therefore different properties. Sometimes it's only the boiling point that's different.

    However, it's true that there are certain drugs where the cis isomer is more effective and with less side effects than the trans isomer.

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